Cooper Home Brew Cans - Difference Between Each Series?

[Fermented]

Any good ideas on what to use the standard yeasts for? I've got a few in the fridge.

Cheers - Fermented.

 

[Sunshine_Brewer]

Fermented,

I have cracked some of the premium cans(coopers pilsner and E. lager) open and get a much stronger whiff of hops from it then any of the original series. The yeast is differnet too, don't think it is better though...I think mainly it's a marketing thing.

SB

 

[buttersd70]

Can I just make an observation about tweaking kits?....It's something I've not ranted about ( ), and don't plan on ranting here, but has left me....shall we say, curious, for some time, so I'll pose it more as a question...

If you are already going to go to the trouble of doing a hop boil, which adds flavour, aroma, and bitterness, is there any reason as to why blends, bought or home mixed, of non malt adjuncts are not ditched entirely for malt, given that the hop boil itself can easily counter any additional residual sweetness the added malt will give?

 

[Fermented]

The yeast is differnet too, don't think it is better though...I think mainly it's a marketing thing.

The only difference I noted is that some come in what packets and others in shiny gold ones. IIRC, they mention something about a better yeast with the Premium kits on their site.

If you are already going to go to the trouble of doing a hop boil, which adds flavour, aroma, and bitterness, is there any reason as to why blends, bought or home mixed, of non malt adjuncts are not ditched entirely for malt, given that the hop boil itself can easily counter any additional residual sweetness the added malt will give?

At this stage, I want to use only malts and preferably liquids at that. However, for this quickie, I have some BE2 equivalent lying around and well, waste not, want not, etc - maybe just make another cerveza for the wife with it. I recognise that some kit cans have adequate bittering from POR, tetra and only God knows what else. Hmmm - sounds like I need to read a lot more and stabilise what little I know.

Cheers - Fermented.

Edit: Figured out what to do with the BE2 stuff.

 

[QIK86]

Can I just make an observation about tweaking kits?....It's something I've not ranted about ( ), and don't plan on ranting here, but has left me....shall we say, curious, for some time, so I'll pose it more as a question...

If you are already going to go to the trouble of doing a hop boil, which adds flavour, aroma, and bitterness, is there any reason as to why blends, bought or home mixed, of non malt adjuncts are not ditched entirely for malt, given that the hop boil itself can easily counter any additional residual sweetness the added malt will give?

Good point. Butters convinced me to go all malt and I must say, my beers have improved out of sight! The only dex I use now is for bulk priming.

 

[Jase71]

If you are already going to go to the trouble of doing a hop boil, which adds flavour, aroma, and bitterness, is there any reason as to why blends, bought or home mixed, of non malt adjuncts are not ditched entirely for malt, given that the hop boil itself can easily counter any additional residual sweetness the added malt will give?

Price maybe ? Although I don't need to tighten my belt buckle out of any real necessity, there's something very appealing about producing beer for 25 cents a stubbie

 

[buttersd70]

Qik, mate..haven't seen you around for a while. Good to hear things are going good.

Jase, yeah price may be a consideration....but what I had in mind was not those who are considering tweaks, or just starting to experiment with blending, but those who are already doing quite considerable tweaks, but still cling to dex and maltodex. I can certainly understand using up what you have left in stock, like fermented. Thats a different thing altogether.

But you see a lot that have already pushed the malt up way beyond 1/2 a kilo and are doing hop boils for bitterness and flavour and are dry hopping and are using specialty grains and are using better yeasts (sometimes liquids) and still use maltodextrin and dextrose, for no apparant purpose. I would think that with the amount of time and additional money already going in, cost would appear to be a lower priority. And when you get to this point, going all malt is such a simple step that it can't even really be considered a full step, imho.

Oh, and I'm not referring to the use of dex to deliberately lower the body if the beer style calls for it. Thats different.

 

[Bribie G]

I for one would gladly do all malt extract brews for a quick catch-up brew when I haven't time for a partial mash but as posters above have mentioned, cost comes into it.

Way back when, an all extract brew was half the price of a kit and nearly every LHBS had the honey dispenser on the counter, you took your own tupperware and bought some POR hops or pellets, your Edme yeast and bobs yer uncle. All extract beer for ten or twelve cents a tallie as opposed to 20 cents a tallie for Brigalow.

On returning to HB after a 15 year break I'm horrified at the cost of malt extract and find that rather than pay $13 for a kilo and a half can of Malt extract, which seems to be all that is available, I get good results from a cheaper can, say Coopers on special, and add a kilo and a half of LDME or a kilo of LDME and half of dex, some finishing hops, and go from there.

Taking into account hops and yeast an all extract brew can run up to over $30 whereas I can run up a drinkable kit and bits for around the $20 mark. Wont' win any prizes but nice lawnmower beer.

Now I hear rumblings of "don't be so cheap, at $30 you are still getting the equivalent of $80 of megaswill and probably a more enjoyable beer"

Well in this sense I am being 'cheap' because being an old time brewer I can remember when the cost differential between hb and commercial was more in the ratio of 5 to 1 so the 'cheap' argument doesn't impress me <_< .

Not against all malt in principle, however after Christmas I'm definitely going to try BIAB :icon_cheers: and skip the all extract phase completely. Until then I'll be sticking to my kits/bits/partials.

 

[Gavo]

I would have to agree with Butters on the use of malt and doing all extract brews. Thanks for the encouragement Butters. IMHO if a brewer is already steeping grains and boiling hops for say 15 min and using a kit tin, it is only another 45 min added to the boil and you won't need to use a kit. If you can get a kit very cheap and then improve it then cost will come into it, or if you are just getting used to brewing and making a few additions along the way that is fine to.
On the lines of cost, LDME is around $7.00 - $8.00 a kilogram from the above sponsors, and if you re-use yeast a typical 21 litre brew will cost between $21 and $25. Not much more than a kit + Yeast + 500 grams LDME + 500 grams of dex and some hops.

In my limited experience, all extract all malt brews are far better than kits and once you go there you are unlikely to go back. Watch out though as I think that there is only one direction from extract and that is to Partials and then AG. I think that I am up to the partial stage.

2c

Cheers
Gavo :icon_cheers:

Oh and by the way if it wasn't for this site I would still be doing K&K with dextrose and kit yeast.

 

[buttersd70]

I wasn't even really meaning stepping to full extract as in unhopped extract and doing all the hopping...although its not that far of a jump at this point, but going with all unhopped and hopping it yourself obviously does cause a jump in the price, cos you're using a lot more hops.

I was actually talking about using a hopped kit as the main base, and just switching over the adjunct. What I was thinking of is a lot of recipes where the tweaker has already got 50%, 70%, and sometimes more malt in the adjucnct anyway. If you're already at 70% malt in your adjunct mix, why not go the extra 30%? It would only take a couple of grams extra hops, or even just a lower BG, to counteract such a small increase. Price considerations on the big steps, I can understand. Certainly. It's the relatively small difference on something that is already super-highly-tweaked that I don't get.

Just wanted to clarify that. (Bribie - similar to when you use a morgans goo for the bitterness, so you can get away with still only having to do a 15min addition. )

 

[Gavo]

It's the relatively small difference on something that is already super-highly-tweaked that I don't get.

This is what I was referring to, I didn't mean to get confusing.

 

[LightLager]

Good point. Butters convinced me to go all malt and I must say, my beers have improved out of sight! The only dex I use now is for bulk priming.

Noob, so watch out!

When you say "all malt" do you replace all dextrose with light dry malt? ie: 1kg bag of dextrose is replaced with 1kg bag of malt?

 

[QIK86]

Yes, but not simply a straight swap. As well as replacing the dextrose for malt, you usually need to boil the malt with some hops to add bitterness to offset the additional sweetness the malt will add to the beer.

 

[buttersd70]

Noob, so watch out!

When you say "all malt" do you replace all dextrose with light dry malt? ie: 1kg bag of dextrose is replaced with 1kg bag of malt?

haaaaahaa, another scalp for the taking.

Yes, thats what was meant....dextrose gives alcohol, but no body or flavour. It ferments entirely. Malt is better, because it gives alcohol, body and flavour, but because it doesn't ferment entirley, it leaves residual sweetness, and in the case of kit beers, this sweetness needs to be balanced with more hops, because the kit manufacturers design the kits to be used with blends of different sugars, to cater to the 'lazy brewer'. (not meaning offense to anyone here, hense the quotes. But thats what they do, afterall.) Its a trade-off, between having an easy process, and flavour. You take from one to give to the other.

Edit : Taught you well, did I, young Qik....beat me to the post. :lol:

 

[Jase71]

haaaaahaa, another scalp for the taking.

LightLager - He's right you know. You've had the first taste of this knowledge base, and now you'll never be able to turn back. I'm only now planning my fourth brew, but I feel that my soul as already been stolen. By post five you'll have passed the point of no return, and by post ten you'll already be snubbing anyone who tells you cane sugar is the way to go.

 

[LightLager]

Cheers Gents.....

I will have to find another thread about using hops.


I just remembered that my Toohey's Lager was 14 days in the bottle. I will put two bottles in the fridge.

 

[flattop]

A quick question for the more experienced...

My first Cerveza has a homebrew taste...
Other kits i have brewed haven't got that for various reasons, i have upped the LME/ DEX ratio to help with that.
My second Cerveza is shaping up the same, i am dry hopping it in the hope of getting rid of that flavor, does anyone have other ways to get rid of it?

BTW Jase the Cerveza turned out to be quite drinkable after a few weeks in the bottle, even with the aftertaste.

 

[buttersd70]

A quick question for the more experienced...

My first Cerveza has a homebrew taste...
Other kits i have brewed haven't got that for various reasons, i have upped the LME/ DEX ratio to help with that.
My second Cerveza is shaping up the same, i am dry hopping it in the hope of getting rid of that flavor, does anyone have other ways to get rid of it?

BTW Jase the Cerveza turned out to be quite drinkable after a few weeks in the bottle, even with the aftertaste.

at a guess, partially down to yeast, partially down to clarity, partially the dex/lme ratio, and partialy that, if you'll excuse me, cerveza tastes like shit even when its brewed professionally. ( ^_^ sorry for going there, but its nasty stuff IMHO.)

 

[staggalee]

LightLager - He's right you know. You've had the first taste of this knowledge base, and now you'll never be able to turn back. I'm only now planning my fourth brew, but I feel that my soul as already been stolen. By post five you'll have passed the point of no return, and by post ten you'll already be snubbing anyone who tells you cane sugar is the way to go.

by post 20 you`ll be a stumbling incoherent wreck, by post 40 you`ll be sleeping under a bridge with a dead rat for a pillow, by post 60 you`ll be on the liver transfer list.........
but shit, it`s a great hobby.
someone ought to wise up those poor bastards with their stamp collections. :lol:

stagga.

 

[flattop]

lol@butters, i don't entirely agree but the the Cerveza is for the ministry of war and finance...keep her happy and i can keep financing better brew equipment.
BTW the wheat and lager wheat cross are better brews but she doesn't appreciate them....

So the key is to output a better Cerveza oe brew in 5 in order to brew wtf i want the rest of the time...