My all grain (BIAB) no chill beers are all really bad...

[Nick JD]

Do you clean your fermenter taps?

 

[slash22000]

I think i'm going to buy glass carboys now. if plastic harbours bacteria then why do we use it? what's to say it isn't full of bacteria when it arrives from china or wherever they come from? if it can get infected in a bleached room with no grain and full of sanitising solution then the either shipping, handling, shelf at the homebrew store (grain everywhere there) and factory where they are made it doesn't stand much of a chance does it? it doesn't make sense to me.

Thousands of brewers use plastic vessels every day with no problems at all. The solution is not to go out and buy glass carboys (bugger those things, who wants to store beer in 5000kg of fragile glass?), the solution is to improve your process.

Also, I think it goes without saying, you can't really "no chill" in a glass vessel can you? How are you going to squeeze the air out? Or sanitise the whole vessel with heat?

 

[bradsbrew]

How good is your rolling boil and do you keep the lid off during the boil. Could be DMS?

 

[jaypes]

Whats the crush like on the grain?

Probably have noting to actually look at now

Acetaldehyde or astringency perhaps?

 

[Tex083]

Where in Melbourne are you?
Im in Melbourne and you can come and brew with me and see if I do anything differently.

 

[Truman42]

astringency perhaps?

Especially if your squeezing the crap out of your bag when sparging.

 

[slash22000]

Especially if your squeezing the crap out of your bag when sparging.

Myth. Squeezing the BIAB bag does not introduce tannins/astringency. Ever.

 

[Truman42]

Myth. Squeezing the BIAB bag does not introduce tannins/astringency. Ever.

When I biabed I used to squeeze the crap out of the bag to extract as much wort as possible and often got a high alcohol/ tannin sort of taste and was told it was astringency. Perhaps it was something else then.

 

[slash22000]

When I biabed I used to squeeze the crap out of the bag to extract as much wort as possible and often got a high alcohol/ tannin sort of taste and was told it was astringency. Perhaps it was something else then.

Tannins from grain comes from a combination of high pH and/or temps >85ºC. If you think about it logically, what exactly about the action of physically squeezing grain would start a chemical reaction that would change the taste?

 

[jaypes]

Especially if your squeezing the crap out of your bag when sparging.

I still squeeze the crap out of the bag after reading this as well, although it might look impressive me and the bag in what looks like something out of WWF - I have never found any astringent taste

But thats is becasue I have my very own grain mill thank to Mister Truman, great sir! And can control the crush

 

[jc64]

I agree with Tony.

You can get infections despite being super clean. Flowering and fruiting trees on or near your property can host microflora that can infect beer and once you get one, it can be hard to get rid of. It's worth eliminating the possibility anyway - that grist should give plenty of body.

Other thing to check is that your thermometer is calibrated properly and make sure you are not mashing much lower than you think you are.

I disagree with Pickaxe about the hops being the issue. Sure some late hops will stand out but you will still get flavour as well as bitterness from 60 and 40 minute additions and the thin body is not a hop issue.

Once you know your thermometer is working try this:

Tidy the brew area, clean all walls and floors with bleach solution, then a solution of boiling water, then starsan the whole area.

Make sure you crack your grain in a ventilated area away from your fermenting area.

Buy a brand new cube, drill it out and put in a brand new tap. Buy new transfer hoses. Break any ball valve taps apart and boil for 10 minutes in sodium percarbonate solution. Check for any visibe scunge - if clean, rinse well, boil again in clean water then sanitise. Clean and sanitise everything plastic with bleach solution, followed by a boiling water rinse, followed by a sodium metabisulphite rinse, followed by a clean water rinse followed by no rinse sanitiser.

Brew exactly one of your recipes again - the Rye IPA should be a goer. No chill and use two packets of fresh, dry US05 to inoculate when cool, directly into the cube. Shake it with the lid on tight as much as you can over the next 4-8 hours or until you see active fermentation start. Back the lid off a few turns and ferment. Clean and starsan any krausen leakage from the cube immediately.

When fermentation is complete, do not bulk prime or otherwise transfer the beer. Taste and see if there is any hint of thin/winelike etc. Bottle directly from here, using some new tube/bottling wand, bottles and a new bag of seals. Make up a boiling hot sugar solution with the right amount of sugar and dose each bottle with the appropriate amount using a brand new syringe (available from Grain and grape and probably other HB stores).

If this fixes your problem, there's a likely brewery infection from either nearby flora or from lacto from cracked/raw grain that has made its way into your fermenter or fermenting area. Discard all old plastic equipment, give the brewery another clean and hopefully all is good.

It's not BIAB, it's not no-chill and it's not your recipes.

And if this doesn't work call in a priest to exorcise your brew-house cause you are cursed like a motherf*&%$#!

 

[slash22000]

Pretty sure you can get ordained in a few minutes online these days. Do your own exorcism!

 

[tiprya]

I'd start by taking one of the beers you arn't happy with to Grain&Grape or an experienced brewer on here to confirm if it is thin body (from low OG) or an infection.

 

[jc64]

Good tip Tiprya. Would love to be in G&G when the beer is taken in, something like this - "Hello, I have this beer. I think it is infected, drink it and tell me" I wonder who will be the lucky employee .

It is a good idea to do this though, I'm sure you will told straight up what the issue is>

 

[Mizz]

sorry when I said "No OG was taken" I meant the OG was taken "measured"

The "No" part was in response to the latter half of the question - Was that OG/FG measured or software derived? confusing. Sorry.

I've decided to clean the hell out of my all my plastic equipment with bleach-then boiling water-then sodium metabisulfite-then soak in no rinse sanitiser overnight-then rinse again with boiling water. I'll make batch of beer I've made and see if I've fixed it.

Replacing everything plastic in my brewery would leave me with nothing but the Keggle.. and for all I know it was the tap on that that caused the infection!

thanks again guys. I'll let everyone know how it goes.

 

[BeerNess]

With your grain crush.. doing BIAB make sure G&G is milling it really fine, 0.9-1mm which makes a huge difference, I've found much greater success with BIAB mashing at 68-69, but that's just me probably.

Hope you find the gremlin!

 

[tiprya]

Yeah 65-66 is on the lower end for body - doesn't explain a lack of hop flavour though, you definitely put enough in.

 

[jc64]

sorry when I said "No OG was taken" I meant the OG was taken "measured"

The "No" part was in response to the latter half of the question - Was that OG/FG measured or software derived? confusing. Sorry.

I've decided to clean the hell out of my all my plastic equipment with bleach-then boiling water-then sodium metabisulfite-then soak in no rinse sanitiser overnight-then rinse again with boiling water. I'll make batch of beer I've made and see if I've fixed it.

Replacing everything plastic in my brewery would leave me with nothing but the Keggle.. and for all I know it was the tap on that that caused the infection!

thanks again guys. I'll let everyone know how it goes.

Just remember the exorcism then and you will be fine

 

[Mizz]

Thanks again,

Nick JD- Yeah I've been cleaning my taps just not taking them apart, but I'm fairly thorough. I do it until i can't see anymore discolouration then run the sanitiser through it for 60 seconds or so.. Ps I've opened and cleaned them now.

Bradsbrew- I get a solid rolling boil but i do keep the lid on half way to keep it there.. No drips go back in and I lose about 3-4 litres of a 27-28 litre boil. I don't think It's dms. Corn like flavour? No.

tiprya- I'll definitely be taking a few into grain and grape, and yes I can't wait to see and hear what they have to say.. I'll aso raise the mash temp for the next one and see how I go..

beerness- I'll ask the guys about the crush but i assume they crush good enough.. wouldn't be causing me any big issues.

Ps I'll post a recipe soon and would love some feedback.

 

[doon]

Dont most people double crush with biab? If you are just getting a standard crush from g&g maybe that coukd be contributing?