Un-bottle Conditioning

[deanelliott]

I was wondering if anyone could let me know what the options are for carbonation. I've only used the Coopers carbonation drops, and l know about Bulk Priming. Are there other options? How do the larger breweries get their carbonation if they dont bottle condition?

Stealth.

 

[PostModern]

The big breweries force carbonate in the conditioning tanks then drop the beer into the bottles already fizzy using counter-pressure bottle fillers. For the homebrewer, it is pretty much accepted that bulk priming is the way to go, although of course many people do other things.

 

[DrewCarey82]

I am about to do my first and probably last bulk priming.

Do you have the sugar scoop?

Takes about 5 mins to do 30 longnecks or 10 to do 60 stubbies.

 

[PostModern]

I don't want to get into the bulk-priming vs scoop-o-white-powder-in-the-bottle debate, but let me list a major advantage of bulk-prining - consistency and predicability.

With the scoop, how do you get exactly the same carbonation in a 330ml, 375ml, 500ml, 640ml, 750ml, 800ml or 1.5l bottle? The scoop has 2 sizes but there are more than 2 bottle sizes in the world.

Bulk priming allows you to add x grams of priming fermentable per litre of beer which can then go into any size or any combination of sizes of bottles and give you very consistent levels of carbonation. You can also adjust quite easily the carbonation for different styles of beers. With the bottle prime method, you have one level of carbonation across all styles (assuming your bottles are all identical in capacity), which may suit some, but certainly does not please all of us.

It is an easy technique, well worth the learning.

 

[goatherder]

I totally agree with your arguments PoMo, but what if you don't secondary?

I bottle my ales directly from the primary fermenter. If I was to bulk prime, I would have to stir up my beer to ensure the sugar was properly mixed and end up bottling a bunch of yeast and junk.

I've got a way around it, kind of a hybrid of the two methods, using a dextrose in water solution:

1: Using beersmith (or any one of the other carbonation calculators), get the grams per litre figure for the style i'm looking for, factoring in bottling temperature. For example, my last brew said 1.7gm of dextrose per litre of beer.

2: I've got a 10ml syringe, so I want to use a full one for a tallie and a half for a stubbie just to make it easy. If a stubby is 375ml or 350ml, don't worry, close enough.

3: Do a bit of arithmetic and work out how many bottles you need to do. For example, my last brew, I estimated 7 tallies and 50 stubbies, which works out to approx 23 litres of beer. Sounds about right.

4: For 7 tallies and 50 stubbies, using 10ml per tallie and 5ml per stubbie, I need a grand total of 7 x 10 + 5 x 50 = 320ml of priming solution.

5: Using my 1.7g/litre figure in my 23l of beer, I need 39g of dextrose. Therefore, I need to make up my priming solution of 39g of dextrose into 320ml of water. Put in a stuffup factor and make 50% more, cause dex is cheap and I'll probably spill some. Therefore I put 60g of dex in 480ml of water.

6: When it comes to bottling, simply put a full 10ml syringe of solution in a tally and a half (5ml) into a stubbie to get the right amounts.

This way we get fairly precise carbonations without stirring up our yeast cake. Best of both worlds I reckon.

The calcs could probably be simplified a bit too. Maybe another day.

 

[Stuster]

I almost never secondary, but do bulk prime. If you don't want to buy a second fermenter, just use a cheap jerry can or even just a cheap food grade bucket. Your way is a good work round, but sounds like a lot of trouble to me.

In fact, I really recommend getting a second fermenter. It's just a lot quicker IMO. When bottling, I put some iodophor solution into the fermenter. Soak as many bottles as possible in it, then drain them. It usually takes two/three lots to do all the bottles. Line all the bottles up, pour the iodophor into the sink for any extra sanitising. Let the fermenter drain. Bulk prime in that fermenter, racking from the primary. Fill all bottles using a racking hose. Cap all bottles. Rest with a beer. :chug:

 

[PostModern]

I totally agree with your arguments PoMo, but what if you don't secondary?

I sometimes rack straight from primary to the bottling bucket. Yes, bulk priming requires an extra bucket/fermenter or gerry can. The extra equipment is worth the cost.

Your stock solution method is pretty good, but it still involves one measurement for every bottle. I generally prime at about 7g per litre, so put about 140g of dextrose (only mearurement) in as little water as it will dissolve in, boil, chill, pour into sanitised bottling bucket. I then rack the beer into it, gently stir with a sanitsed spoon then lift the bucket onto the bench and bottle with a cane on the of a metre or so of racking hose. Could not be much easier.

 

[warrenlw63]

2: I've got a 10ml syringe, so I want to use a full one for a tallie and a half for a stubbie just to make it easy. If a stubby is 375ml or 350ml, don't worry, close enough.

I use the syringe method on the odd occasion because I'm a kegger and only want to fill a bottle or two. It's actually got the added benefit of allowing you to add the sugar/water solution after the bottle's filled. Takes away a bit of the displacement/headspace created by those overly thick bottling wands.

Would be a bit of mucking around doing 2 dozen or so longnecks this way though.

Warren -

 

[goatherder]

Fair enough. My point of not using a secondary (or bottling bucket) is to eliminate the risk of contamination during transfer rather than avoiding a 2nd container. Once I start doing lagers, I reckon i'll be using your method.

 

[Steve Lacey]

My point of not using a secondary (or bottling bucket) is to eliminate the risk of contamination during transfer rather than avoiding a 2nd container. Once I start doing lagers, I reckon i'll be using your method.

I have, on a number of occasions, successfully bulk primed directly into the primary fermenter. I gently stir in the dissolved priming sugar and let the bucket sit for ten minutes or so before bottling. This lets the sugar redistribute evenly and allows some of the stirred up yeast to settle out. Think about it. The yeast cake is packed down pretty tight so you are not going to stir up much. At worst you will end up with an imperceptibly larger amount of yeast in the sediment in the bottom of your bottles.

Throw the bottling buckets out with the wort chiller, I say.

 

[Stuster]

Throw the bottling buckets out with the wort chiller, I say.

Recent research has shown that it'll end in tears.

 

[goatherder]

Throw the bottling buckets out with the wort chiller, I say.

This looks dangerous, next you'll be telling us that AG is better than K&K!

 

[colinw]

After starting brewing, my progression went:

- little red doubled ended scoop thing that came with my kit setup, then
- bulk priming by stirring sugar into the primary (like my dad does), then
- bulk priming with dextrose in a bottling bucket.

But now I'm a kegger and the handful of bottles I do just use caster sugar with the scoop, except I've more than halved my priming rate and use the stubby scoop about 3/4 full for 750ml tallies, and about 1/3 full for stubbies.

This provides enough fizz for my taste.

I'm seriously considering bottling my English styles with no priming at all, and just let them take care of themselves. My "BPA" bitter definitely deosn't need much fizz, I prefer it still and don't care if it has any head.

Oh, and don't mention the war!