Quick Question On Dex

[Ant@thebay]

G'day to everyone

I'm aware that dex is fully fermentable, therefore I assumed that it didn't contribute any flavour to the brew eg. sweetness. Am I assuming wrong?

The reason I ask is because when I add dex to a recipe using Beer Smith, it changes the Bitterness Ratio. I've only just started playing with Beer Smith and finding it very useful. But this particular problem has me scratching my head...

Any ideas would be appreciated

Cheers.
Ant

 

[ford-ute]

It might have some thing to do with the fact that adding dex raises the alcohol content which will alter flavour

also did you make a mistake and add dextine not dextrose because dextrine will not ferment out and affect your numbers

 

[Ant@thebay]

Nah, it's dextrose that I'm adding to the recipe. But I didn't consider the alcohol content changing the flavour so much.

I still got heaps to learn when it comes to all the different ingrediants and creating recipes.

Thanks for ya help

Ant.

 

[A3k]

The bitterness ratio is Bitterness / starting gravity (before fermentation). Starting gravity of 1.050 and a bitterness of 25IBU will give 25/50 = 0.5

If you swapped the dextrose for some dry malt extract, youll get pretty much the same ratio as the starting gravity will be about the same.

The dextrose wont leave any residual sweetness (Dry extract will), and will taste more bitter with the same IBU/SG.

Beersmith doesn't take fermetabiliy of different sugars into account as far as i'm aware. Definitely not with the ratio or expected FG.

 

[muckey]

The bitterness ratio is Bitterness / starting gravity (before fermentation). Starting gravity of 1.050 and a bitterness of 25IBU will give 25/50 = 0.5

If you swapped the dextrose for some dry malt extract, you'll get pretty much the same ratio as the starting gravity will be about the same.

The dextrose won't leave any residual sweetness (Dry extract will), and will taste more bitter with the same IBU/SG.

Beersmith doesn't take fermetabiliy of different sugars into account as far as i'm aware. Definitely not with the ratio or expected FG.

take note of A3k

following on from this
if you are using beersmith to check IBU or BUGU, leave any dex out of the recipe as only the remaining malt will affect bitterness. If you were to hop your beer to the ibu suggested by beersmith with dex included, then your resulting bitterness will be way to high after fermentation

 

[buttersd70]

Beersmith doesn't take fermetabiliy of different sugars into account as far as i'm aware. Definitely not with the ratio or expected FG.

Exactly right. If you want to work a recipe to a BUGU, you need to do so using only the gravity contribution that the malt portion will give, ignoring the dextrose. So in a way, you treat it like a lower gravity all malt beer, get the ratio you want, and then bump it up using dex, ignoring what it does to the BUGU. BUGU has limitations, and this is one of them.

Edit: beaten by Muckey. ....he's done a fair bit of this, as well....keeping the malt and bitterness the same, but varying the dex content to adjust the alcohol level. Note to self to refresh tabs that have been open too long.

 

[muckey]

actually I'm surprised I beat you on this butters. I may have played around with dex/malt but you have more experience with beersmith

 

[Fourstar]

you both beat me to it!

BUGU can get confusing when using programs. For the newbs i usually recommend follwoing the style guidelines rather than attempting to calculate.

If your OG is on the low end, keep your bitterness on the low end of the style aswell and vice-versa. just to keep that balance.

 

[Ant@thebay]

Thanks for all the info guys.

As I previously stated 'I got heaps to learn'.

I really want to try focus on gettin the balance right. And I read somewhere that a Bitterness Ration of 0.5 is reasonably well balanced. Is that a good (rough) gide to use... 0.5 ?

 

[buttersd70]

Thanks for all the info guys.

As I previously stated 'I got heaps to learn'.

I really want to try focus on gettin the balance right. And I read somewhere that a Bitterness Ration of 0.5 is reasonably well balanced. Is that a good (rough) gide to use... 0.5 ?

0.5 BU:GU (assuming you're talking about the malt portion only, as previously stated) is right at the point where neither sweetness nor bitterness dominates. I suppose you could say that it's the "perfect" balance point. Each beer style is basically a case of shifting the balance to one side or the other, and letting either the bitterness or the sweetness dominate to some degree. So if you take an example of an English Mild, and a Standard Bitter...the mild will be around 0.5....the bitter, which may well have basically the same flavour profile, will just have the hopping offset slightly, to say around 0.65. (examples only, some are more, some are less. )
So it's a matter of tilting the balance off centre by the right amount to suit the particular type of beer you are trying to emulate......and once you have that down pat, you can look at introducing the 3rd variable, that of dryness.

 

[Ant@thebay]

I guess alot of this knowledge comes with experience. But I tell ya what, it's bloody helpful to be able to get on here with blokes that are willing to share a bit of advice. It really does help.

Thanks again

Cheers.
Ant

 

[buttersd70]

What goes around, comes around.....without this forum and others like it (RIP, Grumpys. ), I would never have got so seriously in depth with this hobby/obsession. In time, ant, you will no doubt rebalance the karmic equation by passing on knowledge yourself.

 

[Gavo]

Another tip with using Dextrose in beersmith is:
Add it as a part of your recipe.

Double click on the dextrose.
Check the box that says add after boil.
Observe the result.

I have found that this then leaves the IBU's as if the dex wasn't added at all. It does however do the % calculations for you.
I do realize that residual sugars contribute to the bitterness calculations.... But my guess here is that Beersmith calculates the effect of the sugars present in the boil as a part of the Hop efficiency.

Cheers
Gavo.