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ESB bavarian wheat is one of the best kits around.
Other than dry hopping or using better yeast, leave this one alone.
It will taste brilliant!
Did you use the dry yeast supplied?

I brewed it (admittedly years ago, when the lhbs stocked it) with W3056 yeast, as it was labelled as Bavarian.

Anyway, I got a load of hop flavour which hung around, almost to the last bottle, which overpowered any Bavarian flavour from the yeast.
It may have been that I was used to more subtlety, or that I was expecting a certain style.

My friends enjoyed it, but I cared little for it. It was always a bit scary for my taste-buds.

SO, ...please be aware of mis-labelling, and don't rely on the name. Check the ingredients and description of what the beer should turn out to be. Labelling can be misleading, with the prime example of Victoria Bitter, which is not a bitter, and some might say that it's not a lager either (dog's bath water, perhaps?) :rolleyes:
 
When I was just messing around a couple of months ago and getting back into brewing I did a Coopers Stout and accidentally put in 2 kilos of raw sugar. It fermented out fine in about ten days and ended up fairly thin tasting and dry, not to mention feral strength! I have a javascript alcohol calculator I got off the net which calculates that 3kg of sugar in 25 L will produce 9% so the 2kg of sugar plus whatever is the dry weight of fermentables in a Coopers kit should at least hit 9% and the ale yeast handled it just fine.

The only way I could drink it was to cut it in the jug with a Tallie of Carlton Mid :icon_drool2:

I think you need a new calculator...

3.7kg of sugar (a 1.7kg kit and 2kg sugar) in 25L will only give you an sg of 1057

I've made a twocan coopers stout + 1kg dark malt a few times, and only mixed to 21L-22L and it comes in at just over 8%
 
Sorry, you're dead right, I misread the calculator, 3 kg should only give 7.1 (so the Coopers yeast wouldn't have been fazed !!)

If anyone's interested, here's the code, just copy it and insert into Notepad then save as alcstrength.html or whatever you feel like - as long as it's an .html and you can open it with Firefox or IE and it should run fine:

<html>
<center>
<h2><font color="#ff0000">Preparing a Sugar Based Wort</h2></font>


<form name="sc">
<center>
<table bgcolor="#add8e6" cellpadding="4" border="2" rules="none" bordercolor="black">
<tbody>
<tr>

<td colspan="3"><input size="4" value=" 5" name="a">
<select name="weight">
<option value="1">kg</option>
<option value="0.45359237">lb</option>
</select> sugar made up to
<input size="4" value=" 20" name="b">
<select name="amount">
<option value="1">L</option>

<option value="0.946352946">US qt</option>
<option value="3.7854118">US gal</option>
</select> total volume
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">should have an SG <input size="5" name="s"> and only require
<input size="5" name="wreq">

<select name="wreqt">
<option value="1">L</option>
<option value="1.05668820943">US qt</option>
<option value="0.264172052358">US gal</option>
</select> of water
</td>
</tr>


<tr>
<td> and should produce a wort of <input size="5" name="at"> % alcohol
</td>

<td align="right" valign="bottom"> <input onclick="
x=sc.a.value*sc.weight.value;
y=sc.b.value*sc.amount.value;
sc.s.value=Math.round(((258.6+(87.96*x/y))+Math.sqrt(66874+(7736.96*x*x/(y*y))+(57947*x/y)))/517.2 *1000)/1000;
sc.wreq.value= Math.round(((y * sc.s.value) - x)*sc.wreqt.value*100)/100;
sc.at.value=Math.round(sc.a.value*sc.weight.value*1000/17/(sc.b.value*sc.amount.value)*10)/10;
"value="Calculate" tr="" type="button">
</td>
</tr>
</tbody></table></center>
</form>
</html>
 
Sorry, you're dead right, I misread the calculator, 3 kg should only give 7.1 (so the Coopers yeast wouldn't have been fazed !!)

If anyone's interested, here's the code, just copy it and insert into Notepad then save as alcstrength.html or whatever you feel like - as long as it's an .html and you can open it with Firefox or IE and it should run fine:
inline code! my teacher would have a fit :p


i understood from the AHB wiki article that table sugar would make it too sweet, or is it closer to pure chance whats gonna be in it?

dose anyone know what % the average kit yest will last up to?

i was thinking of doing an ultra strong cheep batch for my birthday, though i guess i shouldn't go nuts, above 8% will probably make it undrinkable

EDIT: also when you guys say drinkable are we talking VB drinkable, budweiser drinkable or red bitter "drinkable"
 
No the less I am doing a Farmland Larger Toucan with good Pilsner (lager) yeast. Will advise how it goes.

First taste while racked to a cube is it is very bitter with out that much flavour. Might need to do a hop boil with the priming sugar.

Is this a new idea to save a not so hoppy beer?
 
I'll be kegging my Brigalow and white sugar el cheapo brew. I'll give my opinion in a
couple of weeks.


I might have to disqualify myself, the yeast in the kit didn't show much signs of life after
38 hours, so, being an impatient bastard, I added some wort from my other carboy which was brewing a Coopers Euro lager. Bubbling along nicely now. Got the heater on this one, constant 21, so see how the lager yeast at this temp affects the taste, but the 'el cheapo' experiment is screwed.

What happens when you introduce another yeast strain?. Do they intermingle :eek: , or does one take over completely, sort of a yeast type ethnic cleansing?

cheers
Dave
 
I don't ever knock K&K brewers. It's the starting point for many of us. Having said that, I don't think you will ever brew a batch with just a kit and 1kg which will equal the quality of what you can brew with a little more effort.

I now brew AG, but I really do think you can get close with unhopped extract, your own hops choice, good yeast, and controlled fermentation temperatures. If you are advanturous you can add some specialty grains.

One of my golfing compadres has recently got into K&K brewing. He has to date used just the kit and the 1kg white sugar. He asked me recently what is the deal with the BE1 and BE2 he sees in the supermarket. I explained he should see an improvement in the quality of his beers if he uses those or, if he likes some more malt character, he could use 1kg of dry malt extract.

Just to seal the deal, I've gave him some samples of an APA and a dunkelweizen. I haven't seen him since, but I'm looking forward to his feedback.

I gave some samples of a hefeweizen, American brown ale, and APA to another of my golfing mates. He enjoyed them and volunteered it's the first time ever he has drunk HB that doesn't taste like cider.

To get back on thread, I think the problem with a lot of the Brigalow kits is not necessarily due to the quality or otherwise of the kits, but the lousy 5 or 6 grams of generic yeast they supply. Stressed yeast at too high a temperature doesn't bode well for a good result.
 
I might have to disqualify myself, the yeast in the kit didn't show much signs of life after
38 hours, so, being an impatient bastard, I added some wort from my other carboy which was brewing a Coopers Euro lager.
cheers
Dave

Identical experience here. My Brigalow is STILL bubbling away slowly after 15 days. Like yours it was very sluggish to start. I reckon the yeast is designed to ferment at over 20 degrees here in Queensland for most of the year and the recent chilly snap (its been between 14 and 18 in my garage for a while) has just completely whacked the yeast. I warmed the fermenter up to about 22 for a couple of days and it really took off, but back to a slow bubble again now. I'll just let it take its course and eveeeeentually report on the brew. :rolleyes:

Haven't done the club gold yet as the Brigalow Bitter is 'squatting' in the fermenter. Have now obtained some Tettnang hops and might do an 'enhanced' brew with it and use one of my spare Morgans yeasts hanging around. Will still come in for less than about twelve bucks and see if that turns out more drinkable.

Edit: another of my blasts from the past: when I brewed in my previous life in Maryborough and Bundaberg it was a 'given' that you didn't bother brewing much between May and September because it was too cold. Yes we are talking Central Queensland here. And the only widely available brew kit in those days was Brigalow. Go figure as our American Cousins say B)
 
I don't ever knock K&K brewers. It's the starting point for many of us. Having said that, I don't think you will ever brew a batch with just a kit and 1kg which will equal the quality of what you can brew with a little more effort.


Warra,

That wasn't the point of this thread. We are trying to get an acceptable drop by the
cheapest method. We are referring to a previous post on another thread that this bloke reckons his mates raved on about his brew made with Brigalow and white sugar, so that is the experiment being conducted here, can we get a reasonably good el cheapo beer using the basic ingredients.

I normally never use white sugar, and prefer extra malt. The dextrose component is then computed at 37% of the total malt. I keg my brews and dry hop with Cluster.
Couldn't be bothered with AG, I am happy with the brews I am producing now.

Coopers Lager/ Real Ale, with extra malt and hops is a fine drop of ale, as far as I am concerned. Morgans also produce a very good brew.

'Orses for courses. B)

cheers
Dave
 
Identical experience here. My Brigalow is STILL bubbling away slowly after 15 days. Like yours it was very sluggish to start. I reckon the yeast is designed to ferment at over 20 degrees here in Queensland for most of the year and the recent chilly snap (its been between 14 and 18 in my garage for a while) has just completely whacked the yeast. I warmed the fermenter up to about 22 for a couple of days and it really took off, but back to a slow bubble again now. I'll just let it take its course and eveeeeentually report on the brew. :rolleyes:


Hi BG,

Yeah, slow as. I use 2 fermenters and 2 kegs, and have it worked out that the brew stays in the fermenter 14 days and is then kegged up. This lager yeast buggers up the time-table.

I have got this Brigalow clone, and a Coopers Euro Lager both bubbling away in the laundry, and my timetable is shot. Have to resort to some nice Coopers Bitter (made with an extra can of Coopers Dark Malt) for a couple of days. This will be hard to take. :rolleyes:

cheers
Dave.
 
My cheap benchmark brew was a Farmland lager $8 + 1kg Dextrose $2.44
Total cost $10.44 pretty damn cheep.
A drinkable brew , that is compared to my first 3 or 4 brews
which I used white sugar in. ;) (thats what the instructions say :lol: )
In fact all my first 12 brews came in under $16
Still cheap IMHO
Coopers or Tooheys on special $9 + Brew enhancer 1 $5.95
I have now raised the bar higher.
Cascade tins $10 + LDM 1kg $7.95 + Hops $5.95
Still under $25 for 23ltrs
Like some I do brew on a budget,that is instead of spending $35 a week
on commercial beer i buy $35 worth of homebrew gear.
With all the great info on here :beerbang: I can brew K&K and get something thats drinkable,
also have mates drinking it now.Also doesnt give me a bad head the next day. :party:

johnm64
 
Hops $5.95

:eek: :eek: Do you get them hand delivered by a Nubian Eunuch wearing silver slippers or something ???? :p

Try Craftbrewer (Sponsor) and you will get magnificent product for far less, I pay about a dollar for a K&K enhancement and up to three dollars for a good hop blast for a recipe extract brew. Check website :)
 
I would love to do all grain, including BIAB, but at the moment I can spare maybe half an hour tops to mix a kit, do some hop boiling while the grains steep etc. I don't have a couple of hours to a mash, bag or not, and don't have the equipment. And there is nobody within 50km that stocks grains. Yup and I don't intend to pay ten bucks per brew to have it couriered either. However with the kits available nowadays, as pointed out, good drinkable beer is available not only from kits but from extract recipe beers.

The point of this thread is to do some experiments to look at the rock bottom kit products and see if, at the end of the day, are they drinkable and do the $30 alternatives actually offer two or three times the value? It's just a 'diversion' from our usual kits n bits brews.

Not knocking BIAB: it has a strong following and good luck to them.
 
I have one suggestion for all in this thread brewing kits

BIAB


What's BIAB, I thought it was one of those upside down trees found up north. :huh:

Back to the el cheapo brew. A complete failure. I tossed it out yesterday, wort tasted worse than a warm VB. :icon_vomit: Using sugar and a cheap kit is a waste of time.

Youse can all now say "I told you so" :D

cheers,
Dave
 
AFAIK brew in a bag (BIAB) is where, instead of a dedicated mash tun, you mash the brew in a big nylon bag in a vessel and when it's mashed you withdraw it to leave the sweet wort in the vessel (presumably the boiling vessel) and sparge as you go to extract the sugars still clinging in the mash. Then fire up and boil. I used to do that in the 1970s in the UK in a Baby Burco boiler. Good system if you don't mind wrestling pillow sized bags of damp grain etc. Not sure how you ensure an even mash temperature, the burco could be set to 68 degrees or whatever and it would do a fair approximation. Other people used to do the bag in an esky and again it would do a reasonably good mash. Excellent system (on a small scale) for doing a partial. Might actually try the latter thing myself with a kilo of grain as it's only just a bit more work than using carapils or crystal malt.

On topic I bottled the Brigalow Bitter 2 days ago. Sneak taste was uninspiring, it reminded me - surprise surprise - of BRIGALOW home brew :lol: :lol: I'll crack one at the end of next week and see if it's drinkable. I cheated on the Brigalow Club Gold and pepped it up with some Tettnang pellets and used a spare Morgans Yeast. Going like a train with the better yeast. Still coming in for less than $12 and hopefully more drinkable so it's still in the race.

Seeing as you're a keg man, Dave, I don't blame you for chucking it as it would only have tied up a keg, on spec that it was going to improve to drinkable status. At least in my case it's only taking up room in some plastic :p
 
Bump:
Final Report on the Brigalow Bitter K&K

Objectives: After doing a series of Kits n Bits brews I was getting some really good results and producing very drinkable beers. However they were working out at up to $30 per brew. Was I getting real good value? Lets do a supermarket plain K&K to investigate.

Method: Brigalow Bitter plus a kilo of white sugar, using kit yeast. Cost under $12. Fermented at around 18 degrees.

Fermentation: Took 3 weeks. The rather pathetic little sprinkle of unidentified yeast took three days to kick off and the fermentation was unacceptably slow. By the end the beer had dropped almost bright despite a bloop every minute, so I bottled anyway.

Tasting notes: It's only just over a week in the bottle but has carbed up well in the PET and is crystal clear so tried it yesterday. For starters there's no chill haze as opposed to most Coopers. Probably, considering the amount of corn syrup in the kit, there's not much protein in the beer to chill up :lol:
Nose: no beer nose, no hop aroma at all.
First taste: Beer obviously has come out on specs as it is not infected or oxidized. It's sweet, then a cloying sensation, then a slightly bitter twang right at the back of the tongue, but not really hops. Other things are bitter of course like tea or coffee and it's supposed to be a beer, so you would expect to get some sort of bitterness. And that's what you get, 'some sort of bitterness'
No malt characteristics.
A strange twang that I can't quite identify, maybe a cross between aniseed and nail polish. Obviously an ester. Not unpleasant but not beerlike.

Nice carbonation on the tongue, and then it hits me what the beer resembles. Have you ever tasted Tasman Bitter from Liquorland? That's bad enough but they now have a Tasman Gold (3.5%) and that's a really sad brew. Now, if you were to go down one peg in the food chain and imagine what a hypothetical Tasman Lite would taste like, this Brigalow would about fit the bill.

Being super bland but not too objectionable you would think that a few glasses would go down well as a lawnmower thirst quencher. Problem is that each subsequent glass the cloying sweetness and strange twang builds up so that eventually I think "I can't do this any more.. please let it stop :blink: :blink: "

BRILLIANT solution: I'm not going to throw the brew out, I put a dash of Chilled Roses yellow lime cordial in it and got the CLASSIC pommy lager and lime ladies drink from the 1970s. Tried it on the Mrs and stepdaughter and they liked it. 5% alcopop, basically.


Conclusion: Worst HB I've tasted. However I may be absolutely crazy but heck I might make this again coming up to Christmas with 2kg and turn it into cheap and easy Lemon Russkies etc :lol: . And use a Saflager as well.
 
Sounds exactly like the Coopers Draught the boys make at work on the sly in one of those big round Eskies at about 25C and an estimated kilo of white sugar.

My less than stellar bland brew also Brigalow I mix 50-50 with Coopers Stout makes up the volumes and tastes O.K. when you are not in the mood for a full on stout hit.
 
crap, my first ever brew is Brigalow Bitter :(

it's slowly fermenting now.
 

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