Sodium Metasulphite For Chloramine Removal

[Parks]

Based on this report for Brisbane it looks like there is basically zero Chlorine and on average 1.1mg/L Chloramine (I assume that Chloramine is being included under total Chlorine and free Chlorine is listed as zero).

So if I use roughly 40L (10g) for a batch that's half a Campden tablet at 3mg/L Chlorine, or a bit over 1/6th of a tablet (~120mg) @ 1.1mg/L of potassium metabisulfite.

I now see why some use "a pinch" of sodium met in their water assuming the powder is 100% sodium met.

http://www.urbanutilities.com.au/uploads/file/NEW%20Water%20Quality%20Data/1%20Oct%202011%20-%2030%20Sept%202012/Brisbane%20Oct%202011-Sept%202012.pdf

--EDIT-- helps if I attach the link.

 

[slash22000]

My understanding is that it doesn't really hurt to use too much (within reason of course) which is why they recommend simply 1 tablet per 20 gallons. I dunno if I would be bothered cutting one into sixths.

 

[Parks]

My understanding is that it doesn't really hurt to use too much (within reason of course) which is why they recommend simply 1 tablet per 20 gallons. I dunno if I would be bothered cutting one into sixths.

The do say within reason so I don't know if 6 times as much as you need qualifies. I know I had a funny "minerally" taste in my last American Amber which could either have been too much sodium met or gypsum or both.

The other thing is I am adding sodium met power so adding close to the correct quantity is much easier than splitting a tablet.

 

[manticle]

Work out the weight and use sodium met powder instead of a tablet.

Too much of anything is never great. I've mentioned before that sulphites in wine and cider give me a headache (I base this on the fact that low-sulphite wines and no sulphite ciders don't).

Good article on chloramine removal slash.

 

[Greg.L]

All yeast produce some SO2 as part of their metabolism, some of them quite a bit.(SO2 is the active part of metabisulfite, about 50%) If you are adding such small amounts, wouldnt the SO2 produced by the yeast be enough to do the job, or is it important to get rid of the chloramine before mashing?

 

[manticle]

I believe it's in the mash where the chemical reactions begin. I will check but chlorine + polyphenols from memory.

 

[Parks]

Yep, it's the mash you are worried about.

 

[Brewing pig]

I use ascorbic acid (vitamin C) to remove chlorine and chloramines from my tap water. By-product is ammonia which is a yeast nutrient.
I am no water chemist and rely on https://sites.google.com/site/brunwater/ to set my brew water chemistry.
Only need about 25mg of pure ascorbic acid for 34 litres of Toowoomba's tap water (about 1 mg/L total chlorine), or a little pinch with my fingers.
A 25g pack from my LHBS will do me for 1000 brews. A little goes a long way. Any more, if unreacted with chlorine, would acidify the water.
Also use ~3-4% acidulated malt and always check the mash pH and haven't had any problems.
I get the monthly water quality report from the local council and use this with the Bru'n spreadsheet.
Most of my brews just need 6-8 g of gypsum added to my 34 litres of Toowoomba starting water.

 

[Adr_0]

has anyone else used ascorbic acid, sodium ascorbate or calcium ascorbate to remove chlorine/chloramines?

 

[sluggerdog]

Looking into this I did a quick google for Sodium Metabisulphite, the following came up. Is this the same thing that people are using in their mash water? I'm sure I have some of this at home somewhere from my earlier brewing days before I woke up and started using starsan.

(This being a sterilizer is the confusion on my part). I'd be adding it to Brisbane water.

 

[2much2spend]

Looking into this I did a quick google for Sodium Metabisulphite, the following came up. Is this the same thing that people are using in their mash water? I'm sure I have some of this at home somewhere from my earlier brewing days before I woke up and started using starsan.

(This being a sterilizer is the confusion on my part). I'd be adding it to Brisbane water.

My understanding is that of you use this in with citric acid then it becomes a perestive too.

 

[rude]

Had a read of the thread about the Janet's Brown recipe on The Electric Brewery the other day
It was under general recipe discussion started by Pratty 1
They use potassium metabisulphite heres what they said

Potassium metabisulphite
Popular with wine makers, potassium metabisulphite is used to help preserve and prevent oxidation in wine. It often comes in 500mg tablet form called 'campden tablets' but be aware that campden tablets can be either sodium or potassium metabisulphite. We recommend limiting the use of sodium in beer so make sure to use the potassium metabisulphite version if you go with tablet form.
In beer making potassium metabisulphite is used to remove chlorine or chloramine from the tap water. If left in, chlorine or chloramine can give beer a band-aid or plastic taste.
Chlorine or chloramine is added to most public water supplies to kill disease-causing bacteria that the water or its transport pipes might contain. Brewers from years ago used to be able to simply leave water to sit out overnight to allow chlorine to evaporate but most municipalities now use chloramine instead as it is more stable (doesn't break down or evaporate as easily). Leaving it out overnight will do next to nothing.
Typical municipalities use up to 3 ppm of chlorine or chloramine in their water. 500mg of potassium metabisulphite is enough to treat up to 20 gallons of water. This is perfect for our setup as we always start with 20 gallons of strike/sparge water and our municipality uses 2 ppm of chloramine. Check your municipal water report to see what is used in your region. Most, by law, must publish water reports yearly that show the average levels of various chemicals. If in doubt, assume your municipality uses chlorine or chloramine in the water (as most do). There's no harm in using 500mg of potassium metabisulphite in your brewing water. The effect on the other water properties is negligible.
Some brewers choose instead to use charcoal based water filters to remove chlorine or chloramine. Charcoal filters remove less chlorine/chloramine as they become saturated, and the amount removed is directly related to the speed at which the water is passed through the filter. So how do you know when to change your filter or at what speed to filter? Good question. We have no idea! This is why we use potassium metabisulphite in 500mg tablet form instead. It's quick, dirt cheap, and works instantaneously.

 

[panzerd18]

I use 1/2 campden tablet per 23 litre batch.

 

[sluggerdog]

Where can I find potassium metasulphite in Brisbane? I'm not having much luck finding it. Thanks

 

[manticle]

Craftbrewer have it on their website.1.50 for 4g.

 

[djar007]

Has there been a poll done on who uses what. I see a lot of people filtering with carbon, and a few using sodium or potassium met. Some research suggests boiling, or standing water for many days will reduce. But none is as effective as the met additions . well not as quick to do the job at the very least. For me the sodium met addition is cheap, last minute and the compounds left as a result of the conversion are not of a quantity that will impact the beer. Why is it that from my limited understanding of commercial brewing they carbon filter the water?

 

[sp0rk]

Just wondering if anyone came to a consensus on what amount of Sodium Met to use in place of a Campden Tablet eventually?
@MHB any input?
My water filter cracked after I dropped it the other week and I'd really like to brew tomorrow, but I'd rather not use unfiltered tank water (I don't trust all the dirt and shit we get blown over from the mines here)
So I guess it's back to shitty Muswellbrook town water, not having time to get over to Newcastle to get Campden Tablets, the Brigalow Sanitiser will have to be my next best bet.

 

[MHB]

Works out at about 1 Campden tablet per 100L to remove Cl, each tablet is about 0.44g. K-met or 0.5g of Na-Met
You are going to need pretty accurate scales, or get a bit more creative, you could weigh a small portion and dissolve it in a measured amount of water, then use C1V1=C2V2 to work out how much of the liquid to use, wont last long, so tip out the excess it wont keep till next brew.
For example 10g Na-Met dissolved in 1L of water will give you 10.0g/L
At 0.5g/100L you want 0.005g/L to kill the Cl
If you were treating say 35L, plug what you have into the dilution equation
(x)L*10.0g/L=35*0.005g/L same as (x)L=(35*0.005)/10 you need 0.0175L or 17.5mL

 

[sp0rk]

Works out at about 1 Campden tablet per 100L to remove Cl, each tablet is about 0.44g. K-met or 0.5g of Na-Met
You are going to need pretty accurate scales, or get a bit more creative, you could weigh a small portion and dissolve it in a measured amount of water, then use C1V1=C2V2 to work out how much of the liquid to use, wont last long, so tip out the excess it wont keep till next brew.
For example 10g Na-Met dissolved in 1L of water will give you 10.0g/L
At 0.5g/100L you want 0.005g/L to kill the Cl
If you were treating say 35L, plug what you have into the dilution equation
(x)L*10.0g/L=35*0.005g/L same as (x)L=(35*0.005)/10 you need 0.0175L or 17.5mL

Thanks Mark, that's great
I should have remembered C1V1=C2V2 from uni (only did chem last year) but I've already blocked it out to try and remember the microbio stuff

 

[MHB]

All brewers should have it tattooed on the inside of there eyelids
M