No chill DMS question.

[oscarman]

Hey guys, so I want to be nice to the environment and keep no chilling, I was just wondering if doing a longer boil, say 90 mins, would reduce the DMS production while no chilling, since you boil more off.

Cheers!

Oscar

 

[Florian]

Yes, always helps, but not always neccesary.

you will always have some DMS, but the question is wether it's enough to be detectable to your palate.

Personally I never had any issues.

try it out for yourself, if you usually do 60 minue boils I would stickwith it for now.

 

[barls]

never had any problems in my beers with dms.
are you boiling hard enough?

 

[manticle]

I boil all beers for 75 - 90 minutes anyway.

No noticeable DMS in my NC beers including pale lagers. Diacetyl and 2-3 pentanedione are bigger problems with pale lagers I reckon. This is using European 2-row pilsner malts.

 

[Donske]

I've no chilled 30 minute boil milds and pale ales to no ill effect.

What are the odds of DMS actually being an issue assuming you have a strong boil going and are not using Pils malt?

 

[oscarman]

Ok, no chilling is fine. I'm just having a lot of trouble with my no chill vessels... I bought a white Jerry Can from Bunnings, which i had been told is fine for no chilling, and the lids both exploded off after the second batch... Well, not exploded, but the tops broke off. Here's a couple of pictures:

I pulled the top off btw, but it was practically off.

The next one i tried was a Willow blue Jerry Can, which i use mainly for secondary, but the seal on the lid wasn't working.

So two batches have been over oxidised, the beer still tastes fine, but it's a little lacking in depth. What should i use as a no chill vessel?!

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

I know I can't help you for a couple of months until the orders are complete, but I personally use dangerous goods approved cubes which I have not had any issues with 5 of the 6 I bought for $10each at a bulk buy. Think they are normally $12 each.

To be honest, it's probably better value for you to buy a fresh wort kit from a home brew shop (I recommend Greensborough Home Brewing, no affil etc, just a very happy customer of Dave's) as the vessel has effectively been sterilised, sanitised and proven that it works to hold boiling hot wort and cooling/contraction. ill set you back ~$40 but as a bonus you'll get a lovely brew out of it also!

I haven't used the jerry cans, so can't comment on their quality. I love the two caps to allow easy pouring, but I've gotten slightly bigger muscles from using normal cubes and get better wort aeration when transferring to the FV because I'm forced to by the process, win win ;-)

 

[MHB]

Just to clarify in the original post it is far from clear whether or not you are experiencing any problems with DMS.
Or is it just something you have read might be a problem and wanted to look at before it became one?

Other than that, echoing a lot of the comments and advice above, have personally had no problems with DMS in no-chill, buy good quality cubes (personally I avoid Bunning's - every time I go there I end up going elsewhere to replace the crap they sold me with something that works) the DG cubes DJ_L3ThAL mentioned are the nuts, but good quality food grade cubes work pretty well.

Inadequate boiling isn't the only place you can get DMS, there are some bacteria that can cause problems - anyhow, would like to know if DMS is a problem or is it just a question about the practice of no-chilling.
You can do a test, run a bit of wort off into a PET bottle and stick the bottle in ice water to chill it as fast as possible, when you are ready to ferment your brew carefully compare the smell and taste of the fast chilled and no-chilled worts, at need you can even put a bit of yeast into the bottle and ferment in parallel then taste, might help you work out where the problem is coming from.
Mark

 

[manticle]

Ok, no chilling is fine. I'm just having a lot of trouble with my no chill vessels... I bought a white Jerry Can from Bunnings, which i had been told is fine for no chilling, and the lids both exploded off after the second batch... Well, not exploded, but the tops broke off. Here's a couple of pictures:

I pulled the top off btw, but it was practically off.

The next one i tried was a Willow blue Jerry Can, which i use mainly for secondary, but the seal on the lid wasn't working.

So two batches have been over oxidised, the beer still tastes fine, but it's a little lacking in depth. What should i use as a no chill vessel?!

I use Willow blue Jerries and find them 90% great. Ocasionally you can get a bit of stray plastic remaining from the manufacturing process which stops the thread from sealing. If you can find it, a quick, careful slice with a stanley can fix it. You can test the seal by filling the cube with hot water before the first use. Pressure will build inside the cube if it is sealed - steam will spray out the side if it isn't. Do this with caution - hot liquids, etc.

Otherwise as suggested - FWK. I like the jerries becuase of the shape - more compact.

 

[wombil]

Oscarman,
Maybe you are screwing the tops on too tight.
They don't need to be super dooper Grrrrrrrr wrenched on to seal.

 

[oscarman]

Just to clarify in the original post it is far from clear whether or not you are experiencing any problems with DMS.
Or is it just something you have read might be a problem and wanted to look at before it became one?

Other than that, echoing a lot of the comments and advice above, have personally had no problems with DMS in no-chill, buy good quality cubes (personally I avoid Bunning's - every time I go there I end up going elsewhere to replace the crap they sold me with something that works) the DG cubes DJ_L3ThAL mentioned are the nuts, but good quality food grade cubes work pretty well.

Inadequate boiling isn't the only place you can get DMS, there are some bacteria that can cause problems - anyhow, would like to know if DMS is a problem or is it just a question about the practice of no-chilling.
You can do a test, run a bit of wort off into a PET bottle and stick the bottle in ice water to chill it as fast as possible, when you are ready to ferment your brew carefully compare the smell and taste of the fast chilled and no-chilled worts, at need you can even put a bit of yeast into the bottle and ferment in parallel then taste, might help you work out where the problem is coming from.
Mark

It's more of a 'i don't want to find out what DMS is' kinda thing...

Where can you buy the DG cubes from?

Oscarman,
Maybe you are screwing the tops on too tight.
They don't need to be super dooper Grrrrrrrr wrenched on to seal.

Yeah, the thread on the blue willow is ridiculous, totally munted. You'd think they would have that right wouldn't you?

 

[marksy]

To be honest, it's probably better value for you to buy a fresh wort kit from a home brew shop (I recommend Greensborough Home Brewing, no affil etc, just a very happy customer of Dave's) as the vessel has effectively been sterilised, sanitised and proven that it works to hold boiling hot wort and cooling/contraction. ill set you back ~$40 but as a bonus you'll get a lovely brew out of it also!

Totally agree. They are what the industry use, and you`ll get a pretty decent beer for minimal effort. Had no issues with mine ever doing NC, just make sure you give them a good clean (obviously) with more attention to the handle. I even have started brewing ginger beers and ciders in them for the gurly. Work a treat.

 

[davedoran]

I've used the blue ones from bunnings a few times. I've had no dramas with them. I use an urn biab and open tap onto a funnel which then goes onto a flexible into the cube. Sorry getting a bit OT. oh and I make sure I push all the air out as it fills.

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

It's more of a 'i don't want to find out what DMS is' kinda thing...

Where can you buy the DG cubes from?


Yeah, the thread on the blue willow is ridiculous, totally munted. You'd think they would have that right wouldn't you?

Dave at greensborough home brewing uses them for his fresh wort kits ;-)

Otherwise Plasdene and similar suppliers like People in Plastic should have them but they usually have a minimum spend!

 

[damoninja]

Chill environmentally!

I no-chilled several beers, now I've got an immersion chiller...

During the first minute or so of running it while it's coming out super duper hot i collect it in no-chill cube/s, once they cool I use them on the garden.
After the chiller isn't spitting out boiling hot liquid anymore I put the hose straight on to the vege patch.

 

[oscarman]

Chill environmentally!

I no-chilled several beers, now I've got an immersion chiller...

During the first minute or so of running it while it's coming out super duper hot i collect it in no-chill cube/s, once they cool I use them on the garden.
After the chiller isn't spitting out boiling hot liquid anymore I put the hose straight on to the vege patch.

How much water would you use chilling a 20ish litre batch?

Also, could you cube the run off from the chiller and then use it for a brew another day?

 

[damoninja]

How much water would you use chilling a 20ish litre batch?

Also, could you cube the run off from the chiller and then use it for a brew another day?

Don't know exactly how much, but I'll test this next time I brew by timing how long it takes to fill a 20L cube and how long the water is running all together - should give me a rough figure.

I wouldn't use it in a future brew, personally... It's far from sterile so I wouldn't like leaving it sit there for weeks between brews even if you're boiling it I'm sure some crap would start to grow in the cube. Unless you were planning to use it next day or something.

If you don't have a garden use it in your washing machine or something.

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/index.php?/topic/79007-Cube-algae-growth-in-boiled-water?

EDIT: sorry was on mobile, link is discussion on potential growth from leaving water in a cubes with some sunlight

 

[oscarman]

Don't know exactly how much, but I'll test this next time I brew by timing how long it takes to fill a 20L cube and how long the water is running all together - should give me a rough figure.

I wouldn't use it in a future brew, personally... It's far from sterile so I wouldn't like leaving it sit there for weeks between brews even if you're boiling it I'm sure some crap would start to grow in the cube. Unless you were planning to use it next day or something.

If you don't have a garden use it in your washing machine or something.

Yeah no worries. Do you think that it would be more than 2 or so 20L cubes?

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Way more, probably closer to 10 cubes most likely