Secondary Fermentation in homebrew kits

[trustyrusty]

Hi AHB - (NOTE Title - kit brewing )

I was reading John Palmers How to - and is saying that it is a really good idea. (He says for the first time brewer not to worry, but I would assume he means after the 3rd / 4th time to start using a secondary fermentor / conditioning phase)

I have not done that yet, and think maybe I am getting some bitterness / off flavours (after tastes tannins, not beer bitterness). (I think that a few of my beers maybe a little bitter in the after taste, it is not bad - passable but I want to make a beer that has a good finish, mouthfeel).

I am now thinking it might be the Krausen. A lot of beers I have made have had a good Krausen head, that I assume would have settled back in the wort. Coopers actually sell a fermentor that allows you to remove krausen after a few days.

How mach can this help in regards to overall taste and reduction of off flavours - really important?

Thanks

 

[JDW81]

Ok, so a couple of things to note here.

1: Krausen is not the root of your flavour problems. Krausen is simply a combination of yeast and wort (mostly yeast) that rises to the top of the brew while it is fermenting. It won't itself give off bad flavours unless the fermentation conditions (too hot) or sanitation of your gear isn't up to scratch. The coopers fermenter you mention has a collar that prevents the krausen from dirtying up the sides of your fermenter, it doesn't actually remove the krausen from the fermenting beer.

That flavour your describing is often known as kit beer twang. It comes from a combination of the kit itself and often less than ideal fermentation conditions. out of interest, what temps are you fermenting at? It can be avoided by fermenting your ales at no greater than 20 degrees (18 is ideal) and your lagers between 12-14 degrees (yeast strain dependent) and pitching a decent amount of healthy yeast (often no the one that is provided with the kit).

2: Secondary fermentation is something that isn't really recommended any more (even by the man Palmer). It has its place, but for the bog standard home brewed ale (even with a crap load of dry hops) it isn't really necessary. It doesn't aid with clarity in the long term, won't reduce any funky flavours that have developed during your primary fermentation and is a big infection and oxidation risk due to your beer being unnecessarily exposed to air and extra equipment. The best way to condition your beer (including for clarity) is in the definitive package (keg or bottle) directly from the primary fermenter after fermentation has well and truly ceased.

JD

 

[Mardoo]

If you're using the first edition of How to Brew - which is the text in the free online copy - you need to get the most recent edition. He's made changes since the first one and no longer recommends transfer to a secondary, as noted by JDW81

 

[trustyrusty]

Thanks, What The *&%&%% - I think he should update or close that site if no longer necessary. No wonder we get confused....

I think the issue is the kit yeast - and temperature. Some of my brews and I drinking now might have been a 27 degrees (hot summer) , not ideal but still within the

range.

He does mention re-hydration as important in yeast kits - is that wrong to now

Have got a couple in the bottle that are different yeasts - waiting to see...

 

[barls]

he does quite clearly state that the online edition is the 1st and has a link plus ad for the 3rd edition for sale on the front page.

 

[JDW81]

He does mention re-hydration as important in yeast kits - is that wrong to now

Nah, rehydration of dry yeast is still in vogue.

 

[trustyrusty]

Thanks, one thing in the recipes here, there are a lot that say 2nd ferm. Is that just cause they are old or still needed - depending on process, if all grain or kit? cheers

 

[JDW81]

Thanks, one thing in the recipes here, there are a lot that say 2nd ferm. Is that just cause they are old or still needed - depending on process, if all grain or kit? cheers

Not really needed for 99% of kit beers, even though they say you need one (they also say that you should ferment at 25+ degrees). Age of the kit doesn't really come into the need for a secondary.

Ferment fully in your primary and package as you normally would once you reach your FG.

JD

 

[plateofboxes]

Just to add another voice to this crowd - you really don't need a secondary at all, and anywhere that is saying you *must* is a little old, or just set in their ways. Transferring just gives more steps for you to stuff something up (infection, oxidation are the biggies). Even additions like dry hops, fruit, vanilla or coffee (for example) can be done no problems in primary.

If done well, it doesn't necessarily detract from the beer. But for beginners, especially on kits, it's not going to add anything. I have had some sit in their primary bucket for up to 4-5months and came out fine.

Also, just buy a copy of How To Brew, it costs less than a batch of beer, and will save from ruining at least one some time in the future.

 

[troopa]

Anything over 20 degrees is where you start to get into fast ferment territory and will increase unpleasant undesirable flavours that would almost certainly attribute to all your concerns posted above.

Try and keep your temperatures in the 16-19 degree range for most of your ales (some wheats and saisons excluded). Some people here when starting out used an ice brick and bucket or a wet towel with a fan blowing over it to try and keep the temps down during the warmer months.

Or try and source a free working fridge and purchase an external temperature controller from one of the brew shops, About $60. and this will hold your fridge at the temps you want

Yeast parts a significant amount of the flavour you find in beers and the yeast supplied in the kits is usually not of the best. Try some of the different yeasts from a decent brew shop and you will notice an immediate difference in the quality your brews