Gas Pockets In My Beer Line

[mattcarty]

hi there

sorry if this has come up before I did a search but couldnt find any topics that related.

being a newbie to all this kegging dealeo I was hoping for a bit of help on a problem im having

I am getting gas pockets in the line from my keg to the tap, not a huge deal but it means that at a start of a pour i get blast of gas into the glass and its foam city, so i tip that out and pour again and then get a decent pour with a good head however if im pouring brews for the mates the 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc schooners end up with progressively less head than the first glass.

i am running two kegs, T joined gas line. the problem is in both beer out lines

is this a gas pressure issue? I just saw the spreadsheet with the calulations on what pressure to gas to depending on what size/length tubing so will give that a look at and see if it helps.

any other suggestions would be very much appreciated

Cheers
Carty

 

[buttersd70]

on what pressure to gas to depending on what size/length tubing

reverse that. The gas pressure and temp give you the carbonation, the line is adjusted to match the pressure.

If gas pockets are building up behind the tap when it has been sitting and subsequent pours have less head, it's a good bet that the line is too long for the pressure. pressure drops over the line, and if it's too long, co2 comes out of solution causing a pocket of gas, usually 1 behind the tap and another just in front of the keg post.

Check the spreadsheet, and trim down to the lengthe advised...although I'd reccomend perhaps making it slightly longer to start, adn progressively trimming down more if needed. You can always cut more off, but you cant add it back once cut.

 

[Peteoz77]

What size is your beer line, and how long is it? I find 1.5 metres of 5mm line is pretty much perfect

 

[buttersd70]

I find 1.5 metres of 5mm line is pretty much perfect

But it all depends on your particular setup....height of tap, and pressure of keg. In my setup, 1.5m of 5mm would be way too much. The 1m that balances my system would give you trouble. Balancing is something that needs to be tailored to the individual.

 

[pint of lager]

Beer has dissolved gas in solution. This is your carbonation.

This dissolved gas comes out of solution due to pressure changes. This can be due to temperature changes or due to pressure changes between the keg and in the gas line.

It is very common to see a bubble near the tap as it is a bit warmer here. Many keggers report that the first bit of beer for the first pour of the day has a bit of extra froth in it due to the amount of beer in the tap shank which is outside the fridge.

Is your beer pouring ok? If it is pouring ok, don't worry about it. RDWHAHB.

 

[Peteoz77]

But it all depends on your particular setup....height of tap, and pressure of keg. In my setup, 1.5m of 5mm would be way too much. The 1m that balances my system would give you trouble. Balancing is something that needs to be tailored to the individual.

True. There are many factors that affect teh pour and the head. temperature/carbonation in keg/line length/line size/inner diameter of the shank/height of taps in relation to kegs/etc. I gave 1.5m of 5mm as a general answer for a standard fridge with a tap @ 3C and kegs that are not overcarbed. It's a good place to start, and as was stated, it's easier to cut them shorter than to add to them.

 

[mattcarty]

cooleo

thanks a lot for the help guys.

tomorrow I am putting on a JSGA brew so will hopefully have my pouring issues sorted before i keg that little puppy.

happy brewing

cheers
carty

 

[katzke]

cooleo

thanks a lot for the help guys.

tomorrow I am putting on a JSGA brew so will hopefully have my pouring issues sorted before i keg that little puppy.

happy brewing

cheers
carty

Kind of sounds like warm lines to me. Are they run outside the fridge, like in a tower?

 

[mattcarty]

no inside the fridge

the taps drilled into the door of the fridge everything except the gas is inside the fridge

cheers
carty

 

[slacka]

I used Wortgames Reckoner to determine the correct gas pressure and temperature for the beer in my fridge.

I let my kegs carbonate over two weeks at this same pressure thus ensuring everything is kept balanced.

Increasing the pressure will over carbonate your beer, likewise decreasing the pressure will release gas from your beer. Probably what you're experiencing.

So how do you slow the beer coming out of the tap so that it doesn't hose everyone within a 5m radius? Simply add extra beer line. As long as it's all the same temperature, the gas will stay in solution. Granted, the tap will be slightly warmer and you will need to "burp" that bit.

As for the length of the tube ... There are easier links then this to follow http://kegman.net/balance.html but it will get you on the right track.

Unfortunately for me, I have several metres of line between the fridge in the cellar to the bar which gives the beer plenty of time to warm up. (flame suite on)If I'm throwing a party, I cheat and simply bump the pressure up a couple of pounds to compensate for the line outside the fridge. The keg will be empty before it has a chance to over carbonate(flame suite off)

 

[buttersd70]

(flame suite on)If I'm throwing a party, I cheat and simply bump the pressure up a couple of pounds to compensate for the line outside the fridge. The keg will be empty before it has a chance to over carbonate(flame suite off)

don't see the need for flame suit on that, sounds reasonable to me if the kegs going to get emptied. Isn't this basicaly how pubs operate, anyway?

 

[Henno]

I am having the same problem. Mine may be different though as it is happening almost every pour. I can actually see the bubbles coming out the beer out post and going up to the highest point of the beer line where they form a big bubble. This means it can't be coming out of solution in the beer line as such but actually leaving the keg via the pick up tube. What can be done here? I can't see shortening my beer lines helping this one. I also run adjustable celi taps so beer line balancing isn't a major issue for me.

 

[buttersd70]

henno, I take it that having cellis, your line would be pretty short anyway, or at least shorter than you would with a normal tap....so it shouldn't be pressure drop in the line. As a matter of interest, whats the temp and pressure?
Is it possible that there is a minor leak at the post itself on the diptube o-ring, causing a bit of air to suck in....I (very vaguely)seem to remember something similar happening to someone else ...

 

[Henno]

I still have about a metre of line to each tap even though I probably don't need it. I may shorten them. Temp sits at about 3 but I sometimes wonder if my stirring fans aren't getting me even temp distribution. If the bottom was way colder than the top would this cause bubbles to be forced out? I may put a glass of water down the bottom and another up the top and see how much diff I get.

Serving pressure about 100kpa, or at least it says 10 on my reg.

As the bubble escape problem happens on all my kegs I thought the chances of having leaking beer out posts on all of them to be a slim chance.

 

[buttersd70]

I still have about a metre of line to each tap even though I probably don't need it. I may shorten them. Temp sits at about 3 but I sometimes wonder if my stirring fans aren't getting me even temp distribution. If the bottom was way colder than the top would this cause bubbles to be forced out? I may put a glass of water down the bottom and another up the top and see how much diff I get.

Serving pressure about 100kpa, or at least it says 10 on my reg.

As the bubble escape problem happens on all my kegs I thought the chances of having leaking beer out posts on all of them to be a slim chance.

from what youve said, then, the only thing I can think of is the temp issue you mentioned....if the line is warmer than the mass of the beer in the keg, co2 could possibly come out....beyond that, it's got me stumped.

 

[cdbrown]

Henno,

Have you managed to get to the bottom of this issue? I also get foam/gas bubble at the highest point in my beer line which is at the high point just as the beer line exits the freezer before dropping a little and then entering the bottom of the font. I might also check to see if there's bubbles coming from the beer post. Others that have had this issue had over carbed beer due to force carb instead of carbing at pouring pressure over a week.

 

[buttersd70]

Another option for you henno....seeing as how the problem seems to be across all your kegs, is it possible that the disconect has a slight leak at the line?

 

[Henno]

I now have two new kegs pouring and they are behaving fine funnily enough. It is a lot cooler this week though and when that last keg was playing up it was stinking hot weather. Other thing is they are full and being held at 100 as well as another keg of soda water. I'll do some temp checks at different layers when we get some more hot weather, if we get some more hot weather.

 

[raven19]

Carty,

A quick hijack here... h34r:

[topic="0"]linky[/topic]

My Celli tap was foaming - and I tried my other keg tonight, no problems (lack of gas - only been carbonating a few days...), however no issues with half head half flat beer either - which was my major issue in keg 1.

Link above it is to discuss me replacing the post seals as I suspect this is the issue I have on my first keg (what are the odds eh?).

Hope this may be of some help to you for this issue.

I figure I shall move my IPA to another keg once the spare one is resealed, then fix the first offending keg!!!