Starting Wyeast

[Sammus]

still no krausen, the starter is starting to separate a bit with a clearish layer on top, murky layer in the middle and dark brown crap on the bottom of the flask

i havent done a lot of starters and dont know whether or not i should tip this down the sink or just leave it for a few more days

Wait a little longer I reackon. Pour off a tiny bit of the clearish layer (1/2 shot?) have a smell and taste. It won't taste great, since most starter worts we make are unhopped etc, but you should be able to tell if it tastes yeasty (good) or like some other crap (vinegar or chemically or something). If it tastes sweet then it hasn't fermented yet, if it's not so sweet, it has fermented.

Often you wont see the krausen on a starter, it can be over in a very short period of time and doesn't leave much of a sign it was there.

 

[cdbrown]

at the moment i have a starter i made on friday night using a 12 month old pack of 1338 and a 100g/1l starter

when i opened the smack pack i thought i might have detected a whiff of vegemite (autolysis)

so far the starter doenst appear to have fired, no krausen at all. should i leave it for a few more days or just get my hands on a fresh yeast?

Did the smack pack swell up before pouring into the starter wort?

 

[Bubba Q]

the smack pack puffed up slightly but not to the extent where it felt like it was about to explode

seems like there is now a fine layer of whitish stuff above the layer of brown crud at the bottom of the flask, will have a taste tonight and see if its ok to pitch

 

[Interloper]

seems like there is now a fine layer of whitish stuff above the layer of brown crud at the bottom of the flask, will have a taste tonight and see if its ok to pitch

Well that sounds like a viable yeast cake. Keep shaking the bottle to agitate it and put it back into suspension. It will help it carb up and get to work producing more yeast and eating the malt.

 

[manticle]

To avoid starting a new thread just for one question - can anyone advise whether it's worth using a liquid for a strong stout or whether I just go for a good dried one?

My understanding is that most character will come from the malt, with low esters, dicaetyl etc and I don't want to spend the $15 odd dollars on something designed to give me less rather than more. I've only used one wyeast so far but the character that it gave is obvious and desirable (3787 for a Dubbel).

Cheers.

 

[Bubba Q]

bugger, my starter is still very very sweet

 

[Stuster]

To avoid starting a new thread just for one question - can anyone advise whether it's worth using a liquid for a strong stout or whether I just go for a good dried one?

I think S-04 would be fine for a stout. As you say, the yeast are not the game breaker with this kind of beer, with the roasted malts being the major contributors. But if it is a strong stout make sure that you pitch enough yeast.

 

[manticle]

I think S-04 would be fine for a stout. As you say, the yeast are not the game breaker with this kind of beer, with the roasted malts being the major contributors. But if it is a strong stout make sure that you pitch enough yeast.

Cheers

 

[3GumsBrewing]

Ready for a silly question? (you would think after 5 years on AHB i would know this! )
I have always used Wyeast and followed the method below fairly closely, I am getting a few new liquid yeasts from Gryphon shortly. I don't have to vary the method right? Does it matter that the yeast is not *started* i.e smacked beforehand? -

1. Take smackpack out of fridge to warm
2. Gave it a good smack and then a shake
3. Following evening boil up 300g LDME in 3L water 20mins and then cool
4. Poured the lot into a 5L sterilized Demijohn
5. Poured the smackpack in, shake container.
6. Pour of 1L off into a 2L container (to be used as a starter the following evening)
7. Put both in ferment fridge
8. Next evening shake up the 2L container and pitch into new brew
6. Leave the Demijohn for 48 hours, swirl occasionaly. Wait till krausen dies down.
10. Once the Demijohn container has finished fermenting, shake and split into sample jars (bought from the chemist)
11. Cap and store in fridge until needed (at which time make a 2L starter from the sample jar)

Cheers
DK

 

[Pennywise]

You don't HAVE to smack the pack, doing so just releases nutrients and sort off "proofs" it. IMO it's better to, but it's no biggie. I would aslo prefer that when I bought the pack it wasn't pre-smacked. Your above method looks pretty good to me.

 

[GTS350]

Nice Summary DK , can I get a few temperatures from you though?

- steps 7 to 9: what temp is your ferment fridge at when you store the 2l starter and demijohn (with 3l left in it)?

- step 10: how big are your sample jars? 300ml ? (to make a starter for a 23l brew?)

- step 11: what temp do you store these sample jars? (is it colder for a lager, warmer for a stout?, or no difference)

Thanks very muchly for posting your processes, Im about to cultivate some Wyeast 2112 California Lager, and its bold new territory - I feel like I have no idea what Im doing. heh heh.
Cheers n Beers..

 

[3GumsBrewing]

Nice Summary DK , can I get a few temperatures from you though?

- steps 7 to 9: what temp is your ferment fridge at when you store the 2l starter and demijohn (with 3l left in it)?

- step 10: how big are your sample jars? 300ml ? (to make a starter for a 23l brew?)

- step 11: what temp do you store these sample jars? (is it colder for a lager, warmer for a stout?, or no difference)

Thanks very muchly for posting your processes, Im about to cultivate some Wyeast 2112 California Lager, and its bold new territory - I feel like I have no idea what Im doing. heh heh.
Cheers n Beers..

Hi GTS350,

1. The ferment fridge (actually a chest freezer with a FridgeMate) is set to 19 deg.
2. My sample jars are 70ml, when brewing a new beer i just take one out and build a 2L starter out of it. Its a great way to store yeast (they stack well, you can write legibly on them) and it means I almost never run out!
3. The yeasts are stored in the beer fridge which is about 3-5 deg. No difference for ale or lager.

Cheers
DK

 

[drew9242]

I know digging up an old thread.

But i would like to say thanks to Batz for all his hard work in making these instructions. And to every one else who added some info in this great thread. I have used the thread to make 6 bottles of Pro Culture Kolsch yeast. And have now used two of these for Kolsch and an Altbier. I have only just bottled the Kolsch, so haven't tasted it quite yet. And the Altbier is still in the fermentor. But i am looking forward to giving them a try soon.

Any way liquid yeast are quite easy, so i'll definently be using them from now on.

Thanks again

 

[bum]

Hello, long thread from ages ago! Nice to see you.

Thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread - I reckon I've got a pretty good handle on the process now but, as has been pointed out already, the pics have been deleted from Batz's OP - anyone got a link to good pics of the process (or another thread here, even (obviously)). I'd feel a bit more confident if I could get a visual confirmation that what I'm imagining looks right.

 

[big78sam]

Split the smacky between two 2.5 litre containers

Poured the room temp malt solution between the two containers.

I proceeded to shake it every time I went past it.

24 hours later there was a nice little yeast cake at the bottom of each bottle and it was carbing up nicely.

Now every time I shook it I had to release some pressure.

48 hours later I pitched one bottle into a brew, and then split the other bottle in two, and I'll just repeat this process next time I want some Belgian Abbey Ale yeast.

A question here. I've read a number of times that once the yeast is in the fermenter and working it's magic that it's OK to rouse the yeast but not to get too much oxygen in it. You want the oxygen to be present and the wort aerated at pitching but once the yeast has started it's a no no. IIRC leads to oxydization (but I'm a bit vague here).

Basically what you are doing when doing a starter is a mini brew. I would have thought the same principles apply and that shaking the bottle to aerate would be bad. Any comments?

 

[Batz]

I know digging up an old thread.

But i would like to say thanks to Batz for all his hard work in making these instructions. And to every one else who added some info in this great thread. I have used the thread to make 6 bottles of Pro Culture Kolsch yeast. And have now used two of these for Kolsch and an Altbier. I have only just bottled the Kolsch, so haven't tasted it quite yet. And the Altbier is still in the fermentor. But i am looking forward to giving them a try soon.

Any way liquid yeast are quite easy, so i'll definently be using them from now on.

Thanks again

Thank you Drew,
Unfortunately all the pictures I had with each post have since disappeared, a problem that occurred on AHB quite a few years ago.
Time it was updated by myself of somebody else I suppose. It is nice to see the likes before a stir plate, you really don't need one.

Batz

 

[dicko]

Thank you Drew,
Unfortunately all the pictures I had with each post have since disappeared, a problem that occurred on AHB quite a few years ago.
Time it was updated by myself of somebody else I suppose. It is nice to see the likes before a stir plate, you really don't need one.

Batz

Those were the days Batz, when yeast packs were a lot smaller, There was no stir plates and the biggest thing on AHB was a Skunk Fart Pale Ale and we all waited with baited breath (not alcohol) for the next post (episode) :lol: and when members posted to find the real facts and not just to add to their post tally :lol: ooh!! I wish !!
OH! Well !
"Those were the days my friend We thought they'd never end :lol: "


Cheers

 

[Dazza_devil]

A question here. I've read a number of times that once the yeast is in the fermenter and working it's magic that it's OK to rouse the yeast but not to get too much oxygen in it. You want the oxygen to be present and the wort aerated at pitching but once the yeast has started it's a no no. IIRC leads to oxydization (but I'm a bit vague here).

Basically what you are doing when doing a starter is a mini brew. I would have thought the same principles apply and that shaking the bottle to aerate would be bad. Any comments?

I'm hoping that aeration of the starter is not a big deal and is only going to affect the beer that it's made and not the quality of the yeast. It didn't seem to worry my brew using my Coopers culture but I didn't swirl her up to get samples and aerate any samples putting them into stubbies with that one.
I've just bottled 3 stubbies off my 3 litre wyeast starter and they got a fair amount of aeration going into the stubbie. I also gave the starter a fair rousing (swirl wise) before, during and after fermentation. The thing smells delicious but I will be decanting any fermented wort from my starter and giving it a feed of wort 2 or 3 hours before pitching.
It will be going into an oxidised wort after all so hopefully all will be good after fermentation of my brew as far as the prior oxidation of the starter goes.
Any microbiologists may be able to chime in and put me right with the effect of aeration on the yeast after fermentation.

Also, after swirling up the fermented 3 litre starter and filling 3 stubbies with a funnel I never bothered putting anything in for carbonation. I figured this wouldn't be a problem because I know some people store their yeasts with just distilled water. I understand that the CO2 can blanket the sample protecting it but I didn't want to feed the beast any dextrose or stuff around priming them. Any thoughts on this?

The remainder of my starter is now chilling to 1.5 degrees C. A couple of days and I'll decant the beer off, warm to pitching temp and hopefully Bob's me uncle.

 

[big78sam]

First boil 1.5 lt of water with 1/3 cup dry malt extract , place in freezer and allow to cool

Is it just me or is this nowhere near enough DME? I can't remember exactly but last night 1/3 cup was about 40 grams on my scales. According to beersmith this gives an SG of around 1010. I thought 1030 to 1040 was more the aim, depending on the OG of your brew. The figure bandied around is about 100g per 1 litre. Am I looking at this wrong?

 

[barneyb]

Tried my hand at cultivating a cider yeast (WLP775 English Cider Yeast) half using instructions here and half of what my LHBS suggested. I got a bottle of apple juice, emptied out a bit and threw the yeast in, shook the crapola out of it, covered it with cling wrap and let it do its thing.

I definitely got a bit of a "fermenting" smell, there were little bubbles forming on the top of the liquid and the glad wrap was being pushed up so I knew we had action.

After 2 days I noticed the remnants of a krausen a little bit above the water line so took that as a sign that it had done its thing. Now I split it between 4 stubbies, however even though I gently turned the juice bottle around to get the solid stuff moving through the liquid, most of the solid stuff stayed at the bottom of the bottle which I used for my first brew, leaving mostly just the suspended yeast in the other stubbies. Will this still be enough to use in future brews? Will it require the use of a good starter before using the extra ones?