Powells Malt - My Experiences
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Batz said:
Hi Batz
It's a good deal for you, but this justpisses me off even more. I've actually paid for the Munich malt and I've told them it's not useable, but have only received an empty promise of a replacement bag. It ***** me that I'm out of pocket for Munich malt, yet they're prepared to send 3 bags to Queensland without charge.
Monday I'm sending them a letter and a sample of the Munich. I'll request a full refund for the Caramalt, Munich and 2 bags of Organic Pilsner that the other brewers bought.
If I get not luck through this approach then I might track down the relative authority in Victoria that deals with food safety standards and send them a sample of the mouldy malt.
Bottom line is I shouldn't be the one chasing them. I identified the problem, they said they would fix it, but have failed to follow up. That's unacceptable business practices. They will fold if they treat corporate customers with such comtempt. Minimum from Powells should be a few lines giving an update, even if they haven't got around to doing anything.
I was a big enough customer for them to take my money, but not big enough for them to care about when something went wrong :angry: :excl:
MAH
PhilS
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Hello MAH,
When you send the sample back to them of the malts, include a letter giving them notice of two weeks to reply with your request, or you will lodge a complaint with the equivalent of Consumer Affairs.
You need to give this in writing to them and enought time for them to reply. Usually a letter along these lines will be more than enough for them to take you seriously, and honour their promises
If you have some time available, Consumer affairs (or whatever their new name is) have a template on their website showing how to construct a letter using the correct terms.
Goodluck
Regards,
Phil
When you send the sample back to them of the malts, include a letter giving them notice of two weeks to reply with your request, or you will lodge a complaint with the equivalent of Consumer Affairs.
You need to give this in writing to them and enought time for them to reply. Usually a letter along these lines will be more than enough for them to take you seriously, and honour their promises
If you have some time available, Consumer affairs (or whatever their new name is) have a template on their website showing how to construct a letter using the correct terms.
Goodluck
Regards,
Phil
OK fellow brewers, there's no need for me to go down the path of hiring a QC, Powells have come to the party (well partially).
I got a reply to my last email, and to summarise the story, most of their malt is packed in bulk (500kg or 1tonne) so they don't have a huge supply of the 25kg bags. They've just packed some bags and can now send the malt today.
Why didn't they say there would be a delay due to production when they made the offer to replace the malt? They need to work on their communication.
Now I say they have partially come to the party because a) I paid for Caramalt and Munich malt, and they're replacing it with Ale, and B) becuase they're posting it, they can only send 20kg bags to comply with Australia post requirements. So I've paid $42 for malt and will $31.41 worth of replacement, meaning I'm out of pocket by $10.59. It's not a lot of money, but it's the principle of you should get what you've paid for. BUT this does have to be balanced against the very generous discount they gave on the order, with a 1tonne price break give at 400kg.
Second issue was the organic pilsner and mould on this malt. It was explained that:
"Organic Barley is subject to both field and storage moulds, "dependant on harvest conditions" - as no chemicals can be used to control mould. While the malting process and especially the kilning process, will de-activate these moulds, the spores will remain visible on the grain. He added that all grain shows visible mould under a microscope, but this is much more evident in late-harvested organic barley."
I'll let you all make up your own minds on the organic pilsner.
Conclusion
I reckon it's time to wrap this thread up with my final thoughts on my initial Powells experience.
1. They're a generous company willing to deal with small homebrewer co-op buys, and give a generous price break.
2. They have some production quality issues to work through.
3. They need to improve their communication (in particular the speed of reply), to reduce uncertainty and possible confusion. Main problem here is that they've an email account and take many days to respond. Modern business environments use email for rapid communication and this is the standard expected by most individuals. If you can't use this technology in the commonly expected way, then don't offer the service as it can be generate more ill will, than good will. Just offer phone, fax and snail mail.
4. Their malt makes nice beer. The mild I made with the ale malt is as good as any other malt I've used. If they improve their service delivery to match the malt (mouldy Munich excluded), then they potentially have a winner.
Overall I'm going to sit on the fence when comes to Powells, as my initial good will was wiped away by poor after sales service. But as I've said all along these are just my experiences.
I wish Grant and Suzie Powell the best of luck.
Cheers
MAH
I got a reply to my last email, and to summarise the story, most of their malt is packed in bulk (500kg or 1tonne) so they don't have a huge supply of the 25kg bags. They've just packed some bags and can now send the malt today.
Why didn't they say there would be a delay due to production when they made the offer to replace the malt? They need to work on their communication.
Now I say they have partially come to the party because a) I paid for Caramalt and Munich malt, and they're replacing it with Ale, and B) becuase they're posting it, they can only send 20kg bags to comply with Australia post requirements. So I've paid $42 for malt and will $31.41 worth of replacement, meaning I'm out of pocket by $10.59. It's not a lot of money, but it's the principle of you should get what you've paid for. BUT this does have to be balanced against the very generous discount they gave on the order, with a 1tonne price break give at 400kg.
Second issue was the organic pilsner and mould on this malt. It was explained that:
"Organic Barley is subject to both field and storage moulds, "dependant on harvest conditions" - as no chemicals can be used to control mould. While the malting process and especially the kilning process, will de-activate these moulds, the spores will remain visible on the grain. He added that all grain shows visible mould under a microscope, but this is much more evident in late-harvested organic barley."
I'll let you all make up your own minds on the organic pilsner.
Conclusion
I reckon it's time to wrap this thread up with my final thoughts on my initial Powells experience.
1. They're a generous company willing to deal with small homebrewer co-op buys, and give a generous price break.
2. They have some production quality issues to work through.
3. They need to improve their communication (in particular the speed of reply), to reduce uncertainty and possible confusion. Main problem here is that they've an email account and take many days to respond. Modern business environments use email for rapid communication and this is the standard expected by most individuals. If you can't use this technology in the commonly expected way, then don't offer the service as it can be generate more ill will, than good will. Just offer phone, fax and snail mail.
4. Their malt makes nice beer. The mild I made with the ale malt is as good as any other malt I've used. If they improve their service delivery to match the malt (mouldy Munich excluded), then they potentially have a winner.
Overall I'm going to sit on the fence when comes to Powells, as my initial good will was wiped away by poor after sales service. But as I've said all along these are just my experiences.
I wish Grant and Suzie Powell the best of luck.
Cheers
MAH
THE DRUNK ARAB
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I know MAH wanted to call and end to this thread but just want to add my view thus far.
I opened my first bag of Powells Ale malt last night and was greeted with more foreign matter than you could poke a mash paddle at. I have purchased Weyermanns, Barret and Burston's, Joe White and AMC malts in bulk previously and they had nowhere near the amount of crap in them if any. :angry:
I just hope the malt makes a decent batch. <_<
Here is a photo, the green articles are Bindi's by the looks. :huh:
C&B
TDA
I opened my first bag of Powells Ale malt last night and was greeted with more foreign matter than you could poke a mash paddle at. I have purchased Weyermanns, Barret and Burston's, Joe White and AMC malts in bulk previously and they had nowhere near the amount of crap in them if any. :angry:
I just hope the malt makes a decent batch. <_<
Here is a photo, the green articles are Bindi's by the looks. :huh:
C&B
TDA
SteveSA
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I'm posting this here so as not to take the other Powells thread off topic...
There's no doubt the quality control of Powells has been questionable in the past. The amount of foreign matter (stalk, mould, stones) in the initial purchase by MAH was like nothing I've ever seen.
At the time I was willing to put it down to a relatively new company having teething problems. ie. it's something that we can reasonbly expect to be fixed over time.
Now we all know some bloody good beer has been made from Powells malt and I've nothing against using them. However, I'm curious to know if they are still having the same quality control issue now as they were 6 months ago.
Has anyone ordered recently that can add comment?
Not long to go
Steve
There's no doubt the quality control of Powells has been questionable in the past. The amount of foreign matter (stalk, mould, stones) in the initial purchase by MAH was like nothing I've ever seen.
At the time I was willing to put it down to a relatively new company having teething problems. ie. it's something that we can reasonbly expect to be fixed over time.
Now we all know some bloody good beer has been made from Powells malt and I've nothing against using them. However, I'm curious to know if they are still having the same quality control issue now as they were 6 months ago.
Has anyone ordered recently that can add comment?
Not long to go
Steve
dreamboat
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You are right there mikem.... those pelicans are a pita if they get caught up in your mill, and are a possible cause of the poor efficiency that some have reported with this malt. They really do not convert well at all, even with a multi temp or decoction schedule!
dreamboat
dreamboat
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Well, I once crushed something about half the size of a stork without any problems, so I reckon my Valley Mill would manage a stork.
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...08&hl=cockroach
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...08&hl=cockroach
johnno
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I have pasted this comment here from the other thread as it is more appropriate here.
I get my grain crushed at Grain and Grape and have only asked then to run the grain through once before and did not notice much difference in the efficiency.
Just about to start the brewday with the JW malts so I will post with results later today.
johnno
johnno
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I ended up boiling a bit less and hitting my target gravity.
All this time I have been using Powells malts I was thinking I was doing something wrong.
Seems for whatever reason the Powells are not working for me and my system.
I will use Powells again for my next ale in a couple of weeks.
This time I will ask Grain and Grape to put it through the mill twice.
I will use exactly the same grain bill as yesterday.
5.25 kg Pilsner, Malt Craft Export (Joe White) (3.2 EBC) Grain 91.3 %
0.25 kg Crystal (Joe White) (141.8 EBC) Grain 4.3 %
0.25 kg Wheat Malt, Malt Craft (Joe White) (3.5 EBC) Grain 4.3 %
I am not getting the same sugar extraction with the Powells, so some more experimentation is due.
cheers
johnno
All this time I have been using Powells malts I was thinking I was doing something wrong.
Seems for whatever reason the Powells are not working for me and my system.
I will use Powells again for my next ale in a couple of weeks.
This time I will ask Grain and Grape to put it through the mill twice.
I will use exactly the same grain bill as yesterday.
5.25 kg Pilsner, Malt Craft Export (Joe White) (3.2 EBC) Grain 91.3 %
0.25 kg Crystal (Joe White) (141.8 EBC) Grain 4.3 %
0.25 kg Wheat Malt, Malt Craft (Joe White) (3.5 EBC) Grain 4.3 %
I am not getting the same sugar extraction with the Powells, so some more experimentation is due.
cheers
johnno
T.D.
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Thanks for posting your findings Johnno. So what was your actual efficincy for the Joe White batch?
Next brew I will also mill the grain twice. But this time there's no way I'm hand-cranking the mill!! Almost killed me last time putting 8kg only once through!
Next brew I will also mill the grain twice. But this time there's no way I'm hand-cranking the mill!! Almost killed me last time putting 8kg only once through!
Gout
Bentleigh Brau Haus
local and buying into the market? Vs a well known
profit margin?
I would no pay more for a new malt thats not proven.... however due to the saving i have stuck by powells and its doing me well. Will be a while untill this silly brewer catches up to the malt quality. if i ever do i may spend more and move to tother malts however that will be a while off
....bed time this 7% coopers copy is killing me
profit margin?
I would no pay more for a new malt thats not proven.... however due to the saving i have stuck by powells and its doing me well. Will be a while untill this silly brewer catches up to the malt quality. if i ever do i may spend more and move to tother malts however that will be a while off
....bed time this 7% coopers copy is killing me
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