Infection In Secondary?

[Inge]

I racked off a Belgian Wit and have kept it in secondary for the last 2 weeks or so, and I noticed a white scum ring from the outside of the fermenter.

I eased the lid off and had a quick peek and found that there was a strange scum layer on the top of the wort; I have included pictures.

There are no particularly odd smells and it tastes pretty good, but I have never seen this kind of scum before.
I am inclined to think that it may just be dead yeast, but I can't rule out the beginning of an infection.

I was going to bottle it today, will it be ok? Will I need to add fresh yeast to the bottle?

 

[wildschwein]

Did you use a Belgian yeast strain for this or was it a wheat yeast of some sort? If so this maybe normal.

 

[tangent]

tip it
it's infected
you're likely to get bottle bombs if you don't tip it.

 

[Inge]

tip it
it's infected
you're likely to get bottle bombs if you don't tip it.

I used safale K97 for the yeast.

 

[wildschwein]

Oh right, you may be infected then. It can be hard to tell with wheats though because they're usually pretty sour anyway.

 

[Inge]

Bugger, that's a shame. I was looking forward to this one.

Strange, I took every precaution during the sanitising and the racking stages, but I guess these things happen. Needless to say, I will be flame sterilising everything from now on.

 

[Stuster]

tip it
it's infected
you're likely to get bottle bombs if you don't tip it.

Personally, I'm not sure what it is. What do you think it is, Tangent? I wouldn't chuck it until you are sure it's no good. What's the gravity? Has that changed much since you transferred to secondary? :unsure:

 

[Inge]

Personally, I'm not sure what it is. What do you think it is, Tangent? I wouldn't chuck it until you are sure it's no good. What's the gravity? Has that changed much since you transferred to secondary? :unsure:

The gravity was 1012 upon racking; this was consistent for about two and a half days. After racking, the gravity dropped two points to 1010, and remained there for a fortnight, until today, when I noticed the scum. (It wasn't there 2 days ago.)

Not that it matters.



Perhaps a tad hasty?

I noticed several white flecks all down the side of the fermenter - after pouring out the beer, I scraped a sample of this horrendous scum out, and gave it the old sniff and taste test. Almost certainly lactobacillus, as it had little smell, but an sour, yoghurt-like tang on the tongue.

Ah well, don't sweat it, I'm not losing any sleep over it. I am new to brewing and this is all just a learning experience for me.

I am more concerned by my hefeweien currently tasting like poop. Made it on Tuesday, pitched the Wyeast Bavarian Wheat starter within 2 minutes of topping up the wort. Started fermenting at 18-20degrees within 6 hours. Incredibly rapid fermentation; by the time I got home from work that night there was roughly one bubble in the airlock per 6-8 seconds, and a rocky krausen. Took a taste and SG on Thursday. Going nicely, with a lovely ester clove taste, hint of banana in the still sweet wort.

Took a taste today, and the clove aroma has dissipated somewhat, and to put it in the simplest terms possible, the wort has an after-taste that tastes not unlike the smell of fart.

Please tell me that this sulphur taste is just a quirk of the yeast and will dissipate like it will in a lager. Having to pour out another beer will give me the *****.

 

[wildschwein]

Sulpher smells/tastes are pretty normal for lagers but I'm not sure about wheats. What products and proceedures are you using to sanatise your equipment?

 

[Stuster]

Sulphur smells could come from stress on the yeast. It could be from underpitching the yeast, or it could be from low temperatures. Either of those the case? :unsure:

It could also be an infection. As wildschwein asks, what do you do for sanitation?

 

[Inge]

Cleaning using soft cloth and piping hot water and pink-neo, followed by a rinse down with 6% w/v hydrogen peroxide, followed then by a rinse down with 70 percent alcohol, allow to evaporate. Peripheral things like bottlers, rack tubing and airlocks are soaked in peroxide for about an hour. Lids are scrubbed with Napisan and rinsed clean.

All taps are taken apart and boiled in water for 10 minutes.

Now I do this and then soak the fermenter and other bits and pieces in Sodium Percarbonate or bleach. Like I said before, I took every precaution with sanitising. Looking over the fermenter I noticed a tiny split in the seam at the top near the lid. I think this may possibly be the source of infection, even though the 'split' is high up enough that it never contacts the wort.

I think it's high time to ditch this particular fermenter.

As for the taste of the weibier, perhaps I am being completely paranoid, and picking up only on the bad flavours. My brother and mother both tried some and said that it tasted fine, my mum went so far as to 'hmm, it smells fruity doesn't it', so I think I may just be an idiot. There is a very slight sourness in the wort, which I am going to put down to the tartness of the wheat. I hope this perceived bad taste is just the taste of the yeast sediment at the bottom. Perhaps sulphurous isn't the best word to describe it.

I have maintained the temperature at 18, give or take a degree. I am using an electric blanket on a timer at night time (It's getting really cold in Perth) so it never dips below 16-17. I kept an eye on the temperatures using this method doing my first brew, and it works very well. I don't think I underpitched the yeast, as I made a starter from the Wyeast and fermented that out for about three days at 22-24 degrees, and like I said, there was very little lag time, and a strong fermentation.

Unless that was a gusher bug, but my starter vessel underwent all the same sanitisation procedures.

 

[Stuster]

It certainly doesn't sound like it's slack sanitation. :blink: :lol:

Could just be the worried parent syndrome. Sounds like you are doing everything right. It could be time to retire that fermenter. Old fermenters can make good bottling buckets though (if you are bulk priming).

 

[Inge]

It certainly doesn't sound like it's slack sanitation. :blink: :lol:

Could just be the worried parent syndrome. Sounds like you are doing everything right. It could be time to retire that fermenter. Old fermenters can make good bottling buckets though (if you are bulk priming).

Yeah, I've been thinking about it and I think that the infection came from one of two places. From the crack in the plastic, like I said above, or from my skin during racking. I was wearing latex gloves, but maybe bacteria from my forearms decided to hang out in the bucket? The beer was wonderful until a week after I racked it.

So, I'm may give racking a rest for a little while. I might just bottle the hefeweibier straight from the primary. It's supposed to be a cloudy beer anyway, so not racking shouldn't make too much of a difference, should it?

 

[Stuster]

Best way to do a hefeweizen in my opinion (and most others beers of course, but even less need to rack with a hefeweizen).

Anything's possible, but the crack in the plastic seems a more likely source of infection than your forearms. Unless you were cracking grain on the same day, or just have pretty filthy forearms.

 

[Inge]

Best way to do a hefeweizen in my opinion (and most others beers of course, but even less need to rack with a hefeweizen).

Anything's possible, but the crack in the plastic seems a more likely source of infection than your forearms. Unless you were cracking grain on the same day, or just have pretty filthy forearms.

Ok, thanks for all of your advice guys!

I'm not too worried any more.

:beer:

 

[Mr Bond]

View attachment 13329

Thats acetobacter, read here for info.Vinegar flys are a source as well as airborne.

 

[Inge]

Thats acetobacter, read here for info.Vinegar flys are a source as well as airborne.

Ahh, truly?

Thanks for the info, mate.

 

[goatherder]

Bummer about the infection. If I were to add my 2c worth, I'd be asking why go to a secondary with a witbier? It's a cloudy style best drunk fresh - I don't see any advantage to a secondary ferment. Just an opportunity for infection I think.

Not intending to have a go, I'm an advocate of primary-only fermenting.

 

[Inge]

Bummer about the infection. If I were to add my 2c worth, I'd be asking why go to a secondary with a witbier? It's a cloudy style best drunk fresh - I don't see any advantage to a secondary ferment. Just an opportunity for infection I think.

Not intending to have a go, I'm an advocate of primary-only fermenting.

I had read that flavours improve better in a secondary fermenter, and this was the main reason that I racked to a secondary, not so much for clarity. By the time that I discovered that secondary is pretty much unnecessary for a witbier, it was a case of too little, too late. Probably should have asked a few questions here first...

Bacteria 1, Me 0. I'll just cop it on the chin and chalk it up to experience

I just went to the brew store and picked up some bits and pieces to make a nice APA, so I feel better now.

 

[barls]

sorry to dreg up an old topic ive just noticed the same thing on my current brews and since im kegging would it be worth it to keg and leave the top 2 inches in there or am i better off dumping the 2 batches and starting again. im a little pissed off as it wasnt there 2 days ago when i was going to keg them.