Noob Filter Question

[sjcampbell]

Although I am a newbie to the forum, I have been kit brewing for close to 20 years. I have just upgraded to kegs, and thought I would try filtering.

I have a filter I picked up on EBay (one of these). I aim to try it to filter from fermenter to keg. The filter element is one micron.

I have tried to use it a couple of times just filtering a fermenter full of water (cause I want to get it right before I try it on real beer!)

The inlet is 10mm Vinyl tubing from the green shed. The fermenter end is inserted into the tap and the inlet hose tail of the filter. On the outlet side the 10mm hose is connected on to the hose tail on the filter, with 10mm tubing going to the bottom of the keg.

I have the fermenter on a kitchen bench with the corny keg on the floor and the filter sitting on top of the keg.

Problem: On just plain water, the unit filter approximately one litre per 5 minutes, so I would imaging beer would be slower due to build up on the filter. The vinyl tubing does have flattened sections which restrict flow, but I can't seem to get them out.

Questions:

Should I be using a better tubing than Green shed vinyl so that it minimises restrictions? Which one?
What flow rate should I expect under gravity?
What other questions should I ask?

Cheers
Stee

 

[raven19]

My filter uses beer line - however your unit appears to need larger diameter tubing. As such have you tried some reinforced tubing that wont collapse?

I can gravity from fermentor to keg via my filter in around 20-30 mins.

 

[sjcampbell]

My filter uses beer line - however your unit appears to need larger diameter tubing. As such have you tried some reinforced tubing that wont collapse?

I can gravity from fermentor to keg via my filter in around 20-30 mins.

Raven19,

Thanks for the reply. I'm going down to our local pump place today to see if I can get 12mm barbs for the filter so I can use food grade "garden hose" for the filter.

Another followup question to all. How do you protect the beer in the keg during transfer? I as thinking of a star-san sprayed tea towel over the lid to stop greeblies getting in, or is that just being paranoid?

Cheers
Steve

 

[razz]

Not paranoid Steve, just mindful of keeping everything sanitary. I sit the keg lid on top so that I can occasionally look in and check the level.

 

[argon]

If you can manage it, try using the beer out disconnect connected to the beer out line of the filter. This will deliver the beer straight to the bottom of the keg. You can then have the lid closed and the pressure relief valve open to allow for displacement of air as beer enters.

 

[pimpsqueak]

I note that the filter you linked to already has 12mm barbs but you say you're using 10mm tubing? I know 10mm tubing is a neat fit inside the tap, but I was also under the impression that 12mm tubing was a neat fit over the tap (though if it's reinforced tubing, you may need to dip the end in boiling water first). Some of the reinforced 12mm food grade tubing from the green shed would fit both your filter and your fermenter tap, while providing a higher flow rate and being reinforced, won't squash flat.

 

[shadders]

[quote name='Steve's Pub' post='746583' date='Mar 1 2011, 08:50 PM']I have been kit brewing for close to 20 years. I have just upgraded to kegs[/quote]

20 years of bottling! Give the man a medal. I only lasted 6 months before it drove me crazy.

 

[sjcampbell]

I note that the filter you linked to already has 12mm barbs but you say you're using 10mm tubing? I know 10mm tubing is a neat fit inside the tap, but I was also under the impression that 12mm tubing was a neat fit over the tap (though if it's reinforced tubing, you may need to dip the end in boiling water first). Some of the reinforced 12mm food grade tubing from the green shed would fit both your filter and your fermenter tap, while providing a higher flow rate and being reinforced, won't squash flat.

Thanks for all of the replies.

I have just got some 12mm reinforced drinking water hose. Have set it up with a 12 mm right angle in to the filter, and used 12mm out.

20 litre cube at kitchen bench height, filter below this with the top (with the air release button) up, and the outlet in to a keg on the floor.

Flow rate 3mins 44 secs for a litre (of clear water) so this will slow down with load on the filter. Extrapolated with plain water this would mean 71 minutes for a keg!

I also noted that even after I bled the air it took 2 - 3 minutes to start liquid flowing.

In addition, I noted the flow in the outlet was just a trickle, and as it is trickling in a 12mm tube full of air isn't this the perfect environment for oxidation?

I really want to be able to do this but just can't get the act together at the moment . As this is a trial of filtering I do't want to swing for a peristaltic pump and then find its not worth it. Maybe I'll need to go to keg to keg filtering and get some pressure behind it.

 

[sjcampbell]

20 years of bottling! Give the man a medal. I only lasted 6 months before it drove me crazy.

To effing right!!!!

Sick and tired of it, and I am time poor at the moment. However in the next few months I want to free up some time and play with some extract brews.

Cheers

 

[pimpsqueak]

I was just about to suggest that very thing. What happens if you run some co2 directly into the fermenter via the airlock hole? Maybe only a few psi will do the trick, saving the double handling?



+1 For the 20 years of bottling medal.

 

[sjcampbell]

I was just about to suggest that very thing. What happens if you run some co2 directly into the fermenter via the airlock hole? Maybe only a few psi will do the trick, saving the double handling?



+1 For the 20 years of bottling medal.

That would mean I would have to find the lids I've only used glad wrap for ages

Cheers

 

[sjcampbell]

+1 For the 20 years of bottling medal.

Actually I just saw another thread where bottles are going for 50 cents each. I just off loaded 400 Axe brand bottles to the local home brewing fraternity!

Cheers

 

[roger mellie]

You will get your moneys worth out of a peristaltic pump -no way would you be dissapointed. My favorite piece of equipment - perfect for reductive beer making - keeping air out is important.

As an alternative and what I have done in the past.

Crash Chill the fermenter and add whatever you want to reduce chill haze - I use Polyclar. Fill an Empty Keg with CO2 just to purge the Air Out - rack into this keg from your fermenter (use the liquid out post). I crash chill again but you dont have to.

Then do a keg to keg filter using CO2 and Gravity. There is thread somewhere that shows the method - search for keg to keg filtering.

Sure - you make more dishes - and you will need to buy some john guest fittings for your filter (and make sure your cartridge is 1micron pleated)

Cheers

RM

(getting back on the horse) :icon_cheers:

 

[Cube]

I got one of these the other day. The o ring does it go over the threaded part of the blue top ( with bleeder ) or does it just sit on the collar which is down inside a bit in the main clear plastic casing and the blue top screws down onto it there to seal?

Just checking because it could go both ways without testing it and running liquid through it.

 

[sjcampbell]

I got one of these the other day. The o ring does it go over the threaded part of the blue top ( with bleeder ) or does it just sit on the collar which is down inside a bit in the main clear plastic casing and the blue top screws down onto it there to seal?

Just checking because it could go both ways without testing it and running liquid through it.

Over the threaded part of the blue top.

Let me know if your going to use it for gravity filtering, and what flow rate you get.

Cheers
Steve

 

[sjcampbell]

You will get your moneys worth out of a peristaltic pump -no way would you be dissapointed. My favorite piece of equipment - perfect for reductive beer making - keeping air out is important.

As an alternative and what I have done in the past.

Crash Chill the fermenter and add whatever you want to reduce chill haze - I use Polyclar. Fill an Empty Keg with CO2 just to purge the Air Out - rack into this keg from your fermenter (use the liquid out post). I crash chill again but you dont have to.

Then do a keg to keg filter using CO2 and Gravity. There is thread somewhere that shows the method - search for keg to keg filtering.

Sure - you make more dishes - and you will need to buy some john guest fittings for your filter (and make sure your cartridge is 1micron pleated)

Cheers

RM

(getting back on the horse) :icon_cheers:

Thanks for the reply. I'd really like to give the filtering a go but it looks like gravity ain't just working up here - maybe it is the altitude - 1000 metres - it means I further away from gravity .... or then again it could be just me!

Seeing I have just started in kegging and LOVE it, I thought it would be an easy move to filter. Such is life!

I have a new fridge coming in a week, so that will free up a Westinghouse all fridge (which I have already built a temp controller for and fits two fermenters nicely) and a 300 litre chest freezer, which will be set to 4C and use for my secondary and gassed keg storage. When this is in train I will give your crash chilling a go.

Peristaltic pumps are expensive, so I'd like to do a "cheapy" filter first t see and taste the difference.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Acasta]

How much water did you test with? A 20 L load will have more pressure and flow faster. Also, try raising the fermenter another meter if you can, this will also add more pressure.

 

[sjcampbell]

How much water did you test with? A 20 L load will have more pressure and flow faster. Also, try raising the fermenter another meter if you can, this will also add more pressure.

Used 10 litres as I thought this would be a good average. Will try putting the fermenter on top of the fridge, but that would be a bugger to do each time I want to empty a fermenter.

Cheers
Steve

 

[toadskin]

Problem: On just plain water, the unit filter approximately one litre per 5 minutes, so I would imaging beer would be slower due to build up on the filter. The vinyl tubing does have flattened sections which restrict flow, but I can't seem to get them out.



Coil your tubing up, put it in a pot and pour boiling water on it. Let it soak for a minute to absorb heat and it should regain its' original shape.....good way to get those annoying coils out of it too.

 

[sjcampbell]

Problem: On just plain water, the unit filter approximately one litre per 5 minutes, so I would imaging beer would be slower due to build up on the filter. The vinyl tubing does have flattened sections which restrict flow, but I can't seem to get them out.



Coil your tubing up, put it in a pot and pour boiling water on it. Let it soak for a minute to absorb heat and it should regain its' original shape.....good way to get those annoying coils out of it too.

Done that
....and also got some reinforced hose for the inlet size.

But I'm still getting awful flow rates.

Cheers