Under carbonated beer

[technobabble66]

Hi
Quick check with some more experienced brewers over a little problem i'm having:

I brewed an extract & grain fat yak style beer with WL Kolsch yeast a few months ago. Because i went overseas for a few weeks & life got in the way, the beer stayed in the fermenter for 6 weeks. It looked like crystal clear amber liquid by the time it went into the bottle.
However it's now been in the bottle for just under 8 weeks and barely has any carbonation :angry: It's slightly, slightly more carb'ed than it had after 4 weeks in the bottle, but is still really poor considering my other brews have been almost fully carbed within 1 week in the bottle.
So i assume either too much yeast has dropped out (there's now a tiny bit of yeast sediment on the bottom) and/or the lazy buggers have dozed off too early to finish their job. <_<

Now i don't really need to drink this until xmas, so it's got another 7 weeks in the bottle, but i'm gonna be really annoyed if i front with flat beer on xmas day.

So the question is what should i do with this brew? Do i just leave it, and it should be fine? Do i roll/lightly shake the bottles & then leave it? Or do i need to open all the bottles & stick more yeast in? In which case, can i use any yeast, such as the crap yeast from my Black Rock tins, or should i use US05/BRY97/Notto? And do i need to put any extra sugar in there (i assume not).

I've done some googling and seem to find nothing particularly definitive.

Other than the carbonation problem, the beer tastes amazingly good (as much as i can tell for semi-flat beer - the NS/Cascade have blended surprisingly smoothly with the malts i've used :icon_drool2: ), so i'm very keen to get this sorted and enjoy a tasty drop for xmas.

Or is it just screwed & i re-label it as a low carb'ed English Bitter..?

Help/advice is most appreciated
Thanks!

 

[technobabble66]

Apparently I have the same problem with my stout from the brew day at the July case swap.

Sad face.

 

[Cocko]

Where and what temp were the bottles stored at?

It could be as simple as they were stored somewhere that was not up for secondary fermentation? - yes, secondary is carbonation.

EDIT: It may be as simple as swirling them and storing them in a warmer place for a couple of weeks.

2c.

 

[technobabble66]

Thanks Cocko,

You seem like a fine upstanding gentleman, and I don't believe a word Yob says about you.

Both fermenters and all bottles were at room temperature in boxes in cupboards over the previous 3 months. So probably between 16-19*C most of the time.

I might give the lazy firetruckers a delicate roll & shake & hope for the best. I'm just concerned as to whether I need to add more yeast to them.

 

[TSMill]

Really dumb question, but are you sure you added priming sugar?

 

[philmud]

Or enough priming sugar. I'm not really an experienced brewer, but I AM an experienced worrier about carbonation. I reckon the following bits of information might help eliminate a few usual suspects:
- What was the warmest temperature your beer reached following fermentation?
- how much priming sugar did you use?
- what temperature have your bottles been stored at since then?


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[Pokey]

I'd shake them all and find somewhere warmer to store them for a week or 2.
As a back up for Christmas make another batch

 

[pjsyrax]

I had a similar problem with a cream ale I made in May. Turns out when I was following the recipie I converted a cup measurement into grams for the DME I was priming with and got it wrong

As my problem was not enough sugar, I took 2 bottles out, Uncapped them, added 1/8 teaspoon dextrose to one and 1/4 teaspoon dextrose to other. Tried them both a week later and then decided to go with the 1/4 teaspoon measurement.

Did all the remaining bottles and then turned out perfectly... I did also swirl the yeast a little bit.

And you gotta be very quick as you'll only have a few seconds to re cap them before they bubble over from the dextrose addition

Anyway, worked for me. Good luck

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[manticle]

Could be yeast. Rehydrate a touch of 05 or 97 as per manufacturer's instructions, open up one or two bottles of each, add, recap, store and check next week. If they have higher carb than the rest of the batch, you have your issue.

Are they all tasting a bit sweet?

 

[technobabble66]

Thanks guys!

The priming sugar was definitely added to all bottles, & was the same amount I've used for all other batches (successfully).

Same with the temperature stuff. The FVs probably hit 21*C at some point (ie:half a day in the first 4 days), but generally stayed around 19*C.

Yes the beers probably taste a little sweet.
If I add some 05 or 97, do I need to hydrate as you suggest or could I just sprinkle a little of the powder in?

Fwiw, I've just tried my had at reusing some BRY-97 last night while bottling. Is it worth using a sterile teaspoon to put a little of that into a few bottles?

 

[philmud]

For the minimal cost of dry yeast, I would be inclined to use a fresh pack. Less avenue for infection.


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[wbosher]

I've heard of people putting one or two little granules of dried yeast into each bottle for this purpose. Not sure if it worked or not.

Maybe try manticle's suggestion in a few bottles first to see if that is actually the problem.

 

[technobabble66]

Quick update:
Got out all the bottles of the 2 affected batches last week & shook them up a bit, to stir the yeast back into suspension.
Yesterday I thought, what the hell, I'll open a couple & put a few grains of dried yeast in then reseal.
While doing this, there seemed to be a bit more "pssst" than before when opening the caps. So I put a few into the fridge & cracked one tonight.
Muuuuuch better carbonation!! Woo-fkn-hoo!
Still a bit low, but definitely closer to where it should be. I'll try another in a week, but it looks like a quick shake may've been enough.
I'm pleasantly surprised! Never thought the yeast would come out of suspension without doing their job properly. Hopefully all of them have similarly carbed up.

 

[wbosher]

The word "patience" get thrown around here a lot...

 

[technobabble66]

Haha. True story!

I thought I'd been super patient for the first stage - waiting something like 7 weeks for them to carb up.
Surely that fills my patience quota; & I can expect everything else to happen instantly!

 

[wbosher]

Yeah, I guess 7 weeks is the definition of patience. Most of my beers are long gone by then.

 

[Pedro6]

Hi all

Just read this thread and searched others for my problem which is a little bit different.

When I bottled my stout back in April, (only 2nd brew ever), I did not tighten screw tops enough so it is quite flat with only a very small hiss when opening. Taste is ok but should be better obviously.

I have tightened all tops now and wondering should I add another drop to carbonate again or just use this batch for cooking?

Still learning and this site is invaluable.

 

[wbosher]

I guess is there is still enough yeast to eat the sugar it might work. If not it will just be flat and sickly sweet.

Why not try with one bottle and see what happens?

EDIT: Just re-read your post. Missed the "back in April" bit...unlikely a lot of yeast will still be alive after that time. Still can't hurt to try with one bottle in a warm place, maybe put one little granule of dried yeast in the bottle also if that fails.

 

[technobabble66]

My advice after my experience (nb: only been brewing 14mo's) is to re-carb as per normal (eg: one drop in stubbies, 2 drops in longnecks), re-cap, shake to get all the yeast off the bottom (eg: inverted) & put back in the cupboard.
Every 5 days or so re-shake them. After 3 weeks try one. It'll either be carbing nicely or sweet & flat. Might take up to 6 weeks to fully carb, after what happened to mine, but it got there eventually.

My 2c

 

[technobabble66]

Btw, I'm assuming it should be safe to re carb fully as the previous effort should've fermented out completely.