Super Hard Water In London

[wimbymoonshine]

Hey all,

recently i've been reading about water quality and how many styles are representative of the chemistry of the local water supply.

I live in london and the water here is SUPER hard.... i.e. the quantity of dissolved carbonates is greater than 270mg/L. The water is so rich in dissolved salts and carbonates that I cant sanitise anything by boiling it as it will form a 'lime-scale' all over the article in the boiler. Obviously kettles dont last a long time here and need regular descaling.

Im currently brewing kits and extract recipes. Just recently as the temperature has dropped i've put on a czech pilsner and it appears that the water quality is totally wrong for this. How will this pilsner be affected by the hard water?

With such hard water, is brewing anything worthwhile? What sort of flavours result from using hard water?

cheers

p.s. if anyone is big into water chemistry/analysis the water quality analysis for my local supply is here

View attachment 2006_WQ_report_Z0121_Merton.pdf

 

[geoffi]

Plenty of fine beers come from areas with very hard water. IPA etc.

Dortmund has very hard water I believe. So call your Czech Pilsner a Dortmunder and enjoy :beer: .

 

[///]

affects bitterness / malt perception as well as yeast health and behaviour for starters.

the technical books like Kunze and Briggs give a good overview.

would not brew without water salts...

Scotty

 

[Sammus]

not really on topic but I was thinking about this today as I'm about to brew an english bitter. so I was checking out the burton water profile recently. We have super soft water here in the illawarra, and to get anywhere close to burton it wanted me to add about 30g of salts to 25L of brewing water! - and thats was still under!

 

[Cortez The Killer]

You can't shy away from gypsum in the gong for a good beer

Cheers

 

[///]

Find burton level salting too high, particuarly on the magnesium. Has a less than ideal affect on the guts.

But, we 'Sheffeild' our water ... and that is the only secret I am sworn to keep otherwise I will die a thousand deaths ....

Scotty

 

[Cortez The Killer]

I feel a joke from "The Nanny" coming on

 

[tangent]

there's jokes in "the Nanny"?

I find excessive beer stone in the kettle after using additives, especially gypsum. Should I be adding them at flameout instead?

 

[wimbymoonshine]

I feel a joke from "The Nanny" coming on

Gentlemen, PLEASE!

anyway... so what is the recommendation? its too expensive to buy distilled water so please dont suggest that

cheers

 

[Gulf Brewery]

Gentlemen, PLEASE!

anyway... so what is the recommendation? its too expensive to buy distilled water so please dont suggest that

cheers

Hi wimbymoonshine

You could use some distilled / RO water and mix it 1/2 and 1/2 with tap water.

Cheers
Pedro

 

[drsmurto]

Or use rainwater in place of RO/distilled water since the levels of trace metals, carbonate, chloride and sulphate are within a ppm or 2.

Apart from the 6ppm of Na, i have less than 1ppm of the ions we are interested in for brewing in my rain water. And it falls from the sky........

 

[Cortez The Killer]

I find excessive beer stone in the kettle after using additives, especially gypsum. Should I be adding them at flameout instead?

Salt additions usually have 2 effects

Firstly they adjust the mashing ph - so that you get a better extraction

Secondly they change the manner in which the beer is percieved - eg increased or decreased bitterness

If you are interested Palmer has a good chapter on it and you can get you local water report and compare it to the various waters from the big brewing cities

Luckily the water in the Illawarra is extremely soft so with the right salt additions most styles can be brewed

I'd be inclined to say that the additions should be made in the mash to adjust ph and then if you want to enhance a particular quality in the beer - then make an addition at flame out

Water chemistry is pretty interesting

Cheers

Edit: Make grammer more gooder

 

[wimbymoonshine]

Hi wimbymoonshine

You could use some distilled / RO water and mix it 1/2 and 1/2 with tap water.

Cheers
Pedro

Thanks Pedro....

Does anyone know a way to precipitate carbonates etc out of solution from which the water can be decanted off?

Also, what flavour effects will too 'hard' water have on beers?

 

[Brewtus]

Can you buy a really big Brita or at least Brita the water you need to boil? May put 1/2 the water though a Brita if you can.

I lived in London for 3 yr and put all the water through a Brita before it went in the kettle and it cut the fur by 95%. Your kids don't need milk if they drink straight London tap water but they do need fluoride.

http://www.brita.co.uk (I have no interest in the co.)

 

[KGB]

Whats a 10 or 15L container of water worth from Morrison's? Surely not more than a few squid?

I hated London tap water, give me fluoride any day

 

[Gulf Brewery]

Thanks Pedro....

Does anyone know a way to precipitate carbonates etc out of solution from which the water can be decanted off?

Also, what flavour effects will too 'hard' water have on beers?

Hi wimbymoonshine

I don't think you will be able to precipate the carbonates out easily, but you can filter them out a bit. It will depend on how good a filter you have whether you will reduce them enough for what you

Have a look here on hbd. There is a reasonable primer on water chemistry there.

Cheers
Pedro

 

[Brewtus]

I hated London tap water, give me fluoride any day

Never said I liked it, my kids drank milk, used fluoride toothpaste, and drank filtered (Brita) water.

Also none of us mind or really notice the taste of fluoride in the Canberra water we drink now.

 

[wimbymoonshine]

thanks lads.... A reusable brita it is rather than constantly lugging litres of water from morrissons. KGB, my man, you forget about the no car issue that most common londoners face. I already haev an old man trolley for my shopping... i refuse to use my chav, fake burbery trolley to cart brew water....

I think i may perhaps press some bbq charcoal and make my own filter to mass filter water.... WATCH THIS SPACE!