Creamy Head

[dr K]

the only bit I am not so sure about is the fact that alcohol being less dense than water is the property that makes the difference. I don't know what the answer is but water with sugar is less again which is why the og is higher than the fg and both are higher than water.

Errr..if you use a hydrometer you may have observed that it sits higher in a higher gravity solution than a lower gravity solution, this is because, suprising as it may seem, a higher gravity solution has a higher density. Ethanol is less dense than water which in turn is less dense than a sugar solution, which is why apparent attenuation is higher than real attenuation. Density, however, is relative I guess.

K

 

[buttersd70]

Brewtus,
If you think it's wiki-worthy, go for broke.....(butters blushes. We need blushing smileys, dammit!)

Basically, as DrK said, "Ethanol is less dense than water which in turn is less dense than a sugar solution, which is why apparent attenuation is higher than real attenuation."
As Muckey pointed out, at the end of fermentation (of malt) you are left with ethanol+water+long chain sugars. At the end of fermentation of a simple sugar solution, you have ethanol+water. (this is very simplified, it is ignoring other by-products, deliberately.) Basically, it means that simple sugars are totally fermentable (for the sake of the example), wheras more complex sugars (maltose, dextrins, etc) are not. Too many simple sugars attenuate too far, as far as body is concerned, which is the pitfall that a lot of kit brewers fall into. They want rocket fuel, so they add more (simple) sugar, which attenuates out more, leaving less body, and then complain their (high alcohol) beer is watery. Sometimes less is more.. . This is why I, as an avid brewer of the much maligned Mild Ale, cries when people complain about 'low alcohol' beer.

 

[Thunderlips]

but can never get a creamy head that you would get in a pub from their beer taps

Lots of pubs use "Headmaster" glasses these days, which go a long way in helping VB and the like
hold a decent head when they otherwise wouldn't in a normal glass.
You should be able to find them easy enough. Sometimes they even pop up on Ebay.

As already mentioned, I've always found dry wheat malt really helps.

 

[Stuster]

The yeast makes a difference. Some yeasts, at least from what I've seen, are more likely to give good head than others.

I think is a big point in fact. There's certainly some suggestions that having a happy, healthy yeast can help with head retention. This might even be more important than wheat malt etc. Think of Duvel. No wheat, plenty of sugar but a thick, creamy head. The suggestion is that fusel alcohols from a hot fermentation or underpitching can damage the head. So stressed yeast can give poor head. One thing to try might be to use a better yeast. Beginning brewers tend to use the kit yeasts, often small packets which have had dubious storage conditions. By the time people get to extract brewing or AG they're mostly using better yeasts, using more of it and paying more attention to appropriate fermentation temperatures for that yeast.

Anyway, if anyone's interested (butters ) there's a BYO article on it here.

 

[WarmBeer]

There's a decent podcast on Brew Strong (link) that goes into the science of head retention.

The guys get a bit of pre-pubescent humour going at times, but their knowledge is sound.

Worth adding to your iPod for a listen.

 

[Linz]

Where to start??
seing as how its been brought up with a single word answer, Nitrogen. Nitrogen, or a mix of co2 and n2, will give a creamy head, its due to the N2 in atmosphere being at high levels, N2 is less willing to come out of solution in order to come to equilibrium with atmospheric levels. But now on to something more useful....

K&K, generally, has a higher proportion of simple sugars than AG, partial, or extract brewing. Simple sugars form alcohol, but contribute nothing to body. (in fact they degrade body, as alcohol is less dense than water.) So, if the k&k brew has a high proportion of simple sugar in the mix (ie dextrose, glucose, or god forbid sucrose), the head will suffer as a result.

Final gravity is a contributing factor; the lower the fg, the lower the body, the harder it is for co2 to remain in solution forming a tight head. This again, comes down to simple sugars in the mix. With a 'thicker' liquid, it is harder for co2 to come out of solution.

The level of hopping...The more isomerised alpha acids, the more bitter the beer. The alpha acids do contribute to head retention. Kit beers are for the most part, quite under-hopped (which is why for most of them you cannot use all malt, or they will be too sweet.)

The yeast makes a difference. Some yeasts, at least from what I've seen, are more likely to give good head than others.

The amount of dextrins in the wort....unfortunately, with k&k, you don't do the mash, so you can't even really begin to think about what percentages of dextrins are in the wort. And many AG brewers don't even go that deep into it, they just know that hotter/and or stiffer = more dextrinous and leave it at that. But at least an AG brewer has the opportunity to take it into consideration, should they choose to do so.

How it was carbonated, and how long it has been on the gas....Many people, myself included, force carbonate, due to time constraints. This does tend to cause coarser carbonation, with bigger bubbles, and therefore the head isn't as good. The 'let er sit' method tends to give finer bubbles and better head. However, most times when force carbing, it is going to sit and calm itself down anyway, and will have better head after a couple of days on the gas. Unless you drain the keg in one sitting.

So, after much typing and refilling of my glass, what can a K&K brewer do to make it better? (without beer snobs saying "go all grain")

Firstly, replace all the simple fermentables. Ditch the dex. Go all malt. If you do this, you will need to boil some hops to counteract the additional sweetness. But that actually kills 2 birds with one stone, because it also means that you will have more isomorised alpha acid for nucleation.

Secondly, add some dextrins into the mix. One way is the use of maltodextrin ( :angry: ) which contributes nothing other than body. A much better way is to steep some specialty grain, which will give body, colour, flavour, and flavour. (yes, I mentioned it twice. Its worth mentioning twice.) Carapils, crystal, cara-anything, chocolate. Somewhere in the region of 3-10%.

Thirdly, add some longer chain proteins, such as can be found from wheat. Substitute some of your malt for wheat malt. The protein chain from wheat malt is longer than from barley malt, which is why wheat beers have a head on them that can substitute for a childrens bouncy castle. Up to 10%.

Just a note on percentages....when talking percentages, what I mean is percentage of extract weight. Which for all intents and purposes, is the dry weight. For liquid malts (including kit tins), that is 80% of the actual weight. For steeped grain, it is about 30% of the weight of the grain.

For a typical k&k ale, you could have, as an example,
1x 1.7kg kit (52.4%)
1 kg ldm (37.3%)
0.25kg dry wheat malt extract (7.5%)
0.25 kg crystal steeped. (2.8%)

23L
OG 1044
FG (predicted, on average) 1012.

You would then need to boil some hops, or it would be too sweet. 20-30g at 15minutes should be enogh to re-balance, depending on what kit you are doing in the first place, and what hops you are using. You would need about 8-10 IBU extra.

Carbonate this to 2.5vol co2, with a balanced system, and this should give you a head, even with a kit, that you could put a tie on.

Hopefully I have been sober enough in this post to not be too confusing. Btw, and OT, beer does not seem to alleviate a 104 fever.

I see PP has a new ID??

Good post though

 

[buttersd70]

I see PP has a new ID??

Good post though

PP?

 

[Adamt]

PP = PistolPatch widely known for his essay-long posts, usually done very late at night. Often very detailed, very informative and quite controversial.

He stopped posting regularly a while back but he still pops up every now and then.

He was one of the (if not the only) leading exponents of BIAB.

 

[SJW]

Late hopping is another good way of getting good foam. Beers with high amounts of aroma and flavour hops tend to hold their head better and lace very well, although this is only suitable for some beer styles.

Andrew

Interesting Andrew, I am having problems getting good head these days and I have noticed it's been since I have gone to a 20min hop addition for my last addition. At first I put it down to the start of me doing protein rest's but now I am not sure. Also I have stopped doing protein resting as I do not suffer with chill haze and suspect this could be effecting my head retention abbility.

Steve

 

[AndrewQLD]

Interesting Andrew, I am having problems getting good head these days and I have noticed it's been since I have gone to a 20min hop addition for my last addition. At first I put it down to the start of me doing protein rest's but now I am not sure. Also I have stopped doing protein resting as I do not suffer with chill haze and suspect this could be effecting my head retention ability.

Steve

Could well be a combination of both Steve. My comments were aimed more at highly end hopped beers like APAs and such which always seem to have a massive foam that is very dense. There is also some literature I have somewhere that relates to some of the hop oils/components that promote foam formation. I'll see if I can find it.

I always protien rest my lagers and get very good head afterwards :huh:

Andrew

 

[warrenlw63]

I always protien rest my lagers and get very good head afterwards :huh:

+1 for this method. Only difference being I'm doing it for all beers these days. :icon_cheers:

Warren -

 

[SJW]

Thanks guys, just what I did not want to hear <_<

 

[drtomc]

beer does not seem to alleviate a 104 fever.

:icon_offtopic: But if you drink enough you'll fail to notice your fever. Besides, good unfiltered homebrew is packed with B group vitamins - it's practically *good* for you. Get Well Soon!

T.

 

[EK]

Thanks butters!
Very helpful for us K&K'ers!

:icon_cheers:
EK

 

[Rabbitz]

Where to start??
<SNIP>

A much better way is to steep some specialty grain, which will give body, colour, flavour, and flavour. (yes, I mentioned it twice. Its worth mentioning twice.) Carapils, crystal, cara-anything, chocolate. Somewhere in the region of 3-10%.

<SNIP>

This prompts two questions:
1. What steeping process? I have heard and read some variations on this theme, without wanting a religious war - Any suggestions?

2. 3-10% of what exactly?

You know, I shouldn't read long posts pre-coffee or pre-beer, It just makes me more confused.

Rabz

 

[Gavo]

This prompts two questions:
1. What steeping process? I have heard and read some variations on this theme, without wanting a religious war - Any suggestions?

Steep Process is simple. Put your crushed grain, that is sutaible for steeping, in a pot of water, say 3 lt and bring it to a temp of 60 to 70 degrees and hold it there for 30 min stir often. Then strain the resultant liquid into another pot and sparge/rinse with approx 2 lt of hot water about 60 - 70 degrees. Then boil for at least 10 min minimum to kill any nasties.


What to steep? Depends on the beer style. Butters has made a couple of suggestions. You could check the recipe database. Craftbrewers site shows what grains require steeping.

Hope this helps I know others will have better info than me. I have only steeped grains twice so far.

 

[microbe]

This prompts two questions:
1. What steeping process? I have heard and read some variations on this theme, without wanting a religious war - Any suggestions?

2. 3-10% of what exactly?

You know, I shouldn't read long posts pre-coffee or pre-beer, It just makes me more confused.

Rabz

From the same post...

~snip~ Just a note on percentages....when talking percentages, what I mean is percentage of extract weight. Which for all intents and purposes, is the dry weight. For liquid malts (including kit tins), that is 80% of the actual weight. For steeped grain, it is about 30% of the weight of the grain. ~snip~

Cheers,

microbe

 

[Rabbitz]

Microbe

I did say I hadn't had my coffee....



Rabz

 

[buttersd70]

This prompts two questions:
1. What steeping process? I have heard and read some variations on this theme, without wanting a religious war - Any suggestions?

2. 3-10% of what exactly?

You know, I shouldn't read long posts pre-coffee or pre-beer, It just makes me more confused.

Rabz

Quickly on question 2.

For extracts, its dry weight, as I said. For grains, its more difficult and complex, because then you are getting into extract lab potentials, extraction and lautering efficiencies, balling equations, mash theory, and all other scientific good stuff. Suffice it to say, about 30% of the grain weight, as steepers really don't need to go into such depths.

Basically, what you do is list all your ingredients by weight, convert any liquids to the dry weight equivilants, get a total, and then work out what percentage of the total ingredients each addition is. This is similar to what an AG brewer will do to work out how much of each grain type to use, as most grains (including specialties) have a 'reccomended' amount per style. So, as an example,with the equivilant dry weights, and percentage of total extract in brackets;

1x1.7 tin (1.36kg,55.9%)
1kg ldm (1 kg, 41.1%)
250g crystal, steeped (0.07kg, 3%)

As for question 1 and the religious war, I think I know where you're coming from. Hot steeping vs cold steeping. Hot steeping has been explained pretty well by gavo. Cold steeping is just putting the grain in a couple of litres of cold water, and leaving it overnight (or longer), then straining, boiling the liquid, etc.
Personally, I don't see it as a war. I have used both methods, for both light and dark grain, without noticing much of a muchance between the two, and certainly not enough to reccomend one over the other. Possibly, maybe, a touch more colour from dark grain if cold steeped. But not enough to get your knickers in a bunch imho. Most of the time, i do it hot, more out of habit than anything else.

 

[nt_jester]

Hi All... thank you everyone for your response... :beer: Butters your response is unreal... I think I might have to cut down a tree and print out your response so I can go through it this weekend when I put down another brew...

Once again thank you all...