Single Vessel Questions

[woodwormm]

Ok I know I'll probably get bagged (pun intended) but let me preface by saying I have used the search and the google options and I have trawled through plenty of threads but I'm a bit confuddled.

In regards to Single Vessel Recirculating BIAB, I've got a few newbie, most likely dumb questions.

Do you recirculate during the mash period?
Do you need to insulate the pot during mash? Or is it circulating and element cycling with a thermostat to maintain mash temp?
Where is the best position for the temp probe?
Should the recirculation be returned via whirlpool into the side of the pot? Or should it be returned through the lid via a manifold/shower head spray attachment
Do you run the recirculation for the entire brew period ie strike, mash, boil?

Would recirculating through a herms/hermit heat exchanger be a more precise method of heat control? I understand this not practical for boil. but would it be more precise for mash? Of course this would not be a true single vessel (in my opinion - but if it's being pumped then you've got options)

As you can see I've got heaps of questions and only a little knowledge = dangerous

 

[MastersBrewery]

Q.1 yes
Q.2 yes and it is probably better for it to remain insulated for the boil to reduce heat loss
Q.3 Most comonly placed at the recirc outlet (depends on setup really)
Q.4 causing least disturbance to the grain bed, though wirlpool has worked for some
Q.5 Recirc strike to ensure uniform strike temp, recirc mash, after boil wirlpool(aid cooling and centralises break material on the bottom of the kettle)
Q.6 yes with appropriate PID controler





edit: typo

 

[Crusty]

Ok I know I'll probably get bagged (pun intended) but let me preface by saying I have used the search and the google options and I have trawled through plenty of threads but I'm a bit confuddled.

In regards to Single Vessel Recirculating BIAB, I've got a few newbie, most likely dumb questions.

Do you recirculate during the mash period?
Do you need to insulate the pot during mash? Or is it circulating and element cycling with a thermostat to maintain mash temp?
Where is the best position for the temp probe?
Should the recirculation be returned via whirlpool into the side of the pot? Or should it be returned through the lid via a manifold/shower head spray attachment
Do you run the recirculation for the entire brew period ie strike, mash, boil?

Would recirculating through a herms/hermit heat exchanger be a more precise method of heat control? I understand this not practical for boil. but would it be more precise for mash? Of course this would not be a true single vessel (in my opinion - but if it's being pumped then you've got options)

As you can see I've got heaps of questions and only a little knowledge = dangerous

If you want something capable of the options you are asking about & want a single vessel, the Braumeister would be the best choice.
If you want to make great beer & only want to spend around $500.00 or so, BIAB in an electric urn is great.
It's very easy to get caught up in all the processes you may think you need to make great beer as I have done but BIAB is a fantastic way to brew great beer for minimal costs. It's single vessel too.

 

[raven19]

Crusty is on the money in regards to the OP, he built a beautiful 3V rig then jumped ship once it was finished!

 

[woodwormm]

thanks for the prompt replies guys.

i'm trying to think out how i move into BIAB from kit n kilo...

I'm pretty handy and like projects, so building something is as much fun as the brewing (but i want to go single, possibly 2 vessel due to space restrictions)

things i've got lying around that I could utilise if needed - 30 Litre stockpot with tap on bottom , 40 Litre technicice esky.

I need to do a lot more research on the processes involved in AG, rather than relying on my broad understanding, before i get hung up in rig design!

cheers

 

[mark0]

Having tried recirc single vessel i would recommend BIAB. Less complex, easier to use and clean. Cheaper too.

Recirc wont solve starch burning onto electric element problems (pre-saccharification rest)

My urn is insulated with camping mat, but i also use a SS colander and leave the urn on temp control. My thermowell is in the centre of the urn above the element. Will stop burning by getting too hot near the element.

No recirculation for me. a good stir at mash in, lid on and forget for 60min.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

2 pot stovetop method with a plastic pail lauter and willow esky mashtun FTGW (For the Ghetto Win). :drinks: :beerbang:



Goomba

 

[bcp]

Agree with other posters. I have never bothered with or needed recirculation, because BIAB is very efficient. Early I occasionally had low efficiency, but that was fixed mostly by balancing the water with additions. I do lift the bag, so recirculation would probably take out about 1-2 minutes of work, but add some complexity to set it up. I get minimum 70-80% efficiency (depending on size of grain bill, usually) and don't particularly care about going any higher - it's only pennies.

 

[Crusty]

Agree with other posters. I have never bothered with or needed recirculation, because BIAB is very efficient. Early I occasionally had low efficiency, but that was fixed mostly by balancing the water with additions. I do lift the bag, so recirculation would probably take out about 1-2 minutes of work, but add some complexity to set it up. I get minimum 70-80% efficiency (depending on size of grain bill, usually) and don't particularly care about going any higher - it's only pennies.

No recirculation for me. A 90min mash followed by a 78deg mash out, 60min boil, 82% efficiency for my last APA.
If you go the BIAB route, keep it simple, you'll make fantastic beer this way.

 

[MastersBrewery]

agree with all above, BIAB is a simple meathod, complicating it just cost money, I can't remember who it was but one guy one on the forum realised this after spending many months and $1500 chasing 1 deg c. it aint worth it.

 

[Crusty]

agree with all above, BIAB is a simple meathod, complicating it just cost money, I can't remember who it was but one guy one on the forum realised this after spending many months and $1500 chasing 1 deg c. it aint worth it.

.................................. I think I know who that was.

 

[MastersBrewery]

ok more than one guy ... :lol:

 

[mxd]

you've got enough now to start now

you could go 2v
use pot for HLT and kettle
Use your esky as MLT (either with bag or falsie)
Do no sparge and you've got a 23 ltr batch producer.


e.g

5.5 kg grain
add 34 ltrs of water at mash temp +3 ish degrees)
mash for 60 mins
recirc with jug
fill pot
boil

done

 

[woodwormm]

you've got enough now to start now

you could go 2v
use pot for HLT and kettle
Use your esky as MLT (either with bag or falsie)
Do no sparge and you've got a 23 ltr batch producer.


e.g

5.5 kg grain
add 34 ltrs of water at mash temp +3 ish degrees)
mash for 60 mins
recirc with jug
fill pot
boil

done

now we're talking...

ok more questions

what's a good ghetto falsie? ie a colander wrapped in swiss voile? or a cheap mesh strainer?

when you say recirc with jug... is that after mash, just take jug fulls out of esky tap and pour back through the grain? how many times would you do this?

i think i'm going to have an all grain go pretty soon

 

[black_labb]

I built a 1v recirculating system because I wasn't happy with the lack of control and the complexity I had introduced. I was brewing 38l batches using a hybrid biab system. I probably could have done single batches with a lot less hassle but that didn't seem to be the best way. I'm someone who really enjoys making things and I got plenty of satisfaction from building the system. The new system gives me much
More control in terms of mash schedule and it is easier to do than a single infusion. It also creates clearer wort meaning much less trub and the elimination of possible bad beer gremlins that may exist. The brewing process has minimal labour. All i do is adjust a ball valve a few times during the mash before lifting the grain out and starting the boil.
I find I'm brewing a lot more with the new recirculating system. Probably too often as i have all 3 cubes full, at least a couple fermentors going and probably not enough bottles or alcoholism to keep up with my brewing habit.

 

[Crusty]

now we're talking...

ok more questions

what's a good ghetto falsie? ie a colander wrapped in swiss voile? or a cheap mesh strainer?

when you say recirc with jug... is that after mash, just take jug fulls out of esky tap and pour back through the grain? how many times would you do this?

i think i'm going to have an all grain go pretty soon

When you realize it's quite a lot of work & you would rather keep it simple & make some awesome beers, get yourself an electric urn, a grain bag, a hop bag & you're good to go. It couldn't be easier than BIAB in an urn.

 

[Edak]

There's also the DIY braumeister aka braumiser. A hell of a lot of fun to build even if it is more expensive than biab it's cool to have gadgets.

Check out the Braumeister NextGen thread.