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Recultured Coopers Subsequent Generations

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Bribie G

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Well it's comp season and the Old Bar Brewery is once again a maelstrom of activity.
I've decided to nail a good Aussie Sparkling this year, I've never made a bad one and this is a style I really want to finesse, so off to the bottlo for some Coopers.

Rather than use gen 1 I've decided to do a quaffing brew first and use that yeast in the brew I'm doing up for the ESB comp. I seem to remember from a few years back that some brewers report that as you go from generation to generation with the Coopers bottle yeast it becomes more and more estery until eventually it's almost "twangy" and at that point they ditch it and go back to the beginning with fresh yeast.

I'm looking for good esters, especially the pear (ferment cool) but wondering if there's any advantages or disadvantages in going more than two generations with this yeast.

Interested in other peoples' experiences with Coopers recultured over generations (apart from saving sixteen bucks per brew buying the bottles :lol: )
 

tallie

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Funny, Pocket Beers, bconnery, Paul H and I were just talking about this last night. PB's experience is that subsequent generations are too estery. My own experience is getting too much esters from the first generation, fermenting low (~17°C). If I recall correctly, the suggestion was made to let the temp free-rise up to about 21°C to allow the esters to be scrubbed out by the more vigorous fermentation.

Hopefully PB will chime in here; he has more experience than I have and has the awards for his Aussie Pale Ale to back it up!

Cheers,
tallie

Edit: Just to clarify, the main ester character I was talking about is isoamyl acetate (banana)
 

hoppy2B

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I've done it hot in a tin shed and had very little ester profile. Or at least less than expected, and that was after a few generations.
I started with a single stubby and intend to freeball the stuff. I'm not going to use any temp control whatsoever and just keep it going summer and winter as long as I can. **** it! :lol:
 

Mikedub

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I was mucking around with a starter from a 6 pack of CPA recently, that was descanting and adding new wort added every 7 days or so, not temp controlled so maybe not an ideal test but it sat between 19 and 23 degrees, it did change with each generation, the third was markedly intense by comparison to the second, the fourth was almost fusel, the comment ‘twangy’ above is in the ball park too, but couldn’t put my finger on what it was, I tipped it at that point
 

Bribie G

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My dregs are in the Schott bottle in some wort since last night so I'll give it a swirl whenever I'm passing and should be ready to brew next week. Yes that "fusel" is probably the thing I'm thinking of. I'll keep a couple of bottles of the brew then a couple of the subsequent one and see what the difference is if any.

Hey hasn't Sparkling Ale become pale - I remember not too long ago it was almost orange.
 

Nick JD

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I've used it to 4 generations with no issues.

EDIT: so, 5 including the brewery.
 

McFeast

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...And where is the "How to" on reculturing yeast from the fermenter? Im struggling to find it again with my poor searching skills. And need to save money! thanks in advance to any tips/help on this process.
 

Bribie G

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Basic method is, after bottling and kegging, swirl the cake at the bottom of the fermenter till it liquidises, and using the tap fill a bottle or two or three (I find small plastic springwater bottles ideal) and whack into the fridge. This will keep for a couple of months and still be viable. Then pitch it into a brew. The "slurry" of course has a lot of break and protein, and maybe spent hop material in it so many folk don't like to contaminate the new brew with this stuff. I find it's actually quite neutral but if you want to be Nazi:

Pour the slurry into a larger bottle with some deoxygenated sterile water (out of your cooled electric kettle is ideal)

Mix well and let it settle out.

reculturing.jpg

With some judicial pouring, get rid of the top layer of diluted beer and retrieve as much as possible of the yeast layer. The stuff at the bottom is just trub. If you have enough, then pitch, otherwise culture up with some LDME and pitch in a day or so.

Edit: just kegged a lager brew done on yeast using this process, turning out very well.
 

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