For the dreamers

[Cube]

Wow. Some really pissed off workers in here, some shining through brighter than others.

Dunning Kruger Effect anyone?

 

[jlm]

My mate and I went to Newtown a couple of months ago and headed for Young Henrys, stopping off for a few brews on the way along King Street and a couple of twenties in the pokies at the Townie etc (got it back, just) and couldn't find YH at all. Google Maps was our friend but on walking a couple of Ks we had to have a few more beers in a pub in Enmore. Eventually we got so pissed we ended up in the wrong suburb. I sent an abusive email off the smartphone to YH "why don't you have directions on your fecking website?". Got even more pissed, usual story, and eventually got home.

Now wouldn't it be nice if they could actually have, fairly prominently, on their site WTF they actually ARE ???????????????????????????????

Found it in 2 clicks.....didn't seem that hard.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

KPI just dont really work in a dynamic job environment. Sure in a factory yes but get out in the field and no. How do you measure something when you dont really know when/how/why it is going to occure and how often. The fault and repair field is just to dynamic to be able to do that. Then you need a manager who can feal with things as they arise. Not looking at some ******* excel sheet trying to meet an.unworkable KPI

 

[bradsbrew]

In that circumstance it is the executive management that has failed with the structure of the KPI. KPI needs to be contextualised to the job description/role. I am pretty confident I could build a performance review attached to any on site or offsite role. Measuring the ability of someone to be able to solve problems and react/perform within their authority or converse with management to meet the clients expectations in a dynamic environment is not hat hard. It's just a formal way of doing it to meet IR requirements.

 

[punkin]

If it's all too hard to work for someone who asks for accountability and employs someone to measure that in their own business at their own cost, the way they damn well please then go and start your own business. Have an idea. Put it into practice, put your money where your big mouth is and educate yourself on what it takes to make it in the world standing on your own two feet.

Or change it for the better from within. Be better at your job than the peole around you. If you are half as good as you think you are you'll have that managers job in less than 12 months.

Not likely to be agreeing with Brad too often, but grandstanding on the internet about what a bunch of ***** managers are and how they are stealing inflated salaries by doing nothing and doing it poorly just makes you look stupid.

Yes a good manager should be enabling and resourcing his/her team to be able to outperform the other teams in the same/similar industry or the same company and if you blokes were any good at thinking of better ways of measuring this then you wouldn't have to hear about KPI's and you all would be managers or business owners. -_-


I'dLikeToBuyHimForTwiceWhatIThinkHe'sWorthAndSellHimForHalfWhatHeThinksHe'sWorthPunkin

 

[koots]

I'm with ducatiboy on the site part. I agree KPI's are important to a business. However most places I've worked are straight away shitting on the worker when they're not met rather than looking at reasons why they aren't met. It never seems to fall back on middle management for not organising the work properly. It's how KPI's are measured that is important.

In my industry (mechanical), we get reamed when a job isn't finished on time. Though no-one ever pineapples the project manager for not organising the required gear, crane, etc etc to be there which can hold up progress for hours. Site based work needs dynamic KPI's, or a completely different approach to measuring success. Our jobs are quoted and planned by someone in an office who isn't a tradesman and hasn't even been for a site visit and then when it takes a bit longer or needed parts/repairs that weren't included it is somehow our fault. But when we finish them quicker and identify and solve extra faults there is no reward or praise. So I'm gunna have to say also, **** managers and **** HR.

mje, I've been keeping an eye out in there for you lately

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

I am not against good management. A good manager is worth good money, as is a good employee. And I also believe the worker needs to pull his weight. I just dont agree that KPI is the be all and end all. I would rather work for a boss that helped me to to do the best job I can than rather than one that is fixated with KPI. Have neen down thst path. Not everone aspires to be a manager or wans to be one. I know plenty like that. All they want is good management, not fixated management

 

[Crusty]

I work for a multi billion dollar company & the managers we see come through this place is bordering on pathetic, where the hell they find these fucktards I'll never know. Most of them just aim for self promotion & get bonuses for achieving un realistic sales goals & it's us poor bastards that get bent over & shafted big time.
We have a manager at the moment that hate's this town & it's well known that his sole intention is to spend less than budget to make himself look good so he can get a promotion & the big wigs will look at him & think, wow, this guys making good money & we are spending less & less. The fucker walks around the shop like a cock in a hen house with his chest pumped out trying to make friends with everyone but he's as transparent as a sheet of cling wrap. I think that 95% of the people that I work with would leave if given the opportunity, me included. There's just over a hundred employees at my work place & there ain't too many happy people here.
We make $700K to $800K every week & are expected to make $1.5million just on christmas week alone.
The cock will be struttin his stuff on that week.

 

[Byran]

Amen to that brother. And I was referring to the corporate, government bureaucracy not the blokes digging the hole. You know like with OHS stuff and filling out forms so you can fill out other forms ect

I am not against good management. A good manager is worth good money, as is a good employee. And I also believe the worker needs to pull his weight. I just dont agree that KPI is the be all and end all. I would rather work for a boss that helped me to to do the best job I can than rather than one that is fixated with KPI. Have neen down thst path. Not everone aspires to be a manager or wans to be one. I know plenty like that. All they want is good management, not fixated management

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Amen to that brother. And I was referring to the corporate, government bureaucracy not the blokes digging the hole. You know like with OHS stuff and filling out forms so you can fill out other forms ect

If it wasnt true it would be a joke. I often wondered if the was a department soley to design forms...

Although OH&S is not something I am against. And I know a lot that do view OH&S seriously.

 

[Feldon]

Have to laugh at the middle managers and shopkeepers who sing the praises of KPIs.

If KPIs are so good why aren't they applied to the CEOs and company directors who send their companies to the wall but still get their massive payouts.

Or the moneymen in the US, UK, Ireland etc who brought on the Global Financial Crisis but are still not only employed in the same top jobs, but pulling their bonuses as well.

At the shop floor level KPIs are nothing more than substitute for good management and a means of exploiting workers.

 

[GuyQLD]

I am not against good management. A good manager is worth good money, as is a good employee. And I also believe the worker needs to pull his weight. I just dont agree that KPI is the be all and end all. I would rather work for a boss that helped me to to do the best job I can than rather than one that is fixated with KPI. Have neen down thst path. Not everone aspires to be a manager or wans to be one. I know plenty like that. All they want is good management, not fixated management

I think the real issue is we confuse leaders and managers. Managers are process driven. They're about the bottom line; lets be honest, they aren't really concerned with the people doing the job but more with the job being done and to spec. Leaders are more interested in the people and how they're going to get their shit done.

Combine the two and you get a half decent boss. They're pretty few and far between though, as finding some balance between the two is usually difficult (but that's what makes it valuable)

 

[Byran]

If it wasnt true it would be a joke. I often wondered if the was a department soley to design forms...

Although OH&S is not something I am against. And I know a lot that do view OH&S seriously.

But signing a 20 page OHS document and filling out 4 pages of bullshit before you start a job task doesn't save lives, it reduces liability for those in higher positions if something goes wrong. So by signing a SWMS or risk assessment you are theoretically signing a contract that you must abide by to prevent your own workplace injury getting the person who is your superior in trouble. And as a by product of following the rules of the SWMS you should get home in one piece. As in business law cases there is absolutely no leniency for human error. It is always someones fault.

Any way sorry for the ramblings lol. Im gonna go to YH tomoz for a schooner of hop ale. ...ThanQ

 

[whatwhat]

I must be in the wrong industry. What the hell is a KPI?

 

[simplefisherman]

Key Performance Indicators
Keeping People Industrious
Kilometers of Paperwork Inked
Kilograms of Poop Ingested
Your choice ;-)

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

The University of AHB

 

[Phoney]

F@&$ me theres some off-topic drivel in this thread. Mods, any chance of a clean up?

I have it on good authority that the Young Henrys boys are doing extremely well. They work bloody hard but the dividends are paying off. They've just bought the premises next door to expand into, and they've only just celebrated their first birthday party.

Whoever said theres no money to be made in craft beer just isnt doing it right.

 

[Byran]

If they move into the building next door it will be a reasonable size operation! Maybe not so crowded drinking next to the ferment vessels in the current bar location

 

[mje1980]

I work for a multi billion dollar company & the managers we see come through this place is bordering on pathetic, where the hell they find these fucktards I'll never know. Most of them just aim for self promotion & get bonuses for achieving un realistic sales goals & it's us poor bastards that get bent over & shafted big time.
We have a manager at the moment that hate's this town & it's well known that his sole intention is to spend less than budget to make himself look good so he can get a promotion & the big wigs will look at him & think, wow, this guys making good money & we are spending less & less. The fucker walks around the shop like a cock in a hen house with his chest pumped out trying to make friends with everyone but he's as transparent as a sheet of cling wrap. I think that 95% of the people that I work with would leave if given the opportunity, me included. There's just over a hundred employees at my work place & there ain't too many happy people here.
We make $700K to $800K every week & are expected to make $1.5million just on christmas week alone.
The cock will be struttin his stuff on that week.

Haha you just described my workplace!. We get a new one every 3 years. They think they're the man, but quickly realise they are only there to carry out the guy aboves dirty work. Who, in turn carries out the dirty work for the guy above haha. Last one was a really nice bloke, but trembled when it was decision time. Honestly the money ain't worth it, and being at the bottom has it's benefits. I might work hard, and get covered in shit but when I get out the gate I don't think about work til I get back. I like the managers, who often look at our cameras while at home on weekends. Awesome huh?!

 

[mje1980]

Sorry for the off topic. They serve one of their beers here in Wollongong so now I must go and try it to make amends for the off topic. I of course will complete a risk analysis, and ensure I drink it safely with no risk of harm to me or anyone else.