Style Of The Week 5/12/07 - American Amber Ale

[mje1980]

Changed my mind while weighing out the hops. Kept the galena 60 min, but im now going 25g each Columbus, Cascade, and Amarillo at 1 min. Probably go US05 too. Smells great, not as dark as i thought it would be, but im not too fussed, as long as it tastes nice!. Pre boil is looking "bigger" than i expected.

 

[mje1980]

Changed my mind again, they're all going in the cube. Hop combo smells great in the bowl!!!!

 

[A3k]

Hey fellas,
I just did Jamils recipe for American Amber from here

The recipe calls for a 68.5 mash. I thought this was a little high so went around 67.5.

I made 60 Litres, 2 x 25lt cubes and one 5lt flasks worth.

The issue im having is a low FG.

Flask fermented with Windsor for a test - FG = 1022
First cube worth fermented with Kolsch yeast (2565) FG 1018. (i kept swirling the fermenter and raised the temp towards the end i dont think its a stuck ferment, just a low fermentable wort)
Im about to filter/keg the first cube. Will probably leave it as is. Taste great, nice maltiness, im just concerned about the high FG.

Im curious if anyone has any thoughts on a yeast for the next lot. I want to get the FG down. Im considering finishing off with Nottingham or Champagne. When making the beer i was intending on doing a side by side comparison with US05 and the Koslch, but now im thinking the US05 will probably finish too high.

Cheers,
Al

 

[raven19]

Al - Is it a balanced beer now it has fermented?

Being an 'amber ale', I would have thought a higher FG, low alc was the plan (to a degree)?

No FG noted in JZ's recipe - however I suspect its a combination of your higher mash temp and the slightly higher spec component in the grain bill.

 

[A3k]

Hi Raven,
The sample i tasted this morning didn't seem unbalanced, but i do think it'll seem thicker than i'd intended.

The BJCP suggests an OG of 1010 to 1015, so i'm only 3 points above that i guess.

I would've thought JZ would've designed that recipe to be within the BJCP guidelines, but i could be wrong.

Looking back at the recipe, it is 15% spec. I mashed at 1Deg less than JZ, so i wonder what he was getting. Different system different brewer though.


Maybe i'll have to wait till the first batch is kegged (hopefully ready by the weekend) before pitching the second lot to see what i want from it.


Cheers,
Al

 

[bconnery]

Hey fellas,
I just did Jamils recipe for American Amber from here

The recipe calls for a 68.5 mash. I thought this was a little high so went around 67.5.

I made 60 Litres, 2 x 25lt cubes and one 5lt flasks worth.

The issue im having is a low FG.

Flask fermented with Windsor for a test - FG = 1022
First cube worth fermented with Kolsch yeast (2565) FG 1018. (i kept swirling the fermenter and raised the temp towards the end i dont think its a stuck ferment, just a low fermentable wort)
Im about to filter/keg the first cube. Will probably leave it as is. Taste great, nice maltiness, im just concerned about the high FG.

Im curious if anyone has any thoughts on a yeast for the next lot. I want to get the FG down. Im considering finishing off with Nottingham or Champagne. When making the beer i was intending on doing a side by side comparison with US05 and the Koslch, but now im thinking the US05 will probably finish too high.

Cheers,
Al

Haven't looked at the recipe aspects etc. but Windsor always finishes high for me, 1018/20+ unless I mash really low, 65 at the outside, usually lower.

 

[A3k]

Yeah, the Windsor was just in a 5lt sample. Havent used Windsor mutch, so thought id give it a crack.

A 25lt cube was done with 2565 Kolsch. I assumed that one would get lower that 1018. I just made a Kolsch which got down to 1008, but that had no specialties and a few deg lower mash.

 

[Nick JD]

Have you thought about using US05?

 

[A3k]

Hi Nick,
Yeah, when making the beer i was intending on doing a side by side comparison with US05 and the Kolsch yeast.

As the Kolsch only dropped to 1018, and with US05 usually quoted as being less attenuative than 2565, i was concerned i'd end up closer to 1020.

 

[Nick JD]

Hi Nick,
Yeah, when making the beer i was intending on doing a side by side comparison with US05 and the Kolsch yeast.

As the Kolsch only dropped to 1018, and with US05 usually quoted as being less attenuative than 2565, i was concerned i'd end up closer to 1020.

25% spec malts is a lot - could this be a factor?

 

[A3k]

Yeah, fair call.
Now knowing that, any ideas for getting the FG down on the next brew. Or should i just not bother.

I am copying JZs recipe, so maybe i should just go with it.

 

[Nick JD]

Yeah, fair call.
Now knowing that, any ideas for getting the FG down on the next brew. Or should i just not bother.

I am copying JZs recipe, so maybe i should just go with it.

You could use a highly attenuative yeast, but it'll probably shift it further from the style than a high FG would.

I'd increase mash duration to 180 minutes and maybe drop the temp to 66C. This will increase the % of fermentable sugaz quite a bit.

 

[raven19]

Yeah, fair call.
Now knowing that, any ideas for getting the FG down on the next brew. Or should i just not bother.

You could mash lower or drop some of the spec malts, sub in some black or choc to keep colour as you like.

Can you report back once its chilled and carbed up in the keg? It may change a little, and it also may evolve with some time in the keg?

 

[A3k]

Nick, you're probably right about not using a more attenuative yeast. Will probalby stick with US05.

the sample tastes good, so i'll probalby try it again if the only problem is sweetness. Unfortunately Lower mash doesn't help this 60lt batch, biggest problem with bigger batches i guess, but at least you get more beer for almost the same amount of time.

might do a run of smaller ambers and do some experimenting.

Raven, I'll post the results soonish, should be kegged by the weekend.

 

[A3k]

Hey guys,
Filtered, Kegged &carbed and my AAA (with kolsch yeast) on Saturday.

Gotta say, it tastes awesome. Really malty and complex. The hop flavour and aroma wasnt as much as i was hoping, but it works well with the maltiness.

You can tell that it finished at 1018. Itd be better if it finished at 1014, but it doesnt really seem out of balance, so im happy.

If i make it again, ill either mash lower, or reduce the crystal malt. Im thinking of the former though.


I pitched the next lot on the weekend (made 2 cubes worth) with two packs of US05. Im wondering if thatll bring the hops out a bit more than the Kolsch yeast.

I also made 5lt with Windsor yeast. Tried that and its a completely different beer. It was chilled in a flask, so missed the cube hops and bitterness associated with no chilling.
This finished at 1022. With the lower bitterness it is out of balance, but not terrible. It tastes like a thicker English ale. Theres almost no hop character, and the yeast character is nice. I was surprised how different this one was.

 

[raven19]

This finished at 1022.

Damn that is high!

Slightly :icon_offtopic: - had this happen with the swiss day lager yeast in a cube of my schwarzbier stopped at 1020. Something dodgy then got into the fermentor - so I pitched some lambic dregs and will sample in 6 months or so time.

 

[Midnight Brew]

Just after some feedback with this recipe. I usually make APA's and use very little crystal malt so Im hoping this isnt going to be overboard. Im after a nice grain bill with plenty of complexity.

Traditional Ale 53%
Munich Light 20%
Wheat 10%
Crystal (140ebc) 8%
Amber 6%
Crystal (215ebc) 2%
Chocolate 1%

Temp 55/62/67/72/78
Time 5/ 10/50/10/Raise Bag

Bravo FWH to 5 ibu
Cascade FWH to 2 ibu
Bravo to 18.5 ibu @ 20 mins
Cascade to 6.5 ibu @ 20 mins
Bravo to ibu 6.5 ibu @ 5 mins
Cascade to 2.5 ibu @ 5 mins

American Ale II 1272

OG 1050
FG 1012
Alc 5%
EBC 28
IBU 40
Bitterness Ratio 0.812

 

[Steve@PMF82]

Drop the IBU, I put an AAA into the competitions at 40 IBU and 60/10 min additions, and got penalised for being too malt driven. It was 7% Crystal.

Why would you drop the IBU if penalised for being too malt driven?

If you have a complex grain bill with lots of spec you want to increase the bitterness so that it is balanced.

IMO midnight i would be bittering at 50IBU for that grainbill and gravity and i would get the extra IBUs from 60min additions.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

Why would you drop the IBU if penalised for being too malt driven?

If you have a complex grain bill with lots of spec you want to increase the bitterness so that it is balanced.

IMO midnight i would be bittering at 50IBU for that grainbill and gravity and i would get the extra IBUs from 60min additions.

Sorry, bad type on the tablet with wife nagging me to go out. Supposed to write "not malt driven enough" and the hops were the star. I needed the beer to be maltier.

My apologies for confusion.

 

[therook]

Time to make an amber on some bits and pieces, whats everyones thoughts on this

Ale - 75%

Munich 1 - 10%

Caraamber - 5%

Caramalt - 5%

Crystal med - 2.5%

Amber - 2%



Northdown 60min - 20g

Willamette 10min - 20g

Willamette 0min - 10g

Willamette DRY - 10g



IBU = 32

Throwing this on Wyeast 1099 slurry which is currently fermenting an English Bitter which had just fermented a English Blonde.

Rook