Outdoor Beer Wall

[cubbie]

Hi Guys,

I have always bottled my beer, or used my Tap-a-draft (which has served me very well) but with some house renovations in the pipeline I have (well my wife actually) thought on a way that we might be able to incorporate a keg setup. I live on a very narrow block in an old terraced house, so room in doors and space out doors is at a premium. I would love a decent sized shed in the back yard but it is not an option. Anyway my plans went into council last week for council approval and I will soon be starting the detailed design phase before seeking building approval.

So it is time to think about how to setup a kegging system. In the plans the architect has a built-in BBQ and sink up against a low feature wall in the backyard. I can live with the BBQ and thought would it be possible to have some beer taps coming out of the wall. I would raise the wall to about fence height and it would have natural stone cladding, behind the wall would sit a chest freezer, this would also be the location of my hot water system and maybe a bit of space for storage.

The back yard is only 6m wide and just over 7m long. The space behind the pizza oven is about 60cm (this would likely be my access point) and then the narrowest point behind the feature (beer) wall is about 85cm. At its widest point it is about 150cm. The shed would be a lot smaller and not against the fence line. I would expect the feature (beer) wall to be constructed from brick.

Anyway in the attached image you will get the picture.

So I have a number of questions.

Is there enough space for a keg system (I think about 3 kegs)?
Could I get taps mounted on a stone clad brick wall?
What sort of taps could I mount?
Is 60cm large enough for access?
What sort of insulation/weather protection is required?
Any other issues?


If anyone has any comments, questions or suggestions that would be great.

Cheers,

Cubbie.

 

[brettprevans]

well the first thing you should do is piss off the hills hoist rotary clothes line and get a collapsable wall hung line. much more practicle.

you can probably do wht your proposiung but your problem is getting kegs in and out of the chesty once its all built in. the other issue is the beer lines getting warm once leaving the chesty and it running to the taps. your best bet maybe a glycol system.

edit:
how is the pizza oven like 4 time as big as the bbq? theres also wasted space behind the oven. may as well have that as shed space (read extra brewing space)

 

[cubbie]

well the first thing you should do is piss off the hills hoist rotary clothes line and get a collapsable wall hung line. much more practicle.

you can probably do wht your proposiung but your problem is getting kegs in and out of the chesty once its all built in. the other issue is the beer lines getting warm once leaving the chesty and it running to the taps. your best bet maybe a glycol system.

edit:
how is the pizza oven like 4 time as big as the bbq? theres also wasted space behind the oven. may as well have that as shed space (read extra brewing space)

Points noted..

The hills hoist is collapsible and removable. In fact I have a right of way out back an my park my car there. the Pizza oven I built a few years back and is that size, a proper pizza over does take up a bit of room and yes that built in BBQ is small. i have an existing shed about the size in the plan and in it I have my fermenting fridge, gear and some garden tools. I brew out on my paving.

I definately see the warming of the beer line as an issue.

the only things fixed to the ground in those plans is the house and the pizza oven

 

[Greeno]

Points noted..

The hills hoist is collapsible and removable. In fact I have a right of way out back an my park my car there. the Pizza oven I built a few years back and is that size, a proper pizza over does take up a bit of room and yes that built in BBQ is small. i have an existing shed about the size in the plan and in it I have my fermenting fridge, gear and some garden tools. I brew out on my paving.

I definately see the warming of the beer line as an issue.

the only things fixed to the ground in those plans is the house and the pizza oven

:icon_offtopic: Hey mate, would love any info you have about building your woodfired oven..

Cheers,

Greeno

 

[Sammus]

I've often thought about the beer line warming issue in a setup like this. I'd like to do something similar one day. What I was thinking is to have a water line running to the last tap and back to the freezer, all wrapped in heavy insulation, with a little pond pump capable of running 24/7 sitting in a reservoir in the freezer circulating water with the lines. Surely with good enough insulation around the beer and coolant line it all should stay reasonably cool?

 

[brettprevans]

depending on how deep the decking is you could drop a chesty beneath the decking (you'd never get it out again), have a hatch door so you could access it. but tyour going to have the same issues with long beer lines and warm beer. hence the glycol system which you could fit in under your sink. you could then have the beer unit (dead fridge freezer whatever) out the back in the dead space under the ree for ewasy access and just 'insulate' the lines so no light can get to the beer,. a bit of a pain.

unless you have the 'beer wall' on that exterior wall of tyour shed near the outdoor living area. that would be easy to do.

somone else might have a better idea.

 

[brettprevans]

:icon_offtopic: Hey mate, would love any info you have about building your woodfired oven..

Cheers,

Greeno

look at the better home and gardens magazine. they built one from scratch a few months ago. post move ill see if i can dig out the plans (missus has a subscription).

 

[cubbie]

depending on how deep the decking is you could drop a chesty beneath the decking (you'd never get it out again), have a hatch door so you could access it. but tyour going to have the same issues with long beer lines and warm beer. hence the glycol system which you could fit in under your sink. you could then have the beer unit (dead fridge freezer whatever) out the back in the dead space under the ree for ewasy access and just 'insulate' the lines so no light can get to the beer,. a bit of a pain.

unless you have the 'beer wall' on that exterior wall of tyour shed near the outdoor living area. that would be easy to do.

somone else might have a better idea.

I know nothing about glycol systems so will have to do a bit of research. Yeah I think the chest freezer under the decking in not an option, I may sink a rainwater tank however.


also
I just created a gallery with the construction of my pizza oven. The last photo does not show it quite finished.

 

[cdbrown]

One of those kegerator fridges holds 3 kegs and are reasonably small. Otherwise probably the smallest size chest freezer will hold 4 with a collar - if not using a collar then it's just wasted space over the hump (unless you gas bottle with reg can fit there.

I'm sure you can mount taps to anything bearing in mind the shank of the tap is long enough. I would suggest a tower mounted to the bench top though so that can be flooded and cooled. with a normal tap you'll only be able to cool the beer line up to the shank unless there are taps out there that are flooded (I've only seen fonts and not taps that are flooded)

60cm - you'll have to work out if that's wide enough to get through carrying a full keg. It probably is.

Insulate the lines to minimise cooling lose, put some shelter over the fridge to protect from environment - would need to be accessible as well.

With the glycol you're going to want a small freezer for that. Make sure your taps are nowhere near the bbq otherwise they'll be nice and toasty and your freezer will work overtime keeping the glycol cold.

 

[raven19]

Is there enough space for a keg system (I think about 3 kegs)?
Should not be a problem - more dependant on the fridge/chest freezer you plan on using

Could I get taps mounted on a stone clad brick wall?
Yes, should not be a problem - other than a longer shank there should not be an issue. You could use a normal shank and have a thin timber/metal facing at the tap locations

What sort of taps could I mount?
Any wall mountable tap. Celli, swing top, etc...
Fonts not good with that layout... unless you want them coming out of the bench rather than the wall

Is 60cm large enough for access?
How wide are your shoulders? You can lift a full 20L cornie with one arm, as such squeeze thru sideways it should be fine.

What sort of insulation/weather protection is required?
Glycol to keep the lines cool as per previous posts

Any other issues?
Heat from BBQ and House fire flu
Is that large tree existing?

Can you push the bbq around to back onto the fire spot, open up the area more?
Then go a chest freezer under your new bench top. You can fit the sink in still doing that too.

Another alternative, have it all located in the shed, then just run the taps and lines along the back of the wall to your beer wall.

 

[Greeno]

also
I just created a gallery with the construction of my pizza oven. The last photo does not show it quite finished.

looks awesome, where did you get the kit from??

 

[cubbie]

Any other issues?
Heat from BBQ and House fire flu
Is that large tree existing?

Can you push the bbq around to back onto the fire spot, open up the area more?
Then go a chest freezer under your new bench top. You can fit the sink in still doing that too.

Another alternative, have it all located in the shed, then just run the taps and lines along the back of the wall to your beer wall.

The tree is not existing and I was planning to not have a BBQ as depicted in the plan. As mentioned above only the house and pizza oven are fixed. I would like to reduce the size of that shed and it will be pretty full with bikes, brew kit and my fermenting fridge, so not sure about that as an option. The flu from the house will not give off any heat outdoors.

If I can mount the taps so that the fridge is butted right up against the wall I may not have a huge temp issue. Perhaps I could just have the keg system where the BBQ is.

 

[brettprevans]

hmm i didnt mean a gycol system as a flooded font system what i actaully meant is a temprite. like bars have. no need to keep the actual kegs cold, as the temprite instantly chills beer as it goes through the system. slight more expensive but it would work. and the unit is small so it would fit under a sink.

also if the tree in the pic isnt currently there, why not push the bbq/sink back to the fence and have a nice little 'food court'. ive done some exceptional MS paintshop work as you'll see in the attached pic. it might make more sense when you see what ive done. the lovely hot pink blob is where you could set up your beer system

 

[cubbie]

Great artwork!

Cheers CM2 I will have a look into that, sound like a good solution. The corner near were you have the beer system is the most logical spot for my hot water system, but I might be able to push it all back at least the rear of the pizza, oven.

Storing my kegs outside, in Perth and outside of a fridge might be an issue

 

[raven19]

If you can push the wall back towards the boundary like CM2's sketch that would certainly open things up nicely for you.

Another thing with building such permanent structures, is to allow for when things eventually breakdown.

Try not to limit yourself to a particular sized unit - whether it be a temprite, chest freezer, fridge, etc...

OT - If you can hard wire a gas outlet for your bbq too, saves on gas bottles and them running out. Can also be extended with the appropriate hose for your burner if using gas on your kettle during brew days. My FIL has done this and it works a treat.

Plenty of opportunity for bench space as per my dodgy sketch.

Maybe an opportunity instead if you open it up to go with a font and chest freezer under the bar/bench? sink could then be part of the bench...?

Or an upright fridge.

Or the tempright as per CM2's suggestion.

Can you utilise the narrow gap between the pizza oven and the fence for anything?

I think the world is your oyster with this space... :icon_cheers:



Edit: Sorry the Engineer in me is getting excited!

 

[TidalPete]

Cubbie,
Have been reading this with great interest & curious to know if there is any special reason for keeping that little strip of lawn at the back of your entertainment area?
Plenty of room there in the corner for a dedicated lawn (Beer) locker with insulated walls & roof with a whirlybird on top. A small lean-to over your external taps would keep the weather off them. Add a glycol system & Bob's your uncle. The whole setup would be only a few paces from the bar-b-que, etc.
Hope it all works out for you.

TP

 

[cubbie]

Cubbie,
Have been reading this with great interest & curious to know if there is any special reason for keeping that little strip of lawn at the back of your entertainment area?
Plenty of room there in the corner for a dedicated lawn (Beer) locker with insulated walls & roof with a whirlybird on top. A small lean-to over your external taps would keep the weather off them. Add a glycol system & Bob's your uncle. The whole setup would be only a few paces from the bar-b-que, etc.
Hope it all works out for you.

TP

Hi TP,

Yeah I would like to keep that area clear so that I have the option to park the car in the back yard (parallel park). At he moment I only have street parking and when I move out which will eventually happen i think having a parking space will be far more attractive to potential tenants.

I could potentially part the car straight in (having he front under the pergola)

The reason I am focusing on the current location is that I can do away with the built-in BBQ and that position is close to the back door and well contained. I would also rather visible areas from the house to be garden.

Nothing in the backyard is set in stone (other than the pizza oven) so I will play around with a few designs and see what fits best.

Cubbie.

 

[Leigh]

Using CM2's or Ravens design, if your heart was set on through the wall fonts, you could use an upright freezer parked hard up behind the wall and elevated so the lines come straight out and into the font, therefore no exposed lines.

 

[brettprevans]

raven had the same idea i was going for, i just didnt have time to do all the drawing before a meeting. it would very professional then. you could still have your hot water out there, just cover it with some trellice and grow hops of the trellice! or cover it up with some funky painted blueboard and make a feature out of it.

 

[cubbie]

Cheers guys for all your input. I am going to play around with the design and see what ideas I come up with.

I think I will put the kybosh on the idea of a feature wall with taps coming out. That is going to be a real PITA if the freezer breaks down.

Instead I think I will go with an under the counter freezer and a three tap tower. Just a question on the towers, do these have to be chilled? Particularly as it will be outside.

My initial thoughts is to shift the counter further back to the fence line, but not all the way leaving room for the hot water storage tank and room for me to store stuff. I am thin enough to get behind the pizza oven for access. Having the storage behind the counter will also allow me to have a smaller shed or the same size shed sans and bit of garden tools.

I had a search around for the dimensions of chest freezers and on average they were about 85cm high (plus a collar) and 65 deep, so I don't think bench height or depth will not be an issue. I imagine that my bench top will have to lift up or the freezer roll out from underneath.

Edit: Spelling