Belgian Beer Lovers Unite!

[tangent]

The thread that had to happen (again):

I'm a big lover of Chimay Tripel, Hoegaarden, Leffe Blonde and Forbidden Fruit, plus appreciate many more.
I've digested the book Brew like a Monk & currently finishing Farmhouse Ales which really are inspiring reading!
I've been gleaning tips from other Belgian lovers on this site, but I'd love to hear about some more beer reviews and home recipes.

What do you like about the mousey, wet cardboard, horse smell of Brettanomyces?
What is it about the sour lactic acid of a cherry lambic that curls your toes?
Do you feel like a rebel breaking the Reinheitsgebot or brewing a Belgian Specialty Ale where the BJCP say "guidelines, what guidelines"? h34r:

I've formulated 2 recipes recently:
View attachment 5352
View attachment 5353
They tend to change on brewday, so these are the corrected afterwards recipes.

Bring it on Malnourished! I'd love to hear more about Cantillon's Ros de Gambrinus.

 

[Snow]

I've always been attracted to Belgian ales because they are so interesting, complex and challenging to brew. I always get the greatest personal satisfaction from getting a Belgian right, than any other beer style I've brewed.

I'm half way through reading BLAM and have decided to dedicate 2006 to Belgian ales (after I've done Batz's smoked porter, of course ). Although, I don't think I'm quite yet brave enought to try and brew with lambic cultures. I think I'll try and perfect pale ales, dubbels and tripels first...

More power to Belgian lovers! :super:

- Snow

 

[Malnourished]

Bring it on Malnourished! I'd love to hear more about Cantillon's Ros de Gambrinus.

OK, well here's an edited version of my Ratebeer rating (4.7/5.) It's long-winded and I don't think it's my best work but it'll have to do for now.

Bottled 2003, drank September 2004. Holy crap. My expectations for this beer really couldnt have been any higher, so I was expecting to be at least mildly disappointed. Wrong! Hazy deep pink-red colour which pours with a massive head which disintegrates to nothing very quickly. The first aroma that hit me was of sweat - in fact it looked like the cork had been sweating - it was very wet, but came out easily. Has a slight raspberry jam note, but I thought it smelled more like cherries than raspberries (I think they use a small proportion of cherries too.) Theres a fair bit of oak character, a touch of cheese in there and perhaps some vanilla. Theres not much of the classic Brett. aroma until it warms a fair bit. I perhaps would have liked a bit more funkiness in the aroma than this had. Its worth noting that this is NOT best served at 6-7C as the brewery suggests - I liked it much better warm. The taste starts out lightly astringent without any discernible sweetness, then a blistering sourness hits which is just awesome. At colder temperatures its a really clean, lactic (and perhaps a bit citric) sourness but as it warms the vinegary, acetic flavours come through which really make this beer awesome. I note that lots of other raters found this too dry but I didnt find it particularly so, though its definitely not sweet! Theres no apparent raspberry flavour and carbonation is high. With a bit more funkiness this would be the perfect beer. Brilliant.
Rerate: Had another bottle of this, thinking that Id probably rate it down because I was getting a bit Cantilloned out. I was wrong - this stuff is great. Easily my favourite Cantillon.

As far as brewing Belgians goes, I don't have very much experience, and my results have been somewhat mixed. My pLambic is approaching 3 years but it never got particularly good (mainly because I didn't really know what I was doing at the time) and seems to be getting worse, though the part to which I added Shiraz grapes is mildly promising. I'll probably bottle it all some time this winter, or maybe not. It's not like there's any rush! I doubt I'll bother trying another, but I'm keen to have a play with the Wyeast Roeselare blend at some point.

 

[tangent]

My pLambic is approaching 3 years but it never got particularly good (mainly because I didn't really know what I was doing at the time) and seems to be getting worse, though the part to which I added Shiraz grapes is mildly promising.

have you got the original recipe? - i'd love some more details.

 

[Malnourished]

have you got the original recipe? - i'd love some more details.

[post="100567"][/post]​

Well it's not so much about the recipe as the process, but here's what I did.

2/3 pils malt, 1/3 flaked wheat to OG 1.045. Infusion mash on the high end to maximise dextrin production. Sparge at as close to 100C as possible.

100g nasty-looking "hops" from the local health food store, left out in the summer sun for a few weeks, then baked lightly and left to rest for a few weeks in a cool, dark place. Boil a bit over 2hrs.

Fermentation was where I started making some pretty significant mistakes. I primary fermented with S-04 (mistake #1), racked (#2) into plastic (#3) and then added the Wyeast Blend.

If I were to do it again, I'd do the following (based on Raj Apte's posts to the pLambic digest):
Immersion chill to 45C, chuck a handful of malt into the wort in the boiler, leave overnight, rack off trub into glass carboy and pitch Wyeast Blend, then wait.

If you are serious about doing this kind of thing you really should read Jim Liddil's amazing article here http://brewery.org/brewery/library/LmbicJL0696.html and subscribe to, and read the archives of the new pLambic digest. A few guys on there (Apte, particularly) really know their stuff. Guinard's Lambic style series book is really good if you can find it too - I think it's more useful with regard to lambic than Wild Brews once you disregard the crazy-short fermentation times his recipes suggest.

 

[Screwtop]

I really need to make much larger batches of Duvel. Store it away to mature with good intentions, but then I think about it and can't resist a taste. "Wow better than last time" it improves so much with time. Tasting weekly the stock just doesn't last long enough.

 

[Mr Bond]

I really need to make much larger batches of Duvel. Store it away to mature with good intentions, but then I think about it and can't resist a taste. "Wow better than last time" it improves so much with time. Tasting weekly the stock just doesn't last long enough.

[post="100572"][/post]​

I assume you are doing the Grumpys Duvel clone with the correct type yeast?

If so have u done a side by side tasting with the real thing,and if so how did it stack up?

 

[Screwtop]

I really need to make much larger batches of Duvel. Store it away to mature with good intentions, but then I think about it and can't resist a taste. "Wow better than last time" it improves so much with time. Tasting weekly the stock just doesn't last long enough.

[post="100572"][/post]​

I assume you are doing the Grumpys Duvel clone with the correct type yeast?

If so have u done a side by side tasting with the real thing,and if so how did it stack up?

[post="100579"][/post]​

Yep Grumpys with a few mods and W1388 at 20 deg. Yeast roused a couple of times to get FG down as low as possible and some original wort to prime with a little champers yeast from friend who is winemaker. Then bottles are cold cond, slow to condition but result is great. Small volume, but Wow! Not exactly the Grumpys clone. All this is not my idea, the winemaking friend is a Duvel lover and HBer. SBS tasting - very, close to the real deal. Except for the last buy from Theo's Bottlo at Maroochydore. It was foul, tasted like it had been refrigerated, then allowed to warm before refrigerating again. Previous to this all from this outlet have been good. At $10.45 a pop I'm glad I brew my own.

 

[tangent]

a little champers yeast from friend who is winemaker

almost all HBS have "champagne" yeast avail dried.
it's all i use for cider

what about adding shiraz grapes, where from, how crushed and ferment temps?

 

[homekegger1]

Tried my first Chimay Blue today. And at $8 for a 330ml bottle I was a little sceptical. But with a 9% alcohol content and one of the best tasting beers I have ever had I must say I am now a big fan.

I thought the Duval was a tasty drop but this has certainly raised my eyebrow.

I am glad I actually found it and tried it. :chug: :chug: :chug:

What are your favourite beers...

Cheers

Craig

p.s. does anyone know of an easy copy of this style of beer of the non-mash brewer???

 

[kungy]

Love the Belgian Beers. My favourites are Duvel and Forbidden Fruit.

Can't help you with the recipes, just the advice that a Belgian Liquid Yeast is pretty much essential to replicate the recipes.

Will

 

[warrenlw63]

Hadn't had Rochefort 10 for a couple of years.

Got all nostalgic and had a bottle last night... Now this is a beer that hasn't lost anything. High alc. Yet so smooth with a clean finish.

The beer world's answer to rum and raisin icecream. :beerbang:

Warren -

 

[racemate]

Has anyone had New Glarus Red...It's a Belgian clone from Wisconsin that's scooped up a pile of awards...and put the Belgians up a kriek without a mash paddle...ok I'm drunk..that was a horrible pun....anyway the one beer I've had in my lifetime that destroyed my impressions of what beer was. I lived in Oregon and I could only find it occasionally and after that it didn't come around at all...I missed it and still do. If anybody ever goes to Milwaukee or Chicago or those environs, drink one for me..
They use 5 lbs of montmorency cherries per gallon of beer (can we even get good sour cherries in Aus?) I attempted a few clones in the states and they were very good...but they paled..
Anybody?
oh, wait, link http://www.newglarusbrewing.com/beers/belgian.html

 

[kook]

I've had New Glarus Belgian Red, heres my (brief) notes:

New Glarus Belgian Red - 86/100
Aroma 8/10, Appearance 4/5, Flavour 9/10, Palate 4/5, Overall 18/20.
Notes: Marzipan aroma with cherry stones, slightly woody too. Sweet start with a big fruity cherry flavour. So balanced, medium bodied and refreshing. Red with a short pink head. Wonderful fruit beer.

 

[Malnourished]

(can we even get good sour cherries in Aus?)

Yep. I get Morello cherries at one of those pick-your-own places. It's way cheaper than regular cherries and they don't charge you admission either because nobody eats them straight off the tree.

The ones I used this year are pretty intensely sour. I've never had NG Belgian Red so I can't really offer much by way of a comparison.

 

[neonmeate]

you can also get those big jars of hungarian morello cherries in syrup that work well although obviously not as well as fresh stuff.

btw i had new glarus a few years back and i loved it! absolutely amazingly rich cherry flavour - and marzipanny as kook says. not much in the way of actual beer underneath but who cares. i hope megabeer or IBS gets it in one day...

i can recommend (and i think malnourished can also recommend) mahlab to get the marzipanny flavour. these are basically a particular type of cherry stone, dried and designed to be used in middle-eastern cakes etc. you can get em from herbies here in sydney, in rozelle.

 

[mhan7073]

My favourite two belgian beers at the moment are triple karmeliert and delirium tremens. I hear lots of people say "tastes great on a hot summer's day" but heading into winter, these beers absolutely do the trick at about 8-9 %.

I do find brewing belgian beers at home quite exspensive. The yeast is of paramount importance (isn't it always). If you plan to brew high alcohol beers 8-13% then you really can't go past those recappable grolsch bottles. I recently bottle a batch in a 1.5l grolsch recappable magnum, might want to save that one for a party though as it's got the punch of half a bottle of spirits.

I also recommend you buy the glasses- they're quite expensive for glasses but add so much to the enjoyment of the beer.

At the moment I'm trying to get a really good recipe for a belgian style barley wine.

All the best brewing,

Mic

 

[bindi]

I do find brewing belgian beers at home quite exspensive. The yeast is of paramount importance (isn't it always). If you plan to brew high alcohol beers 8-13% then you really can't go past those recappable grolsch bottles. I recently bottle a batch in a 1.5l grolsch recappable magnum, might want to save that one for a party though as it's got the punch of half a bottle of spirits.

I also recommend you buy the glasses- they're quite expensive for glasses but add so much to the enjoyment of the beer.

[/quote]

I feel you are 'preaching to [a lot of] the converted' here, like me.
Welcome
Time for another pint of [guess what.. Beer]

 

[goatherder]

Tried my first Chimay Blue today. And at $8 for a 330ml bottle I was a little sceptical. But with a 9% alcohol content and one of the best tasting beers I have ever had I must say I am now a big fan.

Have a crack at the Chimay Grand Reserve. It's the one in the 750ml bottle with the champagne cork. It's better than the Blue in my opinion. At about 18 bucks it's an expensive bottle of beer, but considering a decent bottle of wine can cost you this much and more, I reckon it's good value. It's also a damn fine replacement for a bottle of wine over dinner.

My first experience with Trappists was in Belgium last year. I had heard of them but never tasted them, and I didn't know one from the other. I told the barmaid "I'd like to try a Trappist". She asked which one and I said "something nice". She handed me a Rochefort 10. My beer world changed completely right there.

 

[mhan7073]

Maybe I am preaching to the converted.

Has anyone tried in of the American belgian-esque brews? There's quite a number, and I think can give you a good idea in how you can manipulate current brewing trends.

In terms of home brew belgian costs, I'm considering blending kits (in 2 fermentors). Say a brewferm ale with a coopers ale. That should dilute the cost (and hopefully not the beer).

Mic