Danstar Windsor Wtf?

[super_simian]

Pretty poor choice by whoever recommended it - Windsor is best for beers you don't want high attenuation in, although it does have a lovely flavour. You could try to preserve that flavour by using US05, which is pretty neutral, but I have no idea what occurs to ester profiles when two yeasts are used. If anyone does have experience, I would love to hear it, because I want to do a strong/old ale, but the UK style yeast a want for its' esters has an upper attenuation limit of 72% - and I want 80-ish% to avoid overwhelming sweetness. So I was thinking of using the initial yeast for 3-4 days to develop esters, then following with US05... Anyone?

 

[mje1980]

I've never had much luck the few times i tried windsor. Liquid UK yeast ( i've tried at least 12 or so ) have all been miles ahead of Windsor.

 

[kelbygreen]

yeah I was worried about mixing yeast. But rather a beer I will drink then one I wont lol. I mean if it was just one keg I wouldnt mind but 2 kegs of it when I only have 2 kegs isnt good

 

[MarkBastard]

Pretty poor choice by whoever recommended it - Windsor is best for beers you don't want high attenuation in, although it does have a lovely flavour. You could try to preserve that flavour by using US05, which is pretty neutral, but I have no idea what occurs to ester profiles when two yeasts are used. If anyone does have experience, I would love to hear it, because I want to do a strong/old ale, but the UK style yeast a want for its' esters has an upper attenuation limit of 72% - and I want 80-ish% to avoid overwhelming sweetness. So I was thinking of using the initial yeast for 3-4 days to develop esters, then following with US05... Anyone?

Craftbrewer sell a windsor/US05 combo yeast. I just used it on a home brewed ESB and a FWK Porter. The ESB achieved about 70% attenuation (1.048 down to 1.014 from memory). The Porter on the other hand has only gone from 1.058 to 1.020, which from memory is 64% attenuation.

Can't comment much on the flavour profile etc yet.

Needless to say, even with US05 helping out it's still pretty low attenuation.

 

[kelbygreen]

yeah maybe i was meant to pitch both??? lol any way lessen learnt

 

[going down a hill]

I have used Windsor twice, both times in porters. Both never got under 1.018 so I think she's done. I'd say a Coopers starter would be the go and you have no massive rush seeing the Windsor has eaten all it can. Hope it turns out ok.

 

[Bribie G]

I don't know if it's a pH thing or whatever but the only time I used Windsor, in conjuction with US-05 in the CB blend, it took a mild two months - yes two months to clear in the bottle. I chucked the other half of the repack. In any case apart from US-05 I don't use dry ale yeasts.

 

[HoppingMad]

Agree with Ross. Recommending Windsor for a coopers clone is quite daft. Using US-05 will result in an aussie pale with little character, but clean. Nothing like a Coopers Pale/Sparkling.

For a clone recipe, next time use Andrew QLD's recipe off RecipeDB or do a search for 'Mortz' Coopers Clone. Both are great examples provided you use the coopers yeast. If not sure about reculturing coopers Ross' suggestion of using Notto is sound, or use a coopers sachet. I've done coopers stout clones with coopers yeast & notto in combination and they come up really nice too. A little bit of gypsum won't hurt either.

Hopper.

 

[kelbygreen]

yeah I got a speacial blend of some brewing salts they are trialing but last 2 times I used it, it made a heap of difference, mostly the wort coming out of the mash was alot clearer but the hop profiles seem to of smoothed out a bit more but that could be just me getting process down a little better. I am not blaming the LHBS as the yeast is there as a suggestion and they may have clicked the wrong yeast as notto is right above it. With the recipes they have listed (prob 200+) there might be a mistake here or there and its only in trial mode so I guess I am more to blame for not looking up the yeast when I ordered it

Also just looked again and in the notes (didnt notice it before) it does say best to use recultured coopers yeast and reasonably high calcium content. Again ordering gear when I am half cut and rushing dont help at all

 

[MarkBastard]

I don't know if it's a pH thing or whatever but the only time I used Windsor, in conjuction with US-05 in the CB blend, it took a mild two months - yes two months to clear in the bottle. I chucked the other half of the repack. In any case apart from US-05 I don't use dry ale yeasts.

Yeah I've had pretty bad experiences with anything that isn't either US05 or Nottingham.

Actually there was a dry lager yeast I used that was good too, I think S189 or something like that.

U04 and Windsor and Windsor-derived yeasts I will not touch again.

This may sound like a noob opinion, but if I want body I will use spec malts or mash higher. I just like to know what I'm getting from yeast and work around that. I may want to experiment more with yeast when I've been brewing for 15 years or whatever but at the moment I'll stick with US05 or Nottingham.

 

[kelbygreen]

I love notto! but as you say you know notto finishes lower then a normal yeast so you mash a little higher to get the malt to come threw. People say it strips hop flavours but I cannot comment all beers I used it in I loved it and thats prob been the last 10 or more as I dont have heating well do now but didnt most winter and notto was the only yeast I found to keep going threw the cool times. US05 last 3 brews stalled at 1020 I left one for 4 weeks and it came down to 1016 but if I want to wait that long I would be brewing a lager!

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

Necro alert:

I used Windsor in my house APA, in conjunction with high temp mash, to brew a lower abv% but full flavoured APA.

Kegged yesterday (after cold conditioning) and poured off a glass.

Apart from looking like my toilet bowl after a dodgy Vindaloo (yeast obviously didn't settle as well as I'd hoped - I reckon the WB-06 even settled better), no hop flavour to speak of. That includes the 60g that I dry hopped.

It might be a "wait a couple of days for the yeast to properly settle out and you'll taste them" - but seriously nothing like my house APA normally, which is pungent, fruity and delicious.

My feeling is that once it settles down, it'll settle into a nice enough English Style Pale Ale (especially if I decide to hit it with some willamette in the keg), and sessionable - balance is certainly excellent and I reckon with some tweaks I could turn it into an ESB at 4% abv - but it ain't no APA, and I'm bitterly disappointed because I don't want an EPA at this stage of the year. It's too hot.

In the immortal words of Adam and that other ranga with a goatie - this myth is busted. Low abv%, full flavoured, hoppy APA isn't particularly possible using Windsor yeast and a high mash temp.

 

[Ross]

Sounds like something else has gone astray there LRG. Windsor ferments really fast & drops brilliantly bright.


cheers Ross

 

[drsmurto]

Necro alert:

I used Windsor in my house APA, in conjunction with high temp mash, to brew a lower abv% but full flavoured APA.

Kegged yesterday (after cold conditioning) and poured off a glass.

Apart from looking like my toilet bowl after a dodgy Vindaloo (yeast obviously didn't settle as well as I'd hoped - I reckon the WB-06 even settled better), no hop flavour to speak of. That includes the 60g that I dry hopped.

It might be a "wait a couple of days for the yeast to properly settle out and you'll taste them" - but seriously nothing like my house APA normally, which is pungent, fruity and delicious.

My feeling is that once it settles down, it'll settle into a nice enough English Style Pale Ale (especially if I decide to hit it with some willamette in the keg), and sessionable - balance is certainly excellent and I reckon with some tweaks I could turn it into an ESB at 4% abv - but it ain't no APA, and I'm bitterly disappointed because I don't want an EPA at this stage of the year. It's too hot.

In the immortal words of Adam and that other ranga with a goatie - this myth is busted. Low abv%, full flavoured, hoppy APA isn't particularly possible using Windsor yeast and a high mash temp.

It's not a myth.

I make a light amber ale (2.9%) using windsor that has plenty of hop flavour and aroma - Link

I suspect once the yeast settles out you'll find some hop flavour.

Out of interest, what was the recipe?

Cheers
DrSmurto

EDIT - agree with Ross, this is a quick floccer. Lack of hop flavour/aroma with dry hopping suggest there may be somethng else in your beer hiding the flavour/aroma

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

@Ross - maybe - though I did sparge and recirculate and the preboil liquor was extremely clear, and into the fermenter I had virtually no break to speak of (and what I did was run through a sieve with 2 x chux in it.

According to CB website, it's a non-flocculent strain. That, I would assume, would be part of it. That and I did over carbonate, then PRV down. Still, it's really yeast - like I said - WB-06 had this sort of murkiness. I'm hoping it'll settle down, and it's all just a patience issue.

It's not chill haze, hop haze or anything that would indicate suspended protein. And the beer still tastes pretty decent, just not *WHAM!* hops, like I'm used to.

@DrS:

25L:

5kg Perle Ale Malt
.3 Red Wheat Briess (see caveat above - liquor was clear as it comes)
.2 Carared
.1 Caraaroma

10g Galaxy at 30m
30g Galaxy & 30g Citra at 10m
10g Cascade at 10m

30g Cascade & 30g Willamette into the keg as dry hoppage.

Windsor Dried Yeast.

ta for the link, I'll read it now.

Goomba

 

[seemax]

Made an american oatmeal (oven roasted) stout with Windsor... stopped at 1.020 ...

only 3% ABV but really nice smooth profile, great choc/cookie notes and some cascade hops lingering

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

Thanks seemax - I've made a Dark Ale (very nice) with it - but I've been trying to get my house APA at least 1% lower, but retaining the good bits about it (lots of hoppiness, well balanced, sessionable).

Goomba

 

[drsmurto]

You filtered through Chux? :blink: (GMK - is that you?)

As in the cloths you wash dishes with?

Many of those come impregnated with disinfectants/biocides and/or detergents........

For the love of Aegir, why would you do that?

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

It was very late, worst brew day ever. It was the ben hur epic of brew days. I didn't have any whirfloc on hand (my fault for not checking before starting), nor any plain paper towel as back up.

It was the pesty free, etc roll version. It was an emergency and I had to improvise. I was tired and sleep deprived.

Forgive me, for I have sinned.

Not good brewing practice, I know, but I'm pretty sure nothing bad has come of it.

Like I said, if I was aiming at an English Pale Ale - fine - perfect.

And it is a very well balanced beer, considering terminal gravity is 1.020. I'd upped the IBU to compensate and it is a good balanced beer, reminiscent of an EPA or ESB even.

But not the pungency of what I'm used to from my APA which is masses of citrus and passionfruit and cut grass - and I love it.

It's a classic case of missed expectations, rather than epic fail.

Goomba

 

[Murcluf]

You filtered through Chux? :blink: (GMK - is that you?)

As in the cloths you wash dishes with?

Many of those come impregnated with disinfectants/biocides and/or detergents........

For the love of Aegir, why would you do that?

WTF!!!!!! it's not an Apricot Wheat Beer by Halabet!!!!!!