Keg King ROBOBREW 35L SINGLE VESSEL BREWERY

[Dinham]

I don't whirlpool anymore (other than the action of running the pump whilst chilling).

Do you have the original model with 3.5L dead space or the newer one with 1.75L?

The would obviously effect the need to whirlpool quite a lot.

 

[cliffo]

Do you have the original model with 3.5L dead space or the newer one with 1.75L?

I've got the original model so I guess it would make a bit of a difference.

 

[takai]

Almost a boil over

Slightly off topic, but is that the Mangrove Jacks hop spider? If so how do you find it, and where did you get it from?

 

[Exile]

Slightly off topic, but is that the Mangrove Jacks hop spider? If so how do you find it, and where did you get it from?

Yep got it from here http://www.ibrew.com.au/products/mangrove-jacks-hop-spider
Does the job well and doesn't tend to block up like the KegKing one.

 

[Dinham]

Right well I just did my second robobrew batch. I avoided the compacted grain bed issue I had on my first run by using 300g of rice hulls and mashing out at 77C. I poured my vorlaf very, very slowly. Flowed nice any easy this time.

The big problem I had was I ended up with a metric ****-tonne of hop matter in my fermenter, once again. I stirred a whirlpool about as vigorously as humanly possible and let it sit for 30 minutes. It looked nice and settled / clear on the top. As I started (very, very slowly) draining into the fermenter there was a heap of hop matter coming through, so I sanitized a kitchen strainer and ran it through that. After the first couple of liters it came through nice and clear, and then after about 10 liters it got real cloudy again. Took about 40 minutes to run it through the strainer as I needed to constantly unclog it with a sanitized spoon. This recipe had 110g of hops in the boil. I guess I’m going to have to buy a hop spider or figure out a racking arm solution. Kind of annoying but I don’t see any way around it. I’m going to have to siphon this batch out of my bucket fermenter and as I’m not a carboy user I don’t currently own an auto siphon.

Interestingly, as with my first batch, I’m down about 2L into the fermenter from what I was expecting. On the first batch I assumed it was from the added absorption of a very clogged grain bed, but that didn’t happen this time. I’m using BeerSmith for my calculations and I’ve plugged in accurate dead space and boil off. I’ve not gotten better than 65% efficiency so far. Was aiming for 0.060 and even with my missing 2L I ended up on 0.056.

I guess I’ll try a pump to see if that helps with efficiency.

I'm not really loving my robobrew experience at this stage.

 

[keifer33]

Can you post up a screenshot of your Beersmith profile?

 

[SBOB]

Right well I just did my second robobrew batch. I avoided the compacted grain bed issue I had on my first run by using 300g of rice hulls and mashing out at 77C. I poured my vorlaf very, very slowly. Flowed nice any easy this time.

The big problem I had was I ended up with a metric ****-tonne of hop matter in my fermenter, once again. I stirred a whirlpool about as vigorously as humanly possible and let it sit for 30 minutes. It looked nice and settled / clear on the top. As I started (very, very slowly) draining into the fermenter there was a heap of hop matter coming through, so I sanitized a kitchen strainer and ran it through that. After the first couple of liters it came through nice and clear, and then after about 10 liters it got real cloudy again. Took about 40 minutes to run it through the strainer as I needed to constantly unclog it with a sanitized spoon. This recipe had 110g of hops in the boil. I guess I’m going to have to buy a hop spider or figure out a racking arm solution. Kind of annoying but I don’t see any way around it. I’m going to have to siphon this batch out of my bucket fermenter and as I’m not a carboy user I don’t currently own an auto siphon.

Interestingly, as with my first batch, I’m down about 2L into the fermenter from what I was expecting. On the first batch I assumed it was from the added absorption of a very clogged grain bed, but that didn’t happen this time. I’m using BeerSmith for my calculations and I’ve plugged in accurate dead space and boil off. I’ve not gotten better than 65% efficiency so far. Was aiming for 0.060 and even with my missing 2L I ended up on 0.056.

I guess I’ll try a pump to see if that helps with efficiency.

I'm not really loving my robobrew experience at this stage.

i would ignore efficiency for now and just work on getting the process sorted..making beer isn't suppose to be a pain in the a*s (well, mostly not)

- If you aim to do hop forward beers, a hop sock/hop spider is a decent investment especially if you are worried about a bit of hops making its way into the fermenter (personally, for your first few batches I wouldnt stress it..it will settle out into the crap you leave in the fermenter anyway. )
- calculate your efficiency for the last brew and use that on your next beer smith recipe and see if you hit the predicted numbers. The difference between a 60% efficiency and 80% efficiency in a robobrew batch would be about $1 worth of grain. I'll take consistently repeatable results for a $1 over trying to reach some arbitrary efficiency (especially as you are having the brew shop do the crush you have less control over one of those variables)

 

[ctagz]

Yeah robo brew looks great. All systems have teething issues. Regarding efficiency, your crush will have most effect, then secondly different brands have found to give higher efficiency too (gladfield was mentioned specifically). Ive never really worried about the colour/opaqueness of wort going into fermenter. in the end it all settles and clear beer off the top.

you could try skimming break off the top before the boil. It looks like coffee crema, skim it out and you should have less break in the bottom after boil. Also didnt read if you used whirlfloc, stuff is cheap and worth a try, I noticed a difference.

Ive read that some of the break material is beneficial for yeast nutrition. At the end of the day Ive made nice beers with cloudy af wort. Im currently shooting for 70% and not fussed, i just wanna avoid astringent flavours so im not going hard on the sparge either

 

[Dinham]

Can you post up a screenshot of your Beersmith profile?

Here it is. Any advice appreciated! Keep in mind I have the newer version with lower tap giving me 1.75L of dead space and not 3.5L.

 

[Dinham]

Yeah robo brew looks great. All systems have teething issues. Regarding efficiency, your crush will have most effect, then secondly different brands have found to give higher efficiency too (gladfield was mentioned specifically). Ive never really worried about the colour/opaqueness of wort going into fermenter. in the end it all settles and clear beer off the top.

you could try skimming break off the top before the boil. It looks like coffee crema, skim it out and you should have less break in the bottom after boil. Also didnt read if you used whirlfloc, stuff is cheap and worth a try, I noticed a difference.

Ive read that some of the break material is beneficial for yeast nutrition. At the end of the day Ive made nice beers with cloudy af wort. Im currently shooting for 70% and not fussed, i just wanna avoid astringent flavours so im not going hard on the sparge either

My malts were:

Gladfield Crystal Dark Malt
Gladfield Ale Malt
Briess Rye Malt
Briess Caramel Malt 60L

And the crush was 1.2mm from my LHBS. Should I go courser? Finer?

I did use Whirlfoc.

On my first batch I didn't worry about how much hop matter got into the fermenter as I don't really care about clarity, but because I was using a bucket fermenter with a tap at the bottom, even after a 3 day cold crash I still go so much trub into my keg that it clogged the liquid out poppet. So now I'm very aware of how much hop matter is getting into the fermenter!

 

[Dinham]

i would ignore efficiency for now and just work on getting the process sorted..making beer isn't suppose to be a pain in the a*s (well, mostly not)

- If you aim to do hop forward beers, a hop sock/hop spider is a decent investment especially if you are worried about a bit of hops making its way into the fermenter (personally, for your first few batches I wouldnt stress it..it will settle out into the crap you leave in the fermenter anyway. )
- calculate your efficiency for the last brew and use that on your next beer smith recipe and see if you hit the predicted numbers. The difference between a 60% efficiency and 80% efficiency in a robobrew batch would be about $1 worth of grain. I'll take consistently repeatable results for a $1 over trying to reach some arbitrary efficiency (especially as you are having the brew shop do the crush you have less control over one of those variables)

I'm only stressing about the hop matter making it into the fermenter because I don't want clogged kegs again! That was a pain in the ass. I guess I need to either get a spider or sihpon off the top rather than try and use my fermenter's tap.

Is 110g a large amount of hops in a boil?

 

[SBOB]

Is 110g a large amount of hops in a boil?

I would put it in the 'above average amount' category

 

[quadbox]

I'm only stressing about the hop matter making it into the fermenter because I don't want clogged kegs again! That was a pain in the ass. I guess I need to either get a spider or sihpon off the top rather than try and use my fermenter's tap.

Is 110g a large amount of hops in a boil?

Which yeast was that with? Pellet hops? or are you using flowers or plugs? I pretty frequently dry hop directly in the fermenter, just throwing pellets in there bare, and havent had issues with a blocked corny keg in years. Just crash chill it and the hop matter settles out faster than the yeast does, the yeast cake traps it

 

[Exile]

Here it is. Any advice appreciated! Keep in mind I have the newer version with lower tap giving me 1.75L of dead space and not 3.5L.

You might want to watch Gash's Video on working out the ROBOBREW - GRAINFATHER Water Calculations - Mash & Sparge or you can try my Beersmith Profile here http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/88340-keg-king-robobrew-35l-single-vessel-brewery/?p=1368088

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQd7KOTBHIA

 

[Elz]

With the 'original' RB and 3.5 lt dead space I reckon 100+ grams of hops is not an issue. The newer RB ?may struggle with this amount of hops. I often use 150 plus grams of hops with no problem (probably have less brewhouse efficiency)
Cheers
Elz

 

[CheekyPanda]

So I've done two brews now,

The whole process is pretty easy. Chilling is the biggest hassle.

On the second attempt I jammed an esky full of ice and made a slurry. Then coiled the hose in it so the full hose apart from where it connects to the chiller and tap was in the esky. This worked much quicker in bringing the temperature down much quicker but it still struggled once it got to about 25.

The other issue I have is that both times my OG was below what Beersmith said I should get by about 10 points. Is this because i don't recirc with a pump during mash?

I am sparging with about 3ltrs of 77 degree water after vorlauf.

Apart from just upping the grain bill to get the target gravity is there something I should be doing?

Thanks in advance.

 

[TwoCrows]

Quote: I am sparging with about 3ltrs of 77 degree water after vorlauf.

Are you using the Robobrew as a mash tun?

Recirculating your wort thru the grain bed and removing your wort into a secondary vessel and then sparging ?? This is Vorlauf.

My understanding using the Robobrew ( single vessel) is after mashing time is over you only lift the grain tube and sparge.
Sounds like you require more sparge water,You need to rinse the grain more , have you looked at the above post, # 283. Gash slug and his water use table.

From what I have viewed and read regarding the Robobrew , recirculating the wort via a pump to get flow thru the grain and even conversion temperatures is the way to go.
If you want to have multiply mash in temperatures , then recalculation is needed.
Protein rest , mash , mash out. Then sparge.

 

[CheekyPanda]

Yeah I'm running it back through the grain bed and then draining it into a big pot. I'm only doing 10ltr batches as I only have the small coopers fermenter. I then sparge into the robobrew and then re-add the stuff I've drained off.

I'm not sure what the technical term for that would be, or even if I should do it that way!

 

[TwoCrows]

Dinham , When you transfer your wort to the fermenter you could try using a strainer of even the hop spider. Control the transfer of wort and if necessary stop and clean strainer and continue, should be able to stop a lot of unwanted for little extra work.

Just a thought....

 

[Dinham]

Dinham , When you transfer your wort to the fermenter you could try using a strainer of even the hop spider. Control the transfer of wort and if necessary stop and clean strainer and continue, should be able to stop a lot of unwanted for little extra work.

Just a thought....

Cheers TwoCrows. That's actually what I did on my second batch (mentioned one page back). Now it's all settled out I've realised I do have far less hop matter than in the first batch, so it's been somewhat successful.

I was trying to keep my operation as stripped back as possible but I am going to have to add a hop spider. I like IPAs.

 

[TwoCrows]

Sorry mate I missed that you did use a strainer to help out reducing hop matter.
I read all the pages pretty quick and missed that.

I really want to step into AG brewing and as stated this is the cheapest unit on the market.
Get your mill of grains around 1.2 mm , maybe som rice hulls to help sparge

I still have concerns that there is not enough room in the vessel for a boil and 23 litre fermentation. That's what I am looking for !!

I do understand that you can add water to adjust up to 22 - 23 litres as long as you can achieve 1060 with 20-21 post boil in your fermenter.

Dinham IPA' s rock.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Yeah I'm running it back through the grain bed and then draining it into a big pot. I'm only doing 10ltr batches as I only have the small coopers fermenter. I then sparge into the robobrew and then re-add the stuff I've drained off.

I'm not sure what the technical term for that would be, or even if I should do it that way!

I think you definitely need to be re-circulating your wort during mash (even if only manually every 15mins with a jug). I have also found that agitating/stirring the grain 2-3 times during the mash helps me hit my target OG. Just make sure you do this before your last re-circ so that you can clear out the wort somewhat.

If you just did the above along with sparge and didn't worry about the other stuff you are doing you should be able to hit your numbers.

 

[CheekyPanda]

Thanks for the tips Bob.

I'll change up how I'm doing it and report back.

 

[mkstalen]

Anyone got a line on when the bigger version might be available?

 

[buckerooni]

Rang KK about a week ago, still in prototype stage was my understanding, with no ETA on shipping the final product, 2-3 months away at least.

Getting impatient, I'm gonna DIY one instead, with brauduino controller and a 100L pot to build my own 1V recirc.

 

[Dinham]

Rang KK about a week ago, still in prototype stage was my understanding, with no ETA on shipping the final product, 2-3 months away at least.

Getting impatient, I'm gonna DIY one instead, with brauduino controller and a 100L pot to build my own 1V recirc.

This has been the reply for at least 6 months.

 

[Siborg]

I put a touch over 7Kg of grains in this the other day with 20L of strike water. It was cutting it fine. Wouldn't want to put too much more than 8Kg in this.

The thing I noted was I lost out massively on efficiency. My previous brews were heaps better. I haven't done the maths, but I was estimating 1.069-1.070 and only got 1.062. The last few I've done I've been within 1-2 points. The only other thing I did differently was slightly more mash in water than normal. I think, the most I've gone is 18L with 6ish Kg of grain. But if you look at it as a ratio, I normally shoot for 3litres per kilo. So maybe I was a tad under? I can't remember which way grist to water ratio affects efficiency....

 

[Stu Brew]

Just finished my second brew with the Robobrew. Easy enough. Got my winch hooked up so I dont have to lift silly amounts of wet grain.

Just one thing. Has anyone had trouble getting their robobrew passed 100 degrees? The ambient temp is around 15 atm. I have done two boils and both of them have not gone any higher on the digital guage passed 100.....I have no insulation on yet but Ill add some. Just wondering if anyone else has had this problem?

 

[gap]

was the boil vigorous?
How high above sea level is the Adelaide Hills?????

 

[Stu Brew]

was the boil vigorous?
How high above sea level is the Adelaide Hills?????

Yeah it was a vigerous boil. Ive been using the wifes deep fry temp guage and its been sitting on a steady 102 at the top.

We're about 400m above sea level here and im running it in a shed with 3 phase power running off a 25amp fuse so power shouldnt be a problem....although the shed wiring is a tad dodgy!

Give me a min Ill dig up a photo....