Bloody Us-05 Not Attenuating... Again

[Neill]

So i've had issues with US-05 in the past where it just wouldn't attenuate down past about 1020, regardless of the OG. I got pissed off after two brews finished at 1020 and were sickly sweet, also they didn't carbonate well at all. I was brewing at 20 degrees with all of these, and carbonating in the warmest part of my house. Anyway I switched to Nottingham for the last 6-7 brews and have had no issues, it attenuates quickly and always finishes below 1012 (my OG's are 1040 - 1060), i've been quite happy with it.

So last week i decided to brew a LCBA clone with US-05 again, as that was what the recipe called for. Made a 1L starter, OG was 1045, took off well, thick krausen, no infection, 20 degrees ferment. Once again it has hit 1020/1018 and just stopped. No amount of swirling the fermenter will get it any lower and there is no visible signs of fermentation any more. Definately not infected, it tastes great, but 55% attenuation is just not good enough. I am currently warming it to 22-24 degrees to see if that kicks anything off. I'll not be using US-05 again for a long while, maybe the LHBS stocks are old or something, but it's ruined a few brews in the past for me and it's very annoying.

Has anyone had similar problems with it? I am doing all the right things, making a good starter, keeping the ferment temp at 20 degrees etc etc, but they just keep stopping on me.

FWIW recipe was this:

3kg pale LME
300g Dex
300g DME (in the starter)
200g Crystal steeped
Hop boil of Cascade and B-Saaz

Tastes great, but still too sweet. Any suggestions?

I'm thinking of throwing in some Nottingham slurry if raising the temp to 22 doesn't kick start it again. Would be a shame to have this one finish high.

 

[tdh]

I assume you are using US-05 out of a packet and not re-using a slurry.

There is no need to make a starter, just rehydrate in 10 times it's weight of 35-40*C tap water, then attemperate.

You should easily achieve 1/4 to 1/5 of original gravity.

tdh

 

[Steve]

NO NEED for a starter with dry yeast, no need to aerate, no need to stir in, just sprinkle on top (if you havent re-hydrated it). Its probably done its dash in the starter?
Cheers
Steve

 

[Wonderwoman]

I use US-05 for most of my brews and I've never had a problem with it. As Steve suggests, I just sprinkle the dry yeast on top of the wort and awawy she goes...

 

[tdh]

Yep, starter aint necessary.
Sure, sprinkling on top works too but I want to see that it has rehydrated in the glass before I pitch.

tdh

 

[ah_glenno]

maybe the hydrometer is not measuring correctly? i seem to remember a thread about cheap hydrometers tending to have the measure paper inside moving around?

 

[jonocarroll]

Once again it has hit 1020/1018 and just stopped. No amount of swirling the fermenter will get it any lower and there is no visible signs of fermentation any more.

What do you mean by 'stopped'? By visible signs do you mean that the airlock has stopped?

It's possible that your measurements (hydrometer?) are innacurate, though there would need to be a double problem to give the right answers for Nottingham. It's more possible that US05 just takes a bit longer, and ferments slowly towards the end, which may not give airlock activity. How long do you leave the brew in the fermenter?

If it is just stalling, carefully racking to a secondary may just rouse it enough to finish off.

Anyway I switched to Nottingham for the last 6-7 brews and have had no issues, it attenuates quickly and always finishes below 1012 (my OG's are 1040 - 1060), i've been quite happy with it.

Nottingham will finish particularly fast, which would be consistent with the above problem of not leaving it long enough.

Its probably done its dash in the starter?

:blink:

This statement would imply that both stepping-up starters and pitching back onto a yeast cake were impossible... not sure this is right.

 

[Tony]

I use US-05 all the time and i have never had a problem with it.

I just sprinkle the dry yeast pack into the empty fermenter and rack the cooled brew onto it and the next morning its going crazy.

I usually mash cooler at around 64 to 65 to get a dry crisp beer when using this yeast, its how i like it. I always get 80 - 85% attenuation, and on the couple of occasions i have used Nottingham i have got 90% attenuation with an altbier getting down to 1.006 from 1.054. I usually get 1.008 to 1.010 with the US-05.

If i was allowed one guess as to the problem, id say you are mashing too hot but its extract so that stuffs that theory.

Extract wont attenuate as well as a cool mash but you should get better results than 1.020..... depends on the extract i guess. Maybe thats the problem..... the extract, not the yeas ???

cheers

 

[alowen474]

This statement would imply that both stepping-up starters and pitching back onto a yeast cake were impossible... not sure this is right.
[/quote]
I would imagine this would be in reference to the performance of the yeast. Dry yeast is provided with all the nutrient it need to multiply and ferment the wort, usually pitched in ales at a rate of 1g/2L. If this yeast is placed in a starter and grown, these nutrients are consumed. If the larger volume of wort is not conditioned with enough oxygen or enough minerals, the yeast will not be able to multiply and may end up with the attenuation proplem being experienced here.

 

[Stuster]

Made a 1L starter

300g DME (in the starter)

Did you use that much DME in a 1L starter?

Anyway, I've never had any issues with US-05.

 

[staggalee]

Assuming you did 22 litres, that should finish around 1015 shouldn`t it?
I would have thought the 1045 og would have been closer to early `50`s with those ingredients.
Have you checked the accuracy of the hydro?

stagga.

 

[Tony]

Did you use that much DME in a 1L starter?

Anyway, I've never had any issues with US-05.

I have a general rule of 100g/Liter. gives about 1.040

 

[Stuster]

Exactly, Tony. Just wondering. If he used all that DME in the starter that might explain everything.

 

[mikem108]

+1 waste of time making a starter with dry yeast, rehydration is all that is necessary, this could be the issue as already pointed out by others
My problem with us05 is usually the opposite it goes too hard and attenuates too highly

 

[tdh]

Same here mikem.
My last Alt had LOADS of Munich, mashed at 66*C and plummeted from 1.050 down to 1.009. No drama though, flavour is spot on, I just love this beasts enthusiasm.

tdh

 

[Tony]

Exactly, Tony. Just wondering. If he used all that DME in the starter that might explain everything.

YEah at the rate of 300g in a liter starter you would have over 1.100 in the starter.

Once its fermented out the yeast could become alcahol stressed, killing off some cells and leaving others, others that dont attenuate so well.

just a theory.

I say try it once more but just either dry pitch the yeast or as tdh said..... rehydrate it for 15 min in come cooled boiled water. I have used this method a lot and it works well.

cheers

 

[Bribie G]

I used US-05 in a few APA style ales and even a CAP 'fake lager' with the maize and USA hops etc. They were all slow to attenuate and a thin foamy little krausen persisted up to a fortnight in primary although racking and cold conditioning knocked that back. And they turned out far sweeter than using Nottingham. Like the OP I've given up on US-05 as I'm not really that much into USA styles and hops. Nowadays my yeast list is:

• UK Bitters and Milds - liquid yeasts especially Ringwood
• Aussie Pales and olds - good old bottle a Coopers.
• "house brew" Aussie standard lagers - Mauribrew lager yeast (Morgans blue packet), yup that's right does a fair job and ferments out quickly and no off notes.
• Pilseners and Euro lagers - liquid lager yeasts - experimenting with Steam Beer lager yeast at the moment and that one will hopefully replace the Mauribrew.

I hear people saying that US-05 is their main yeast, however I'm definitely over it.

 

[tdh]

Tony. Can I join your 'Defender of the Pride' group? Is it on facebook?

tdh

 

[Bribie G]

Tony. Can I join your 'Defender of the Pride' group? Is it on facebook?

tdh

:icon_offtopic: are we talking POR here? I'd be in that.

 

[Neill]

sorry my original post wasn't quite right, the gravity of the starter was 1045, i used enough teaspoons of dme to get that. The other 300g or so was in the fermenter. The starter was pitched at high krausen, about 48 hours in. I'm raising the temp now, see what it does in a few days. Might rack it on saturday too.