Sour beer not souring!

[TheWiggman]

Interesting. All my reading on the topic indicates to add any funk after the ferment so as not to affect yeast health and that lacto will continue to increase acidity over extended periods of time (years).
Also keen on hearing the results.

 

[damoninja]

Interesting. All my reading on the topic indicates to add any funk after the ferment so as not to affect yeast health and that lacto will continue to increase acidity over extended periods of time (years).
Also keen on hearing the results.

Usually when people talk about funk and sour, they're two different things. Funk is usually your bretty / funky yeasts, sour is just that, sour.

A kettle sour like this is really soured to the max that the bacteria can handle, you're talking a huge gain in acidity for an extremely small amount of sugars (like 1 gravity point!). For your traditional sour of mixed bugs yeah lacto/ pedio will continue souring slowly for months, as will brett keep funkin it up. They take so much longer because of the environment, alcohol, dropped pH, less sugars so on.

The mixed cultures are where this is at, while a fast sour like this will make a pleasant sour beer it won't often make a rich complex sour like these mixed cultures can.

 

[checkers]

Thanks everyone for your advice! Given me a lot to think about! I'll let you all know how it's getting along when I get home from work thisarvo.

 

[checkers]

PH is now 4.1 so dropped 7 in 24h
There is a dead set white foam on top of the wort and I can hear it foaming is this usual?
This it the only pic I can get without removing the clingwrap.

 

[damoninja]

4.1 ain't bad far cry from what it should reach, but all things going well will be OK in another 24hr or so.

There is a dead set white foam on top of the wort and I can hear it foaming is this usual?

Very thin white foam normal, notable though... maybe yeast.

Sound usually means CO2 from yeast fermentation... check your gravity, if it's dropped you may have yeast.........

Is that glad wrap being pressed out by pressure?

 

[checkers]

Yep glad wrap has risen. I'll check gravity in the morning and see what is happening. I've never actually heard and seen bubbling in a fermenter though. Yes it is very thin white layer of bubbles..

 

[checkers]

Though when I tried to purge the headspace with a keg that had just blown a couple of drops did blow in I must admit.
This thing is a comedy of errors.

 

[pvan340]

Keep at it! First time brewing sours is a nerve wracking experience. I was tasting mine every 24 hours during the souring process, my thoughts going "Is it actually tasting good? Can I smell bile? Is this Parmesan cheese I've brewed?" But it turned out well for a first time, if it tastes ok after souring, it will probably become a decent beer.

 

[checkers]

Yep so the gravity has dropped to 1.033 from 1.045.
PH seems to have risen .1 to 4.2 so no more drop in ph. I think this might be one for the veggie patch. If anyone has any ideas how to salvage it before I tip it speak up ;-)

 

[damoninja]

See how it goes, might be OK. Not going to get any more sour though......

With the gravity drop it signals infection likely a wild yeast but who knows it could be good (probably shit )

Ride it out a few days and see how it tastes when it's done. Probably shit but who knows.

Lesson from this one is sanitation - and I mean serious sanitation... 10 times better than you'd do for a clean wort. Before I quick sour in the fermenter I even hit it with sodium percarbonate, rinse with boiling water a few times then hit it with FRESH starsan...

Yeast can survive a hit from starsan alone, unlikely but in theory what you could have is yeast from a prior brew haha

 

[huez]

Taste it before you dump it, you've come this far, you may as well see it though. I was under the impression you get a slight drop in gravity with just the lacto and then the yeast finishes it off. I've only done a couple of berliners and thats how its happened for me, and what i was told would happen. 4.1pH is high but thrown some fruit in there, raspberries well get you close to 3.6pH. I've done one with passionfruit that turned out pretty good

 

[checkers]

Yeah cool it didn't taste offensive... could I lower the ph a bit with 88% lactic acid from the bottle you think?

 

[huez]

Very one dimensional flavour, i wouldn't, i'd personally go the fruit route. Raspberries and blackberries or raspberries and blueberries are good options.

 

[checkers]

I was planning on going mango you think that would work?

 

[damoninja]

Let it ferment out see what you have and reassess, if fruiting a beer isn't cheap so see what you have before committing

 

[checkers]

Thanks bud. Set ferm fridge to 18c and pitched a pack of us-05. See how we go.

I've gotten really excited with everything I've learned from this thread so decided to try and kettle sour a beer to boil Friday arvo. I'll let you all know if I've won or lost after all your help and input on Friday!!

 

[checkers]

the kettle sour worked!!

Thanks all once again for all your help!

FYI the first beer I stuffed up has finished fermenting and doesn't taste rancid so I'm going to throw mangoes in it and see what happens