New To Brew

[buttersd70]

You could probably get away with the caramalt master blend (although I have never used it myself.) Its 60% caramalt and 40% pale. You could then make it up with ldme or dme. This would also help with body and head retention.
link

Never used cluster, myself, so don't really know. But my understanding is that chinook is the predominant hop in LCPA, so you could just use more chinook if you wanted too.
Some of the best hop descriptions you will find are given by ross in the craftbrewer store...all the data you need, plus substitution suggestions.

 

[Cocko]

Possibly the most worn keys on members key pads LCPA!!

Anyway, for K&K maybe check this thread: http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...307&hl=LCPA

Werd.

 

[QIK86]

I've read that thread thoroughly Cocko. The recipe I'm planning is very similar to Boonie's as mentioned in that thread.

Butters, you mentioned I could use the Caramalt Master Blend and make it up with LDME or DME. Would it make any difference if I was to make it up with a liquid LME instead of dry?

I may still hunt down a 1.5kg can of Extra Pale Malt Extract, but am still just looking at other options at this stage in case I can't find it.

On a different note, I just scored a case of LCPA pints (568ml) for $21.99. A somewhat slow Dan Murphy's employee made a slight boo boo at the checkout and only charged me for a 4 pack instead of a case!! :beerbang: I've never swiped my eftpos card and entered my pin number so quickly. :lol:

 

[mwd]

Should have been straight back and bought another 5 cases. Save you brewing APA could do something else.

Its about $20.00 for a sixpack small ones up here.

 

[buttersd70]

Butters, you mentioned I could use the Caramalt Master Blend and make it up with LDME or DME. Would it make any difference if I was to make it up with a liquid LME instead of dry?

Well, wheter dry is better/worse than liquid is a bit of a debated issue, but its for the most part to do with (ease of) process rater than actual end result.
Personally, when I was doing full extract brews, I would use as much liquid malt as I could use for full tins, and any shortfall in gravity I would make up with dry, purely because you can reseal a bag of dry and shove it in the cupboard. There is more variety in the liquid tins, ie xttra light, light, amber, dark, etc compared to the dry, which is usually only light. (if you can get it, there is xtra light, amber and dark, but they are harder to source.)
I never did a side by side with one made with all dry vs all liquid.

The short answer then, is that if less than a full tin is required, just make it up with dry imho.

Just bear in mind the difference required due to the moisture......1kg dry=1.25kg liquid, 1kg liquid = 800g dry. (ie, liquid malt is 80% malt, 20%water. Technically, dry is only 97-98%, but the small amount of water is usally discarded in calculations.)

 

[QIK86]

Just bought a Fermentis US-05 Yeast from CraftBrewer, after reading a couple of bad reports of the Brewcellar American Ale yeast on here. Had me worried. I'll still use it in the future, but I want this brew to be a good one.

Now thinking I might just use 2kg of the LHBS liquid Light Malt Extract. Going by Butters' K+K attenuation .xls, if made up to 23 litres, OG should be around 1049 and it should end up around 4.86% ABV + priming, so won't completely blow anyone's socks off.

Do you think I should up the hops boil time slightly to allow for the extra malt?

 

[buttersd70]

You will need to balance the additional malt, but as I've never used the stockmans draught tin so have no idea how bitter it is in the first place.....which makes it a bit of a hard question to answer.

If someone that has brewed this tin with a malt/dex combo without additional hops can give you an impression of how balanced the bitterness was with the malt they used (ignoring any dex or maltodex in their mix), you could use the following to balance 2kg ldm.

if the bitterness was at a good level with :
250g ldm add 11ibu
500g ldm add 9ibu
750g ldm add 7 ibu

I'd take a guess on it needing 10ibu. But this is only a guess. But I think it might be a safe-ish middle ground.

 

[QIK86]

Not sure if it's of any help, but after a quick search I found the Stockmans Draught Tin is 28IBU/23lt. From a post by Butters of all people.. Another search turned up the fact that LCPA is around 35IBU.

From most accounts of similar recipes using the can + 1.5kg of liquid malt extract, the hop boil times mentioned above worked well. So I just need to know how much longer to boil them to balance the additional 500g of liquid malt.

Butters, even if someone can tell me the exact IBU needed to be added, (as you mentioned, probably around 10IBU) how do I know how much longer to boil the hops for? Is there some kind of formula I can use to work it out?

 

[buttersd70]

Not sure if it's of any help, but after a quick search I found the Stockmans Draught Tin is 28IBU/23lt. From a post by Butters of all people.. Another search turned up the fact that LCPA is around 35IBU.

From most accounts of similar recipes using the can + 1.5kg of liquid malt extract, the hop boil times mentioned above worked well. So I just need to know how much longer to boil them to balance the additional 500g of liquid malt.

Butters, even if someone can tell me the exact IBU needed to be added, (as you mentioned, probably around 10IBU) how do I know how much longer to boil the hops for? Is there some kind of formula I can use to work it out?

I dont remember posting that :lol: . Wonder where I got that info from? :huh:
To work out the amount of IBU in the boil, you need to use a calculator of some sort, such as the one on Glenn tinseths homepage, or a program like brewsta or beersmith.....it can be worked out manually, but the maths is a PITA.

So you do your boil in a volume of known OG, but you use the final volume in the calculation...easier than it sounds and I've tried to explain it before but have trouble putting the concept into words without making it sound really complex....

 

[buttersd70]

If you add 1kg of the lme and make up to 5L for the boil, the BG is 1062.
15g cascade (assuming 4.5%AA) and 10g cluster (assuming 5.5%AA) boiled for 15min will give 7IBU when added back into the 23L final.
Add the other liquid and the kit at the end of the boil, just to disolve nicely, top up to 23L and bingo.

On a side note...when using liquid malt in cans, I don't see any need to boil (other than what you need for the hopping), as it is sterile in the can. Just sanatise the outside of the tin and the can opener. Dry malt is a different story, cos its not hermetically sealed in a sterile tin, and as Bribie has said in another thread, you don't know who may have sneezed in it in the factory :lol: .

LCPA is 5.2% in the bottle, so 1049ish sounds right, once its primed.....35IBU sounds about right, too....70%BUGU.

EDIT. DUH. Morgans state the IBU of their tins on the website. Thats where I got the info. :lol:

 

[QIK86]

Where can I find a working bitterness calculator? The one on Glenn Tinseth's page is not working for some reason.

Just to be a pain in the ass, would there be any difference if I were to substitute an extra 10g of Cascade (4.5%AA) instead of 10g of Cluster (5.5%AA)?

 

[buttersd70]

unfortunately for some reason the metric one on tinseth doesn't work <_<
But the java one on his sight does, but you have to convert all values to yank weights. :angry:

As for the sub, it would only make 0.57 IBU difference, absolutely sweet FA.

Oh, and I was only guessing at the alphas anyway, so your mileage may vary

Edit...you can also use a program like brewsta, which is free. download link is here (yes, promash and beersmith are better.....but for quick IBU calcs as opposed to formulating recipes in full, I think it has it's place.)

 

[QIK86]

The Cascade pellets I'll be using for the boil are actually 6.3%AA. By the way, do I bring the water to temp then add the LME, or start by boiling the LME on its own then add the water?

This will be my first all malt beer and my first extract boil, so just to clarify procedure...

Let me know if anything is wrong/could be better.

1. Boil 1kg LME and enough water to make it up to 5lt
2. Add 25g of Cascade (6.3%AA) and boil the lot for 15mins (enough bitterness for the 2kg of LME??)
3. Turn off heat, add another 1kg LME and Stockmans Draught Can contents, stir to disolve
4. Cool pot in ice bath
5. Add to fermenter and top up to 23lt, add yeast when at correct pitching temp, etc, etc.. Done.

How does it look?

 

[buttersd70]

If you boil the lme on its own, it will scorch. Bring the water ( or a good proportion of it at least) up to hot, take off heat, add lme and dissolve, then back on heat and bring to boil.

for the other q's
1 yes
2 yes (yes). although, this will give 8.8ibu (now I know the alpha.) 20g will give the 7IBU you were initially looking for. But its bugger all difference.
3 yes
4 and 5 - maybe. This is one way, another way is, because the boil is such a small amount, instead of chilling it, you can add straight to fermenter and top up to 23L. If your water is cold enough, it will chill immediately and be straight at pitching temp. . At this time of year, water straight from the tap might even do it, but to be sure, chuck a couple or 4 litres in the fridge the night before, and as you hit 20L, take the temp (with a sanitary thermometer). If its over, go the cold, if its under, use the kettle, if its on track, use the tapwater.

Congrats on all malt, matey. Have you doing extracts or even AG soon.

 

[QIK86]

Well, it all went rather smoothly. A couple of issues I had though.. I filled the tea ball with the 25g of Cascade pellets for the boil and threw it in once it was boiling. I noticed they swelled and looked somewhat trapped in the ball. I felt sorry for the poor hops and opened the tea ball to let them swim free, instantly releasing noticably more aroma (and I assume flavour). I then found I was without a strainer, so into the fermenter it all went, hops and all.

Will this be ok? Will they evenetually settle out in the fermenter or will they end up in the bottles? I noticed my first hydrometer sample since fermentation started was filled with hop residue, so i tipped it out and got another.

My OG was 1.052, which was a little higher than expected. Now, after 4 days it has already dropped to 1.011, so the yeasties have been rather busy! Is this normal for US-05? (This was my first brew with anything other than kit yeast) Initial fermentation temp was a little higher than I would have liked at 22-24. I've had it down to 20 with some wet towels the last couple of days though. Tasted the hydrometer sample this morning and it was surprisingly good already! Very LCPAish.

I'm planning on dry hopping the Chinook pellets in the tea ball tonight. Only 12g, so they should have some more room to move than the 25g of Cascade did in there. Should I steep before adding or just throw in dry?

Also, I'm planning on bulk priming with dextrose this time. Is it 6g per litre? I read the correct amounts somewhere but can't find it now. Also, how much water to dissolve it in? 500ml?

 

[Steve]

Well, it all went rather smoothly. A couple of issues I had though.. I filled the tea ball with the 25g of Cascade pellets for the boil and threw it in once it was boiling. I noticed they swelled and looked somewhat trapped in the ball. I felt sorry for the poor hops and opened the tea ball to let them swim free, instantly releasing noticably more aroma (and I assume flavour). I then found I was without a strainer, so into the fermenter it all went, hops and all.

Will this be ok? Will they evenetually settle out in the fermenter or will they end up in the bottles? I noticed my first hydrometer sample since fermentation started was filled with hop residue, so i tipped it out and got another.

My OG was 1.052, which was a little higher than expected. Now, after 4 days it has already dropped to 1.011, so the yeasties have been rather busy! Is this normal for US-05? (This was my first brew with anything other than kit yeast) Initial fermentation temp was a little higher than I would have liked at 22-24. I've had it down to 20 with some wet towels the last couple of days though. Tasted the hydrometer sample this morning and it was surprisingly good already! Very LCPAish.

I'm planning on dry hopping the Chinook pellets in the tea ball tonight. Only 12g, so they should have some more room to move than the 25g of Cascade did in there. Should I steep before adding or just throw in dry?

Also, I'm planning on bulk priming with dextrose this time. Is it 6g per litre? I read the correct amounts somewhere but can't find it now. Also, how much water to dissolve it in? 500ml?

The hops in the primary will be fine, they will settle. Just keep your eye on the inside of the fermenter and stop racking when the gunk/sludge gets close to the tap when you are tipping it up. I always pour the first lot of hydro sample wort down the sink and measure the second sample because of the extra gunk. Chuck the chinook in dry. Make sure you sterilise the hop ball in a bowl of boiling water first though. Heres a link with some info on bulk priming. Ive not used dextrose so cant remember the quantities per litre. I used to only dissolve in 250mls. I only used plain white sugar and would probably use 150gms in an APA.

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...;showarticle=68

Cheers
Steve

 

[buttersd70]

Qik, agree with steve re hops settling and usage.
As far as priming is concerned, there is a good calculator here
For the temperature in the calculator, you put in the highest temp that the brew has experienced during fermentation (it's used to work out how much residual co2 is left in solution.)
Personally I use dex for priming, as it is a simple ferment due to it being a monosaccharide. I would probably aim for 2.5-2.7 volumes for this one.

Don't worry about the OG being high, its only 3 points higher than predicted, which in the grand scheme of things is SFA. Hydrometer reading error, temp difference, slightly under volume, whatever, it doesn't take much to push 1049 up to 1052. So all is good.

 

[QIK86]

Cheers for that Steve.

And thanks for the calculator Butters. It's probably splitting hairs, but when entering the volume, do you use the initial volume, or volume to be bottled? (i.e. Initial volume less hydrometer samples and trub?)

 

[buttersd70]

Cheers for that Steve.

And thanks for the calculator Butters. It's probably splitting hairs, but when entering the volume, do you use the initial volume, or volume to be bottled? (i.e. Initial volume less hydrometer samples and trub?)

For the online bitterness calculator? Volume to fermenter, ie after loss to evaporation, break, and deadspace (and, technically, cooling loss). Although, for partial boils, particularly when doing hopped kits and extract brewing, loss to evaporation isn't generally accounted for, due to the fact that it's water boiling out of the pan, and you're going to be adding water to make it up to your recipe volume anyway....so any water evaporated out of the boiled wort is made up in the water addition at the end, anyway. So what you lose on the swings you make up on the roundabouts. Break and deadspace...for kits, it's usually just all chucked in anyway. There are some people that will argue untill they are blue in the face that this causes negative impact, due to hot break going in etc. However, extract is produced by evaporation of wort, which has already had hot and cold break precipitated during manufacture.....so boil in however many L, then top up to 23L (or whatever). Use 23L for the volume in the calc, but for the gravity, use the actual gravity of what is being boiled.

Once its in the fermenter, any further loss (such as hydro readings etc) reduces the volume, but the loss has the same bitterness as the main batch itself, so it doesn't cause it to concentrate at all. Loss to trub effects it on a technical level, because the (solid component of the) trub itself is precipitated from the volume, thus changing the concentration of the wort (marginally). But on a practical level, the precipitation also strips a certain amount of isomorised alpha, so it (kinda sorta) evens out. I don't know anyone that is anal enough to even calculate the effects of precipitation on IBU. Basically, once it;s in the fermenter and cooled to pitching temperature, you consider it to be a done deal. Any loss from that point on is considered to be a volume loss of final product, and doesn't effect final results.

If you decide to use Brewsta, give me a pm and I'll either post or send you some screenshots showing an example partial boil entered, cos theres a couple of ways of doing it, all give the same result, just worked out differently.

 

[QIK86]

Butters, your knowledge truly astounds me. :blink: I'll come back and read that post again in a couple of months.

I almost feel bad admitting it now, but I actually meant the volume to be entered into the Priming Calculator..