Saflager 23 temp control, pitching , starter

[dynamite]

First time poster. I went to the brew shop in the hope of coming back with something other then s23 as I haven't had great success with it however the bloke talked me into in, im using it for lager I want a hoppy little european lager but have yet to acheive this. Im using hallertau hops once again as recomended but it doesn't seem to have much body to me what would you recommend? So s23 should I do a starter and how do I do this ? The bloke in the shop told me to do it at 21 degress for 15 minutes, he also told me to pitch the yeast at 21 but I thought you should pitch saf at 15 degrees ? What is the optimal temperature for saflager. The last lager I fermented using s23 took ages and lacks..... well something I fermented it at 11 degrees, dropped it to 4 degrees for half a week once I had reached the fg. Im using coopers lager extract and be1 because I want to get an ok cheap as lager down pat before I experiment with dark ales and pilsiners and bock. Any advice would be awesome as im a newbie only 3rd brew in

 

[timmi9191]

You need to do some of your research on lagers.. There's plenty of reference material out there.

In short, they can be difficult to for new brewers. Temp control, d- rest, lagering.. Etc.

I've used s-23 @18 degrees and had great results in a California common.

I've used to at 12 with a 1 degree rise a day d-rest with poor results.

As a new brewer I'd recommend using a clean ale yeast like us-05, or wyeast kolsch at 15 or 16, it will give you a clean faux lager with less effort IMO.

 

[Let's Brew Beer]

Currently doing a simcoe SmaSh using s23 for the first time, got it @ a constant 12C (seems to enjoy it there) i've heard a few people who use it let it sit around the 12C mark then give it a 18C d-rest for a cuppla days, will post later on in regards to said brew.