New Brewer And Sterilisng Bottles

[twavvy]

Hey guys,

Long time reader (2 weeks is long, right??) first time poster. I received a homebrew kit from my lovely wife for Christmas. On Boxing Day I brewed the Coopers Lager that it contained (Forgetting to take the initial SG reading....). I did have a couple of incidents, including the airlock fall off on about day 3 for what must have been a couple of hours, and it hasn't bubbled at all, but I went into the Brewer's Den and the lady (Who was EXTREMELY helpful) assured me all was ok. I then bought myself a fancy lever capper and some assorted parephernalia including bottle caps and will definitely return there.

I commissioned my in-laws to collect bottles from their Christmas Day, Boxing Day (Family birthday) and New Year's celebrations and now have about 80 assorted Crown, Stella, Cascade and Boags bottles. Although concerned they are alcoholics, this is quite good for me!

My questions is this - I didn't get a bottle brush with my kit, however would like to sterilise the bottles and bottle them tonight. The SG was 1.018 on 30/12, 1.012 on 1/1 and then 1.012 again today. Although it said it should be more like 1.008, I hope this is fine as it doesn't seem to be changing any more. I have already rinsed all bottles and removed labels etc, but no sterilising yet. Should I use a bit of bleach in each bottle with warm water then do the rinsing thing, or can I just put them all in the dishwasher, wait for them to cool down then get on with bottling? Any ideas/suggestions would be most appreciated!

Also, after reading other posts I went to Woolies (Clearance stock) and got another Coopers Kit (Pale Ale) with some brew enhancer, but after that am hoping to move onto extracts and am really enjoying reading all of the great ideas on this forum.

Thanks for everything!

Trav

PS. I had to write this post in IE, as I can't seem to make this textbox active in Firefox, despite being able to add a title and description. Does anyone else have this problem?

 

[DU99]

Bleach is suitable,even the dishwasher is ok..if you use bleach make you rinse well,there's no bleach smell..i use anti bacterial solution,same stuff you use for babies bottles..

 

[enuun]

When i bleach, i rinse them out and leave them in a cool and airy place for about an hour for the chlorine to get out
After which I spray in some iodophor (food grade iodine that I use being the cheapest and meanest thing I can get) cap and all and leave for 10mins before I bottle.
Same thing for my kegs as well 'cept for kegs I don't iodophor I use a sanitizer like starsan

 

[Hatchy]

Hey guys,

Long time reader (2 weeks is long, right??) first time poster. I received a homebrew kit from my lovely wife for Christmas. On Boxing Day I brewed the Coopers Lager that it contained (Forgetting to take the initial SG reading....). I did have a couple of incidents, including the airlock fall off on about day 3 for what must have been a couple of hours, and it hasn't bubbled at all, but I went into the Brewer's Den and the lady (Who was EXTREMELY helpful) assured me all was ok. I then bought myself a fancy lever capper and some assorted parephernalia including bottle caps and will definitely return there.

I commissioned my in-laws to collect bottles from their Christmas Day, Boxing Day (Family birthday) and New Year's celebrations and now have about 80 assorted Crown, Stella, Cascade and Boags bottles. Although concerned they are alcoholics, this is quite good for me!

My questions is this - I didn't get a bottle brush with my kit, however would like to sterilise the bottles and bottle them tonight. The SG was 1.018 on 30/12, 1.012 on 1/1 and then 1.012 again today. Although it said it should be more like 1.008, I hope this is fine as it doesn't seem to be changing any more. I have already rinsed all bottles and removed labels etc, but no sterilising yet. Should I use a bit of bleach in each bottle with warm water then do the rinsing thing, or can I just put them all in the dishwasher, wait for them to cool down then get on with bottling? Any ideas/suggestions would be most appreciated!

Also, after reading other posts I went to Woolies (Clearance stock) and got another Coopers Kit (Pale Ale) with some brew enhancer, but after that am hoping to move onto extracts and am really enjoying reading all of the great ideas on this forum.

Thanks for everything!

Trav

PS. I had to write this post in IE, as I can't seem to make this textbox active in Firefox, despite being able to add a title and description. Does anyone else have this problem?

Did the lady at the shop sell you any sanitiser? Use no rinse sanitiser to sanitise the bottles, assuming you've got them clean you don't need bleach or a bottlebrush at the moment.

There's a button to the top right of the post window that looks like a refresh button that should fix the firefox problems.

 

[DU99]

most kits do supply some type of stuff most use Sodium_metabisulfite,even coopers use it..i got some with my kit when i first started...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_metabisulfite

 

[Hatchy]

I've enjoyed brewing more & brewed better beer since ditching the sot met & getting some starsan. No rinse all the way for me these days.

 

[big78sam]

I've been brewing for a couple of years and only just bought starsan. It's wonderful stuff. My only regret is messing around with other sanitisers that needed rinsing for so long.

It is a bit expensive but you use so little in the long run it's actually very economical.

 

[fcmcg]

most kits do supply some type of stuff most use Sodium_metabisulfite,even coopers use it..i got some with my kit when i first started...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_metabisulfite

Whilst I used sodium met for years , it is not a sanitiser...yes it cleans but as you have to rinse with water , you never actually sanitize ....water is not sanitary...
You will be fine regardless , but if you want to get a proper sanitiser ( for use after you have cleaned your bottles ) I'd recommend iodopher or star San ... All the sponsors on the top page should have it...I use iodopherixed in a spray bottle...I spray everything including my hands when I am bottleing...
Hope this helps....
The best thing you can do as a newbie is get your cleaning and sanitizing spot on....
Hope this helps
Ferg

 

[Goofinder]

The Coopers kit should have had some sanitiser in a small bottle with it. If not, you can use the bleach/water/vinegar no-rinse sanitiser from stuff you should have around the house as follows:

1.6 mL bleach mixed into 1L of water, then mix in 1.6 mL vinegar. Don't mix bleach directly with vinegar. Scale up as needed (e.g. you could make up 10L to rinse all the bottles in the sink, so it would be 16 mL bleach into 10L water, then mix in 16 mL vinegar). Don't rinse after use (the bleach is at such a low concentration you won't be able to detect it in the beer).

I used this for ages before giving in and buying a bottle of starsan. But for your first go I'd just use the sanitiser that came with your kit if you got one.

 

[beerandgarden]

I'm a new brewer myself and I found my dishwasher to come in handy for doing my bottles. I didn't actually use it for sanitising but the top rack makes a good bottle holder while they are draining/drying after sterilising. I used a solution of sodium met in the sink for sterilising. I cleaned/sanitised the sink and surrounds with bleach first. The thing I don't like the sodium met is the fact that you are supposed to wait for an hour to air dry. So I'll be switching to something like star san or idophor.

 

[twavvy]

Wow thanks so much for all the help guys. I put a capful of bleach into each bottle then quarter filled them with boiling water and shook. Then I washed it all out with water numerous times and shook them as dry as I could... 70 bottles took just under 2 hours. They are now upside down on tea towels (Just saw the dishwasher rack idea - Fantastic stuff!) but will definitely get a better method in future as it gets so boring! I think this star san stuff is the way to go.

Thanks heaps for all of your replies and as I was struggling through the washing I must have looked depressed as I got the ok from the wife to use her stockpot (19L) for future brews so will be buying ingredients from now on and making my own flavours!

I'll let you know how it goes

Thanks again

Trav

 

[Hatchy]

Those bottles are clean but not sanitised.

If you can get to a decent home brew shop then get some no rinse sanitiser & a bottle rinser (they're hard to explain but will normally be sitting on a bottle tree). For around $50 they're things that will make life way easier. My bottle washer is over 10 years old although I should mention that it didn't see much use for the 1st 9 years. Unless yr brewing epic volumes a bottle of starsan should last you 12 months. I brewed over 1000L last year & didn't finish a bottle.

 

[Yob]

I've enjoyed brewing more & brewed better beer since ditching the sot met & getting some starsan. No rinse all the way for me these days.

+1 for star san.. this stuff really is the go.. a Propper 'no rinse sanitiser' is what you want at the end of the day..

Star San in particular is good for me as I know any residue actually breaks down to become yeast nutrient... and 2ml per litre makes it so freakin cheap to use it's stupid...tell me where that idea fails? - "dont fear the foam"

However, if using bottles for the first time, I still give them the full treatment.

Soak in Sod. Met. + Brush + Hot rinse x 2 + cold 1 rinse..(+ Star San B4 use)

I may be OCD but I really do like to know they are as clean and sterile as I can possibly make them... and never had one blow up...

 

[brettprevans]

Just a word if caution, whilst it good to get into good habits for sanatisation, one can go overboard. When I bottled I did all the right things as mentioned above and all was good. Bloody time consuming and yse a lot of PBW sod met star san etc. Went to kegs and only bottle a few each batch now. But I don't bother washing the bottles with star San or anything any more. Just a rinse out once finished, dry then either screw back in lid if PET, or a bit of glad wrap over the top if glass. I can count the number of infections I've had in all my years on one hand (and still have spare fingers). Same with the kegs. I'm not overly fastidious with those either.

My fermentors on the other hand get washed well as that's where your mist likely to get an infection.

Now of course if u aren't rinsing or keeping ur bottles clean between brews (ie leaving them outside to collect dust etc) well then yes I give them a good clean to kill nasties.

Im not advocating that u dont clean. U should. Sanatisation practices are good and have a place in brewing. Its Just some food for thought.

 

[beerandgarden]

Wow thanks so much for all the help guys. I put a capful of bleach into each bottle then quarter filled them with boiling water and shook. Then I washed it all out with water numerous times and shook them as dry as I could... 70 bottles took just under 2 hours. They are now upside down on tea towels (Just saw the dishwasher rack idea - Fantastic stuff!) but will definitely get a better method in future as it gets so boring! I think this star san stuff is the way to go.

2 hrs seems like a long time to be washing bottles. I did mine in less than 15mins. But I use larger bottles, 750ml and 1.25L PET bottles, so I have much less to wash (filling and other bottle handling goes quicker too). I also put the no rinse sanitiser in the sink (might not be an economical way to use an expensive one like star san), chuck in a few bottles at a time, give each one a bit of a shake with cap on, then shake it out to remove as much sanitiser as possible and stick it into the rack to dry. All of them fit comfortably on the top rack.

 

[twavvy]

2 hrs seems like a long time to be washing bottles. I did mine in less than 15mins. But I use larger bottles, 750ml and 1.25L PET bottles, so I have much less to wash (filling and other bottle handling goes quicker too). I also put the no rinse sanitiser in the sink (might not be an economical way to use an expensive one like star san), chuck in a few bottles at a time, give each one a bit of a shake with cap on, then shake it out to remove as much sanitiser as possible and stick it into the rack to dry. All of them fit comfortably on the top rack.

You are correct - 2 hours WAS a long time! It took that long because I didn't get any sanitiser of any kind with the kit, so put a capful of bleach in each bottle, quarter filled it with boiling water, shook it, rinsed it out then rinsed it again. I then turned it upside down, shook vigorously to remove all remaining water and put it upside down on a clean tea towel to dry (Left them for about an hour). For 70 bottles the time added up (Turns out I needed extras as Stella bottles are only 330mL). Definitely getting sanitiser before my next batch!

Also I do understand the distinction between clean and sanitised, but am having trouble understanding why the instructions say that to completely sanitise the fermenter and all equipment you use a bleach in water solution, however when I do that for bottles they are "cleaned", but not "sanitised". Using the same solution aren't they either both only clean or both sanitised?

Also a great tip for young players - Don't wear your favourite t-shirt when working with bleach - The whole front of mine is now white!

Cheers

Trav

 

[Goofinder]

Also I do understand the distinction between clean and sanitised, but am having trouble understanding why the instructions say that to completely sanitise the fermenter and all equipment you use a bleach in water solution, however when I do that for bottles they are "cleaned", but not "sanitised". Using the same solution aren't they either both only clean or both sanitised?

You killed pretty much everything with the bleach and at that point they were sanitised. However, as soon as you rinsed them out with non-sanitised water, they were no longer sanitised. That's why no rinse sanitiser is the shit.

As said above, you can make up a bleach/water/vinegar mix that is diluted enough to be usable as a no rinse sanitiser - just swirl some around in the bottles then leave to drain.

 

[twavvy]

You killed pretty much everything with the bleach and at that point they were sanitised. However, as soon as you rinsed them out with non-sanitised water, they were no longer sanitised. That's why no rinse sanitiser is the shit.

As said above, you can make up a bleach/water/vinegar mix that is diluted enough to be usable as a no rinse sanitiser - just swirl some around in the bottles then leave to drain.

Oh yeah... the water, hence the "no-rinse" stuff being a good idea. Thanks for the clarification mate!

Trav

 

[manticle]

. I put a capful of bleach into each bottle then quarter filled them with boiling water and shook.

Chlorine bleach?

Heat drives off chlorine - for it to work it needs to be mixed with cold, then rinsed with hot.

 

[bum]

Seems to be a small amount of confusion above. Twavvy, if you think a no-rinse sanitiser is going to save time you are wrong - it is an extra step and adds time. You still need to make sure the bottles are clean before you use it. You can, of course, work out a way that is less time consuming to do the initial cleaning.

As for your distinction between cleaning bottles and brewing gear - there is no difference. Clean is clean and sanitised is sanitised. They are not the same and both vessels need to be cleaned and sanitised properly (CM2's reasonable points above notwithstanding).