Mash Paddle 2007, Is It A Lager, An Ale? - It's A Kolsch!

[Aaron]

The only time I have gotten my hands on a real Kolsch, ie one from Kln it came via the International Beer Shop in Perth. I think you are unlikely to find one in a bottle shop around Adelaide.

 

[Ross]

You also don't want the diacetyl that us 56 produces.

Not a problem I've ever had with US-56, but agree diacetyl is not wanted in the style.

cheers Ross

 

[Kai]

The closest I can get to putting my finger on it is it's a winey character, like a fairly light and slightly fruity white. Doesn't sound good in a beer but is incredibly pleasant in a good koelsch.

 

[wee stu]

The only time I have gotten my hands on a real Kolsch, ie one from Cologne it came via the International Beer Shop in Perth. I think you are unlikely to find one in a bottle shop around Adelaide.

Phil, at Goodwood Cellars showed me an importers list that included a Kolsch on it, he didin't get it simply because he did not now how well it would sell, and to be fair he was aware of kolsch freshness issues, and he didn't want it to hang around on the shelves.

Maybe a few Croweater AHBers should lobby Phil, and maybe the guys at hamoods plonk. Between us, I am sure we could guarantee sales of a couple of cartons for them

With summer coming on, maybe some regulars could even put a word in Jade's ear at the Wheaty?

Pulled together, the Adelaide AHB creew probably have more clout than we realise.

I'll also have a chat to my mate Brenton at Empire L:qour and see if he can pull in any for us.

 

[Aaron]

You also don't want the diacetyl that us 56 produces.

Not a problem I've ever had with US-56, but agree diacetyl is not wanted in the style.

Interesting. Every beer I have had that has been made with us56, not just my own, has diacetyl. I find that it's one of it's signatures. The only way to really mask it seems to be really high hopping rates. That said I have only brewed with it myself a couple of times.

 

[warrenlw63]

The closest I can get to putting my finger on it is it's a winey character, like a fairly light and slightly fruity white. Doesn't sound good in a beer but is incredibly pleasant in a good koelsch.

Totally agree.

I find the yeast lends a very subtle, pleasant grape/bready character to the finished beer. Nothing in a Kolsch jumps out and grabs you. It's just the nice delicate blend of flavours that make it differ from your average pale lagers and make it a barely discernable ale.

Warren -

 

[Edgecliff Brewer]

Was reading Ray Daniel's "Designing Great Beers" last night. He says that the Kolsch style is not well documented and has only been an identifiable style since the 19th C. Some of its characteristics are:
- Kolsch yeast is important, or a clean German ale yeast that is highly attenuative that accentuates the malt.
- There is little or no hop aroma or flavour. Hops, particularly Spalt, are used for bittering only.
- Simple grain bill - use pilsener or ale malt. Crystal is not really true-to-style. Wheat can be used in small quantities
- Sacchrification to occur at 63-65 degrees C to get a higly fermentable wort

You also have to keep the fermentation temp low. Basically treat it like a lager and condition it like a lager (although a little warmer). With a whole year to go, this looks like a real challenge!

 

[Alien boy]

Weyermann site link

 

[goatherder]

I just raced out and grabbed a bottle of Kppers Klsch.

http://beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/13789/30279

It's got no date on it except for "use by october 2007" on the importers sticker. I hope it's fresh enough to give me a feel for what an authentic Kln version is like. I'll give it a taste later tonight perhaps...


edit: fixed dumb mistake

 

[Ross]

Weyermann site link

Well there's another dried yeast to throw into the mix - S33 :blink: - Anyone per chance tried this in a Kolsch??

cheers Ross...

 

[AndrewQLD]

I have posted this link before when I brewed my first Kolsch, but I can't be bothered looking for the thread.
Kolsch
A very interesting, informative and I believe accurate description of the style with some good info on ingredients. Requires a delicate hand as far as hops go, Definately not a style for the hop heads.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Ross]

Nice article Andrew - I see it confirms the use of yeasts not normally associated with a kolsch

"Yeast Most good high-attenuating Ale yeasts can be used to make a decent Klsch-style beer. Wyeast 2565 is specifically designed for Klsch-style beer, as is White Labs Klsch (reportedly from PJ Frh). 1007 German Ale is another good choice, and even 1338 European Ale or Chico 1056 can be used. Basically anything that can ferment very clean at room temperatures strong esters are verboten in Klsch and can attenuate in the 80-85% range."

cheers Ross

 

[AndrewQLD]

Nice article Andrew - I see it confirms the use of yeasts not normally associated with a kolsch

"Yeast Most good high-attenuating Ale yeasts can be used to make a decent Klsch-style beer. Wyeast 2565 is specifically designed for Klsch-style beer, as is White Labs Klsch (reportedly from PJ Frh). 1007 German Ale is another good choice, and even 1338 European Ale or Chico 1056 can be used. Basically anything that can ferment very clean at room temperatures strong esters are verboten in Klsch and can attenuate in the 80-85% range."

cheers Ross

Very true Ross, while I can't speak for us-56 I can say that the white labs dry english ale yeast is great for this style, very clean fermenting attenuates very well and best of all flocculates like nothing else.
I would be brewing this beer a few times before entering in a comp as it is very hard to perfect. Slight differences in recipes and brewing style make huge differences in the finished beer, and fermentation temps are crucial too.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Aaron]

I am going to be a decenter on this one. Admittedly I have only tried a couple of Kolsch's but I just can't imagine getting that true character from anything but one of the Kolsch/German Ale yeasts.

That said looking at the BJCP style guide you could produce something to hit the style guide perfectly with any highly attenuative and reasonably clean yeast so they would probably be suitable for competition. If you are brewing for the comp you woul probably be best off with something like 007 which is highly attenuative and very flocculant.

 

[Doc]

Kolsch is a style that I've researched a lot, and brewed a lot.
I have however never had the pleasure of going to Cologne and having a fresh biergarten Kolsch, so what I perceive as a perfect Kolsch maybe inheritantly flawed.
I've even brewed the historical version (Hop Bitter Lager Bier) from the Kolsch style series book.
I feel even more research is necessary for me to enter the mash paddle next year. Really hope the judges are up to the same research.

Doc

 

[Aaron]

Kolsch is a style that I've researched a lot, and brewed a lot.
I have however never had the pleasure of going to Cologne and having a fresh biergarten Kolsch, so what I perceive as a perfect Kolsch maybe inheritantly flawed.
I've even brewed the historical version (Hop Bitter Lager Bier) from the Kolsch style series book.
I feel even more research is necessary for me to enter the mash paddle next year. Really hope the judges are up to the same research.

Doc

It would be nice if it were to be judged against a a more traditional style guide. However, the guide used will be something similar to the BJCP guide. Which doesn't really capture Kolsch in my opinion. However, I don't think I would be up for writing it either. If you, or anyone else for that matter, have thoughts on the style guide that should be used please share.

 

[goatherder]

[
It would be nice if it were to be judged against a a more traditional style guide. However, the guide used will be something similar to the BJCP guide. Which doesn't really capture Kolsch in my opinion. However, I don't think I would be up for writing it either. If you, or anyone else for that matter, have thoughts on the style guide that should be used please share.

Can you give us a link to a style guide other than BCJP? I'd be keen to see the differences.

 

[Kai]

My guess is that a clean neutral koelsch brewed with something other than the koelsch whitelabs or wyeast will do well, but will be pipped by any equally good beers that do include those winey flavours.

 

[Aaron]

Can you give us a link to a style guide other than BCJP? I'd be keen to see the differences.

That is the problem. There isn't one that i know of. I am certainly not qualified to write one either.

 

[goatherder]

Can you give us a link to a style guide other than BCJP? I'd be keen to see the differences.

That is the problem. There isn't one that i know of. I am certainly not qualified to write one either.

Me neither

OK, so how would a european HB comp Kolsch be judged? surely not by BJCP?