Just Put Down A Pilsner

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Greenslopes, Brisbane
After I put down the lager a few days ago, I was pretty bored today so and went and got another fermenter and the following ingredients:

Tin of Black Rock Pilsner
Safale Yeast
250 grams Caramalt crystal grain
30 grams Hallertau hop pellets
1 kg of dextrose

a couple of stuff ups ensued but I'll see how it turns out. The worst of the stuff ups is that the fermenter is 24.5 litres full which is 1.5 above recommended. hopefully the added hops and grain should balance this?!

trying to get it down to 18..20 degrees now...

man it's quiet in here this weekend! guess everyone is drinking beer...
Coodgee said:
man it's quiet in here this weekend! guess everyone is drinking beer...
Or everyone is busy brewing :D

Sounds like you are on the way with the obession with another fermenter :p

Brew on Coodgee.

I know I'm here coz I'm still waiting on my sour mash that I didn't start early enough this week.

Life happens at its own pace out here in the bush, and a person can be inspired to brew when the fam is away, but beer must not be rushed.

BTW your beer may be a bit thin, but the taste will depend on how you used the hops. Did U boil them all, or add at knockout?
Although, most beer kits are not geneously hopped. U prob did the kit a favour either way.

So saith Seth
thanks for the input weizguy. when you say thin, do you mean the feel in the mouth? I would have thought the only thing that could be "thin" about a beer would be the flavour?

I boiled the hops in with the crystal grain for about 4-5 minutes. I guess I'll just wait and see what I end up with.

It may be both thin in the mouthfeel department and watery in flavour. The hops may add a bit of mouthfeel, flavour and aroma, but I wouldn't expect much extra body or flavour from the grain in such a short period.
The 1.7/1.8 kg kit cans need extra brewing sugars (liquid/dry malt extract or sucrose etc) to produce the normal alcohol content of about 5%, so U may have a light beer or midstrength on your hands (or in the fermentor).
Another important point is to avoid boiling grain. I know some recipes recommend it, but they are counting on you being unaware of what harsh tannin flavour tastes like. Grains should be steeped or mashed, never boiled; or U will likely get a mouth-drying astringent taste/feel to the beer. 5 min is not long enough to extract much of the caramelised sugars from the grain, I believe.
To make a better beer, time is an important ingredient. If you haven't got the time to do it right, don't expect it to reach its potential.
I apologise if this sounds like cricism, but I'm criticising your supplier, who should have told U this info. Never be afraid to ask questions where you shop for brewgear. If they don't give you the info, get it here b4 U brew. Knowledge is power, and Information = Better beer.
Hope I have helped. Contact me by PM or email if you wish

Hey seth, I really appreciate your feedback! I don't take any critisism badly as I know you are only trying to help.

I have since learnt from several sources that the grain should never be boiled. It is a mistake I guess I will just have to live with. I think I will still keep this beer and see how it turns, but it's a bit of a disapointment. Do you think 200 grams of grain boiled for a couple of minutes will make a huge difference in taste? I guess in my favour was that it was a very light coloured grain, compared to some others they had at the brew shop. less grain = less tannin?

I know this is a learning experience for me and I'm really glad this site is here because if it wasn't for blokes like you I would be boiling away my grain unawares for years!!

I have a mexican cerveza fermenting at the moment at 12 degrees with a saflager dried yeast. hopefully I will have at least one good batch. I think I will get the dry yeast brews right before I take on some wet yeast....

In your favour, a short boil would not extract too much tannin, and I believe that light grain has less tannin, anyway (as you mention).
I'm sure that you would have figured this out after a few brews anyway, but why wait.
I think I will get the dry yeast brews right before I take on some wet yeast....
Yep, I did the same thing with dry yeast until I could no longer resist the lure of real wheat beer flavour. And as they say, the rest is history.

Seth out
Sorry to hijack the thread. But i put down a British ale the other day, and also added crystal grains to it. Only about 150gms all up though. I boiled the water first, then took it off the heat, tossed in the grains, replaced the lid and let sit for about 1/2 hour. Will this still extract a tannin effect, or am i pretty safe in doing things this way?

Cheers, Rob
IIRC, any temp over 80C will start to extract tannin. With a small amount of grain for a relatively short time, I'd assume that you'd get more colour than flavour (including tannin).
Sounds like you may have used this technique before. If so, you tell me if the beer made your mouth dry or pucker.
Giddy up, Seth
berto, I've researched the topic a fair bit since my ill-fated boil last night. Most of the recipes recommend a style similar to what you did with your ale. I mean I am obviously completely unexperienced but from all the advise I have been given over the last 24 hours I would probably do it pretty much the way you described next time I add some crystal grain.

I did a little experiment today to try to make myself feel better:

I boiled up a pot of water with about 250 ml of water. I got it to boiling and then added a handful of crystal grain, in a cotton net thing. I let it boil for three minutes and took it off the heat. I removed the net of grain and poured the water into a cup.

I then repeated the same procedure but I took the pot off the stove before it started to boil, and added my bag of grain after a minute of cooling. I let it soak for 15 minutes and poured the resulting liquid into a cup.

after they both cooled a bit, I sampled each one. The boiled broth tasted like a tea of sorts. A certain amount of sweetness but definately a tanniny taste almost similar to black tea. The other broth was definately sweeter and tasted more malty, and while the tannin taste was still present to some extent, it was less obvious.

Overall though I think there was not a "HUGE" difference in taste. I think the more malty broth was better but it wasn't like the boiled broth was revolting.

IF my experiment was a good model of what I did last night, and considering I only gently boiled my 200grams of grain for a couple of minutes, I think I should still turn out with an ok beer.. maybe with a unique taste! ( I have to be optimistic after all!)

This whole episode has been a great learning experience and that's what it's all about really!
Never tried this before. Was my first crack at extract. Only used pots, so temp would have dropped off pretty quick hopefully. Will be sure not to use such hot water next time.
Taste in the fermenter isnt dry at all though, so heres hoping

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