Fat Yak Biab

[Nossil]

Thanks to Nick's 20L Stovetop BIAB thread I brewed my first AG BIAB last week following his simple recipe (60 min PoW hops). My efficiency was pretty rubbish I think (SG was 1.044). Just measured the gravity then and it is 1.009 after 8 days which should equal 4.6% ABV

Its finishing up fermenting now and I want to put down my second batch and experiment a bit more. I stumbled across a recipe for Fat Yak on this forum:
BeerSmith Recipe Printout - http://www.beersmith.com
Recipe: Copy of Fat Yak - Knock Off
Brewer: Gavins Brewhouse
Asst Brewer:
Style: American Pale Ale
TYPE: All Grain
Taste: (35.0)

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Batch Size: 23.00 L
Boil Size: 30.72 L
Estimated OG: 1.057 SG
Estimated Color: 4.3 SRM
Estimated IBU: 26.4 IBU
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.00 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
4.50 kg Pilsner, Malt Craft Export (Joe White) (1.Grain 80.36 %
0.50 kg Munich I (Weyermann) (7.1 SRM) Grain 8.93 %
0.50 kg Wheat Malt, Malt Craft (Joe White) (1.8 SRGrain 8.93 %
0.10 kg Carahell (Weyermann) (13.0 SRM) Grain 1.79 %
30.00 gm Cascade [5.50 %] (60 min) Hops 17.6 IBU
10.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [11.50 %] (10 min) Hops 4.5 IBU
20.00 gm Cascade [5.50 %] (10 min) Hops 4.3 IBU
30.00 gm Nelson Sauvin [11.50 %] (0 min) Hops -
0.50 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 15.0 min) Misc
1 Pkgs SafAle American Ale (DCL Yeast #US-05(56))Yeast-Ale


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Light Body
Total Grain Weight: 5.60 kg
----------------------------
Single Infusion, Light Body
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
75 min Mash In Add 14.60 L of water at 74.5 C 65.6 C
10 min Mash Out Add 9.35 L of water at 94.9 C 75.6 C


So I plugged the above into brewmate and then reduced the grains proportionately (roughly) to bring the total grains down to 4kg so I can follow Nick's tutorial again.
Got the following:
New Recipe


Recipe Specs
----------------
Batch Size (L): 18.0
Total Grain (kg): 4.000
Total Hops (g): 66.52
Original Gravity (OG): 1.049 (P): 12.1
Final Gravity (FG): 1.012 (P): 3.1
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 4.81 %
Colour (SRM): 5.4 (EBC): 10.6
Bitterness (IBU): 36.4 (Average)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 70
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

Grain Bill
----------------
3.200 kg Pale Ale Malt (80%)
0.350 kg Munich I (8.75%)
0.350 kg Wheat Malt (8.75%)
0.100 kg Carahell (2.5%)

Hop Bill
----------------
22.2 g Cascade Pellet (7.8% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (1.1 g/L)
14.8 g Cascade Pellet (7.8% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.7 g/L)
7.4 g Nelson Sauvin Pellet (11.5% Alpha) @ 10 Minutes (Boil) (0.4 g/L)
22.2 g Nelson Sauvin Pellet (11.5% Alpha) @ 0 Minutes (Aroma) (1.1 g/L)

Misc Bill
----------------
0.7 g Whirlfloc Tablet @ 15 Minutes (Boil)

Single step Infusion at 66C for 90 Minutes.
Fermented at 20C with


Recipe Generated with BrewMate


So with not as much volume I can still use 4kg of grain and get a decent ABV?
I'm keeping the hops the same, or should I reduce the portion on them as well?

OR should I just run with the original recipe of 5.6kg of grain and hope for the best in my 19L Big W pot?



Also :icon_offtopic:
Thinking about re-using the yeast from my first BIAB batch that is finishing up fermenting at the moment...
Adding 500ml of boiled and cooled water in fermenter after beer has been put into keg, swirling it around, then just putting around a third of it into a jar then into the fridge. When new Fat Yak beer is ready to go, add it to a clean fermenter and just poor the entire contents of the container thats in the fridge into the fermenter with fat yak wort?
What are the odds of infection? Will there be enough yeast count to ferment the entire batch?
I'd hate to ruin my batch after I had just spent 3 hours in the kitchen making it... all for the sake of a $6 yeast packet.

Any pointers will be appreciated guys! And thanks especially to Nick for creating those BIAB threads.

 

[Rowy]

Mate there's a sweet spot with that 19 litre system. I used it when I started getting into AG and it's fantastic. Nick, the author, of the thread reckons its about 3.5kg of grain and I agree. Much more and that's qhen you start having problems.

 

[wombil]

G'Day nossil,
The way I do it is to have one brew ready to bottle/keg.
Then have your brew day and no chill overnight,or whichever method you use.
Bottle or keg your beer from the fermenter and put the new batch straight into the fermenter with the yeast that you leave behind in the fermenter.Cover with gladwrap or plug/airlock whichever you prefer and away you go.
I do this 3 or 4 times before I use a fresh packet of yeast.
Never had any problems.I use US_05 nearly all the time too.
Good luck with it.
wombil.

 

[Nossil]

Thanks for your replies guys. Rowy, so if you were to copy the original fat yak recipe i posted above would you just reduce the grain bill proportionately down to 3.5kg?



Wombil, dumping fresh wort into a 'dirty' fermenter with yeast cake on the bottom scares the crap out of me. That creamy looking sludge can't be doing the fresh wort any favours! Although I heard on here other people have done exactly as you say and have had success, not sure if i can work up the courage to do it though h34r:

 

[Nick JD]

That recipe you posted will be fine - but you'll have to work for the efficiency with a decent sparge.

3.5kg in the 19L pot will get you 80% efficiency without sparging. At this stage, when the brewing process is still fun and exciting, limiting your batch size to <17L (malt bill too) isn't an issue - and it means you get your techniques and processes down pat quicker because you brew more.

Once you get it all sorted if you get some full sized equipment you'll not be shy about pushing your gear's envelope. If you can get 20L of 4.5% beer from a 19L pot ... what can you get from a 36L kettle? Anything.

Oh, and make sure you use NZ Cascade (your recipe is for it by the looks of the AAs).

 

[Nossil]

Thanks Nick, my sparging technique so far is to fill a bucket with around 3 or 4 litres with ~60 odd degree water and dunk the grain bag in a few times giving it a couple of squeezes. Then leaving it in there, opening the bag, and pouring another couple of litres on top of the grains.

String it up over the bucket and squeeze like buggery, then after burning my hands, put some kitchen gloves on and squeeze some more. Then add all the goodness back to the brew pot.

I might leaving it hanging/dripping for a little while longer this time to get a few more drops out. Just need to find somthing to hang it from!


I got a packet of cascade pellets from my LHBS, I assumed they are from NZ? Are there different types of cascade?

 

[seemax]

If you're really keen on larger volume... as I've said before just use 2 x bigW pots ... split the grain into each, that should give you the room to use up to 7kg grain and brew either more beer or higher gravity beers.

 

[Nick JD]

I got a packet of cascade pellets from my LHBS, I assumed they are from NZ? Are there different types of cascade?

Cascade is from the Cascade Mountains (Mt St Helens, Mt Hood, Mt Rainier etc) in Oregon and Washington.

It's also grown in NZ. The NZ stuff (to me) is more citrusy and slightly sharper.

What's the AA% of yours? The USA stuff is often lower.

 

[Nossil]

If you're really keen on larger volume... as I've said before just use 2 x bigW pots ... split the grain into each, that should give you the room to use up to 7kg grain and brew either more beer or higher gravity beers.

That sounds like a good idea, just need to invest the $$ to get another Big W pot, hop-sock, biab bag, and bucket! (suppose its only ~$40)

Hmm perhaps Nick should make another thread to give us BIAB-ers a tutorial on the next step up in AG brewing. :icon_cheers:

Cascade is from the Cascade Mountains (Mt St Helens, Mt Hood, Mt Rainier etc) in Oregon and Washington.

It's also grown in NZ. The NZ stuff (to me) is more citrusy and slightly sharper.

What's the AA% of yours? The USA stuff is often lower.

http://www.thebrewshop.com.au/cascade-hop-pellets-100g.html

Thats the ones i bought, unfortunately looks like they are from the US with 4-7% AA... well maybe I won't be ending up with a fat yak after all!

 

[Nick JD]

Thats the ones i bought, unfortunately looks like they are from the US with 4-7% AA... well maybe I won't be ending up with a fat yak after all!

It'll still be Fat Yak. The Nelson plays as big a part as the Cascade. I'm just biased toward NZ hops - their Hallertau is crazy good and great value and their Saaz crosses are sold before they flower.

Australia only comes up with Galaxy.

The next step up in AG brewing is entirely up to you - I just showed it was possible to mash grains and make supurb beer on a shoestring (because the general concensus was AG = expensive gear) - you might like to set up a HERMS system or buy a Braumeister or a huge pot and a huge burner ... I was just trying to give a leg up onto the shoulders of giants - plenty of them here to take over from now! You're already doing it right.

 

[Rowy]

Thanks for your replies guys. Rowy, so if you were to copy the original fat yak recipe i posted above would you just reduce the grain bill proportionately down to 3.5kg?



Wombil, dumping fresh wort into a 'dirty' fermenter with yeast cake on the bottom scares the crap out of me. That creamy looking sludge can't be doing the fresh wort any favours! Although I heard on here other people have done exactly as you say and have had success, not sure if i can work up the courage to do it though h34r:

Nicks answered it all now Nossil.................he da man when it comes to this method..............I secretly suspect he is on a commission from BigW with regard to their pots <_<

 

[Nick JD]

I secretly suspect he is on a commission from BigW with regard to their pots <_<

I really just don't want others to spend 20 years making kit beer wishing it tasted like "bought beer", like I did because the paradigm was that all grain beer was expensive to make.

 

[kymba]

and now it is funny to see the nongs who 'dislike the shift' do their thing. apparently all AG beer isn't equal