Mor Powa

[Joe Palooka]

I want to make a Pale Ale, I guess American/Belgian, but I want to get a bit of malt power, but without caramelly-ness, and without going over 1.050.

So I'm thinking how can I push the pale malt to the front, wihout burying it under crystal, but keep American hoppiness and medium gravity?

I thought I could use a strong malt (Maris Otter 100%), clean bittering hop (35 IBU), no flovour hop addition at all, but a good 30g slug of Cascade in the whirlpool for aroma (5 IBU). Maybe even a bit of coriander in the whirlpool to get the nose's attention.

My perception is that the hop flavour addition is occupying the place in a taste spectrum where I want to taste pale malt. I want the hops in the bitterness and in the finish, not the body.

How does it sound?

 

[razz]

perhaps just use bittering addition and save the aroma addition for the keg or if bottling, add to fermenter after primary.P

 

[Joe Palooka]

perhaps just use bittering addition and save the aroma addition for the keg or if bottling, add to fermenter after primary.P

Yes, right. Haven't dry hopped before. Didn't think of it. I have been brewing with fuggles a lot, and I'm getting tired of the sometimes 'grassy' aspect. Grassy is not what I'm after.

The Ray Daniels book (I think) warns about grassiness from dry hopping, but doesn't say how to avoid it.

Do you have pointers?

Cheers.

 

[Supra-Jim]

I believe the grassy, or vegetal flavours come from extended dry hopping. Maybe try dry hopping for 3-4 days.

:icon_cheers: SJ

 

[newguy]

Try adding all your hops for the last 45 minutes of the boil only. It produces a nice malty beer with a decent hop flavour and aroma. Let it ferment almost to completion & sample; if the hop aroma isn't to your expectations, dry hop with a modest amount (15 - 30g for ~20l).

 

[Kai]

All Maris Otter sounds good, you could also mix it up with a healthy chunk of light munich, a smaller chunk of dark munich or a tiny chunk of melanoidin.

 

[Joe Palooka]

Try adding all your hops for the last 45 minutes of the boil only. It produces a nice malty beer with a decent hop flavour and aroma. Let it ferment almost to completion & sample; if the hop aroma isn't to your expectations, dry hop with a modest amount (15 - 30g for ~20l).

It's a good plan that comes with backups. The current Brew Your Own has an American pale ale article that suggests what you say. (Actually that article was probably where I read warnings about dry hop grassiness). Ok so I can think about accentuating malt in terms of reducing boil-bitterness (rather than flavour hopping). Thanks!

 

[Swinging Beef]

The Ray Daniels book (I think) warns about grassiness from dry hopping, but doesn't say how to avoid it.
Do you have pointers?

Avoid dry hop grassy notes, by making hop tea additions to 2ndary.
Use the highest alpha hop that takes your fancy, as this way, you are adding less vegetal matter to the brew, and more AA.

 

[Kai]

You're not after alpha acids when dry hopping though. A good aroma variety with high oil content is what you're after, and potentially also avoiding specific varieties that are more likely to impart grassy notes (eg saaz).

 

[Joe Palooka]

All Maris Otter sounds good, you could also mix it up with a healthy chunk of light munich, a smaller chunk of dark munich or a tiny chunk of melanoidin.

I have had pale ale success with melanoidin, it's a good idea. Melanoidin is "super" munich? I am just starting to drink an oatmeal stout that is 85% Maris Otter, 10% roast barley, 5% oats. Hops were just 30IBU Fuggles @ 60 min., and 5 IBU or so at 5 min. After making several hop hammer type beers, it is kind of a revelation to get the taste of pale malt right up the front. So now I want to do the same with a pale ale. I want hops AND malt

 

[muckanic]

If you want it pale and malty, then I have tended to find there is no substitute for decoction. Well there is, but it involves pressure cooking some or all of the wort at a high gravity (like the first runnings from the mash tun).

Hop flowers, even when shredded, are a lot less herbaceous than pellets when dry-hopped. For that matter, I find that even the greenest pellets can give an oxidised cardboard note as a bittering hop. I hate 'em, and regard their introduction as a backwards step.