Wild Ideas.

[brendanos]

I am soon to be the proud owner of the four single strain wild bugs currently on offer from Wyeast including brettanomyces bruxellensis, brettanomyces lambicus, lactobacillus and pediococcus, as well as the mixed cultures lambic and roeselare, all courtesy of Grain and Grape (well except for the lambic which was a gift from Roy at TWOC).

I am a huge fan of Wild Brews (I'm guessing I'm not the only one that felt compelled to one day open a wild brewery after reading this book?) and have heard about some of the American craft beers being produced with single strains, but for those of you so inclined, what would you do if you had these cultures?

Obviously I can replicate many of the classic belgian wild beers, but I'm more interested to know if any of you have ever though about creating something new. I have a very open mind, and love the idea of anything radical and/or extreme.

If I end up brewing something inspired by you, then you will no doubt be very welcome to try the finished product (even if it is years from now!)

Descriptions of the strains follow.

Brettanomyces bruxellensis
Wild yeast isolated from brewery cultures in the Brussels region of Belgium. Produces the classic sweaty horse blanket character of indigenous beers: gueuze, lambics, sour browns. Ferments best in worts with lower pH after primary fermentation has begun. This strain is generally used in conjunction with S. cerevisiae as well as other wild yeast and lactic bacteria. Produces some acidity and may form a pellicle in bottles or casks. Generally requires 3-6 months aging for flavor to fully develop.
Flocculation: medium
Attenuation: very high
Temperature Range: 60-75 F (15-24 C)
Alcohol Tolerance: approximately 12% ABV

Brettanomyces lambicus
Wild yeast isolated from Belgian lambic beers. Produces a pie cherry-like flavor and sourness along with distinct brett character. Ferments best in worts with reduced pH after primary fermentation has begun. May form a pellicle in bottles or casks. Works best in conjunction with other yeast and lactic bacteria to produce the classic Belgian character. Generally requires 3-6 months of aging to fully develop flavor characteristics.
Flocculation: medium
Attenuation: very high
Temperature Range: 60-75 F (15-24 C)
Alcohol Tolerance: approximately 12% ABV

Lactobacillus
Lactic acid bacteria isolated from a Belgian brewery. This culture produces moderate levels of acidity and is commonly found in many types of beers including gueuze, lambics sour brown ales and Berliner Weisse. Always used in conjunction with S.cerevisiae and often with various wild yeast.
Temperature Range: 60-95 F (15-35 C)
Alcohol Tolerance: approximately 9% ABV

Pediococcus
Lactic acid bacteria used in the production of Belgian style beers where additional acidity is desirable. Often found in gueuze and other Belgian style beer. Acid production will increase with storage time. May cause ropiness with extended storage time. May produce low levels of diacetyl.
Temperature Range: 60-95 F (15-35 C)
Alcohol Tolerance: approximately 9% ABV

Belgian Lambic Blend
Contains a selection of Saccharomyces and non-Saccharomyces including Belgian-style wheat beer yeast, sherry yeast, two Brettanomyces strains and lactic acid bacteria. While this mixture does not include all possible cultures found in Belgian Lambics, it is representative of the organisms most important for the desirable flavor components of these beers as they are brewed in West Flanders.
Temperature Range: 63-75 F (17-24 C)
Alcohol Tolerance: approximately 12% ABV

Roeselare Blend
A blend of lambic cultures including lactic bacteria. Produces beers with a complex, earthy profile and distinct pie cherry sourness from Brettanomyces culture. Aging for up to 18 months is required for full flavor profile and acidity to develop. Will produce a very dry profile due to super-attenuative nature of mixed cultures.
Traditionally, primary fermentation is inoculated with this mixed culture and fermented to attenuation. The young beer is then racked to oak barrels where secondary fermentation continues for a year or more. Several months to a year later, another batch of beer is produced in the same manner. This young beer is then blended with the oak aged beer to the brew master's discretion. You do not have to go to these lengths to make a wonderful beer with this culture; your imagination is the only limit.
Alcohol tolerance: approximately 11% ABV
Flocculation: variable
Apparent attenuation: 80%+
Temperature range: 65-85?F (18-30?C)

Also if you've ever tasted (or brewed) any unique beers along these lines please let us hear about them. Breweries I've enjoyed tasting, reading, or hearing about (other than the obvious classics) doing something unique include: De Dolle, La Baladin, Fantome, New Belgium, Dogfish Head, Pizza Port, Russian River and Buckleys (just joshing).

The only thing I'm sitting on at present is a split batch of lambic, and the next beer I'm planning is a belgian strong golden with plenty of new-world hop character and finished with either pedio or lacto. From there... who knows.

And yes, I do realise I'm going to have dump some/a lot of beer along the way, but where's the thrill otherwise?

And as a final sidenote, does anyone know where I can get a whole lot of glass 5-10L flagons/demijohns?

 

[Tony]

sooooo you paid for an infection :blink:

what ever tickles your fancy

good luck with it..... i admire your courage

cheers

 

[InCider]

Brendanos,

Maaaaaate. I'm so in the zone for this! I do need to read that book.

I'm drinking a "Landsborough Lambic" at the moment. It was meant to be my swap beer, but became a liability.

Two weeks in the fermenter and it was fine. Shedloads of Saaz to hop out this "Cold Filter" type beer. By week three, I went to the Man-shed to bottle and it had a 4-5mm sheet of Brewer's Curse and my heart sunk. Swap beer ruined.

So I had a taste. Ok, but something my palate detected as off. I fretted, called Browndog - no answer, so took a punt and bottled, then put down a replacement beer for the swap.

When I was telling Screwtop of this, and discussing a Lambic he tasted is SA, I mentioned the thick crud on my sick brew. He told me that while it's infected, the sheet of scum protects the beer in some way. Something to do wiht C02 maybe? He'd know what I'm rabbiting on about, and I'll bet you do too.

And the beer is... moorish! I love it. Slightly off taste, good if you like cider, but nothing like the infected beers I have made in the past. This is brewdiful!

Sean.

 

[glennheinzel]

I can't offer any inspiration on the recipe side of things, but I know that Brewcraft (who have a presence in WA) sell 4.5l demijohn for $15 and 11.5l "glass jars" for $42.20.

Good luck.

 

[Tony]

:huh: Interesting

 

[brendanos]

Thanks Ruhk, I'll definately check them out.

sooooo you paid for an infection :blink:

And handsomely, too. These things cost a good $9 more than your regular smack pack!

InCider - that would be a pellicle, possibly from a Brett infection. I'm jealous - my pseudo-lambic's have been relaxing for 4 months now and still no sign of a pellicle.

 

[chillamacgilla73]

If your keen for a long n fun brewday with a mate, have a crack at a turbid mash -

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...st&p=236519

 

[ausdb]

And as a final sidenote, does anyone know where I can get a whole lot of glass 5-10L flagons/demijohns?

The recycling centre at Balcatta had a heap of the big glass sherry flagons the last time I was there, but I think they are only 2L. If you are going to buy a few try brewmart in Bayswater

 

[bconnery]

brendanos,

You might find some ideas here: http://madfermentationist.blogspot.com/200...rew-barrel.html

Generally looking at sites like the babblebelt one, can't find the link right now, would give you loads of good ideas...

Personally I love a good fresh fruit lambic so long term I'd consider that as a good left field idea source.

Maybe some sort of disticntly aussie fruit to utilise? quandong lambic? Or else just something a little out of the ordinary.

 

[Asher]

Something a little different... and a bit the same...

A couple of years ago now 'Trash Mash Al' aka BigAl was brewing a big batch of low IBU high wheat content megaswill for the summer months. This was to be kegged and divided between himself and Lil-davo (a mate) who had recently built himself a keggerator. Anyway this beer managed to pick up some sort of wild yeast infection along the way. picking this story up the following year ... This infection although only mild in Al's kegs (that had been put to the back of the fridge until he needed the keg room) was actually quite tasty with all the right barnyard/wet horse hair flavours desirable in a Wild beer. Lil-davo's keg on the other hand had it much tougher. With the keggerator blowing up and all, his keg of swill had spent 12 months in his bedroom slowly maturing into a fine wild beer. Having found this out I gladly took it off his hands and decanted it onto a mother load of cherries where it spent the next 6 months. Finally last month I got around to bottling it in champaign bottles with corks and caps. I also bottled off some of the original beer before fruiting... so what do I have?

If Darwin theories prove correct hopefully the new Vic Park Strain of some of the above bacteria - bottled thanks to Trash Mash Al & Lil-davo

Hopefully will be pulling the VP-Krieks out for consumption over the Christmas brewing season

Asher for now

 

[Screwtop]

InCider - that would be a pellicle, possibly from a Brett infection. I'm jealous - my pseudo-lambic's have been relaxing for 4 months now and still no sign of a pellicle.

Like he says Sean

Look after your little Landsborough Pellicle

, and keep him thoroughly isolated, everything in the brewery will be covered with sanitised plastic and there'll be a footbath of Iodophor at the door before your next visit.

Drinking the stuff has to provide a boost to the immune system I reckon

How long before we see Landsborough Lambic's on the shelf Sean?

 

[kook]

Look forward to hearing your results brendanos

I've tried sour & funky beers from all the breweries you mention above (except Buckleys ) and I'm happy to lend a hand tasting any results

 

[winkle]

If you are playing with fruit beers on a lambic base try Rosellas - tart/sweet and pink/red (much cheaper than sour cherrys). I'll get my fruit beer right one day

 

[brendanos]

I tried a bottle of Achel Brune on the weekend, soured. It was quite acidic, and had an aroma which to me smelt like hay soaked in animal sweat, so my guess is brett. I'd really like to cellar some, though they are overcarbonated, and some have already exploded on the way from Belgium, so I'm not sure how safe it would be.

 

[InCider]

Look after your little Landsborough Pellicle

, and keep him thoroughly isolated, everything in the brewery will be covered with sanitised plastic and there'll be a footbath of Iodophor at the door before your next visit.

How long before we see Landsborough Lambic's on the shelf Sean?

I am happy with one batch of pellicle, and but after 22l I may need a break! Had one last night and it was fine. First smell/sip is abrupt, but then becomes my slender, blonde and supple mistress... ahhh...

If I get this again I will give up all cleaing products and go back to gurney-only regime. It yielded SFA infections. But me and pellicle are having a hot fling now....

Want one Screwy?

InCider.

 

[Screwtop]

I am happy with one batch of pellicle, and but after 22l I may need a break! Had one last night and it was fine. First smell/sip is abrupt, but then becomes my slender, blonde and supple mistress... ahhh...

If I get this again I will give up all cleaing products and go back to gurney-only regime. It yielded SFA infections. But me and pellicle are having a hot fling now....

Want one Screwy?

InCider.

Never miss an opportunity to try a beer I say, it's all about palate education, but if it's crap I'll spit it. If it's as good as the sauce I'll swallow :lol:

 

[kook]

Had much luck playing around with these strains brendanos?

Anyone else played around with single strains of bugs & critters?

I'm planning to do a small 10-12L batch of simple all brett l. beer in the next few weeks. 100% Pils to 1.056, with about 25 IBU of styrian goldings, and 1g/L of styrians at 5 mins. I then hope to use the slurry for a further 1 or 2 full size batches.

I'll get a starter going on the weekend, though I've heard some experiences of starters taking a week or two to kick off and floc out. Anyone have any practical experience with this?

 

[kook]

Well it seems that Brett L. doesn't need treatment much different to a saccharomyces starter. Only real difference is that the appearance is much darker.

I started this as 40ml in a 210ml starter, and have just stepped it up to 1750ml. This will be pitched into around 12L of wort on the weekend.

Also have a 1L starter of berliner weisse blend (3191?) on the go.

 

[kook]

It looks like that starter was more than enough to kick off fermentation in less than 24 hrs. Nice health krausen forming on the all-brett beer now, with a fairly active airlock.

Now it's just a matter of waiting!

Will give it about 3 weeks for primary fermentation, then rack and store it in a 10L jerry can for a few months. I'm still a little unsure what I'm going to use the slurry for, so many options!

By the way, the starter smelt like old socks and wet leather, but actually tasted pretty bland. Very slight spice and a hint of funk in the aftertaste.

 

[razz]

Where did you find that steristirrer kook ? Looks almost vintage.