No Chill + Ag = High Ibu

[MeLoveBeer]

Sorry Tony, should have been more specific... it was Saaz B.

I've had great success dry hopping extract and partials in the past, but am still very green when it comes to AG (doing my best to learn fast from you guys though).

Am hoping to pick up a plate chiller from Beer Belly in the next couple of weeks, but like the flexibility of being able to cube my beer when I don't have the fermenter space (besides if everyone else is having success no-chilling, it must be my technique, equipment or just a noob mistake?).

In future guys, would you recommend brewing a recipe without dry hop additions first, then maybe add them the second time around if its lacking?

 

[haysie]

I reckon its a great thing you can be critical of your beer, no chilling and dry hopping first up is always gotta test. Look forward to catchin ya Wendesday night :icon_cheers: , dont be discouraged, bring it along!

 

[MeLoveBeer]

Look forward to catchin ya Wendesday night :icon_cheers: , dont be discouraged, bring it along!

Thanks haysie, will do.

 

[manticle]

In future guys, would you recommend brewing a recipe without dry hop additions first, then maybe add them the second time around if its lacking?

I reckon dry hop a recipe that will benefit from what dry hopping brings and leave alone the ones that don't. works with some beers, out of place in others. Also watch the amounts. I've heard 10g per litre can be a good rule of thumb. My recent case swapper beer probably pushes that rule closer to 15-20g per Litre but first tastes suggest it works.

 

[MeLoveBeer]

I reckon dry hop a recipe that will benefit from what dry hopping brings and leave alone the ones that don't. works with some beers, out of place in others. Also watch the amounts. I've heard 10g per litre can be a good rule of thumb. My recent case swapper beer probably pushes that rule closer to 15-20g per Litre but first tastes suggest it works.

Was planning on putting down a weizen on the weekend, but might put that on hold and repeat the GA with a smaller batch (I currently have a 15L fermenter with nothing on the go). I've got next week off work, so might have a play and see what I can come up with.

 

[Thommo]

Do the weizen and the GA. GO hard son.

The weizen will let you know if the fault is with your brewing practices or not, as you can make one with just a 60min hop addition. Not as much there to hide something, if you know what I mean.

 

[MeLoveBeer]

Do the weizen and the GA. GO hard son.

The weizen will let you know if the fault is with your brewing practices or not, as you can make one with just a 60min hop addition. Not as much there to hide something, if you know what I mean.

Not a bad idea :icon_cheers:

 

[mje1980]

When i went from crash chilling to No chill i didn't change my hop calcs. I noticed no difference at all in bitterness. Hope you work it out mate, keep at it.

 

[stuart13]

Not sure about your Golden Ale, but I made the mistake of making my usual Pilsner with the same weight of B Saaz (~7.8 AA) that I normally use of Saaz (~3.8 AA). All up about 120g.... Not what I expected, but not undrinkable either (if you like hops). I'm wondering if you did the same?

 

[husky]

Whats the theory behind no chill and higher IBU's? Is it simply that with the acids from the hops in a hot wort are still increasing bitterness? I always assumed that onve the hops are removed from the boil no more isomersion(i think) takes place? I will often remove hop bags and continue to boil to reduce boil volume as desired? Is this also going to possibly increase IBU's?

 

[MarkBastard]

The problem with no cubing isn't an increase in bitterness IMO, but that your late hop additions can be less affective.

What I do now is throw in flavour additions at 5 minutes, optionally another addition at flameout, then I let steep in the kettle for 10 minutes before racking to the cube, where I cube hop any aroma additions, and typically have to dry hop as well if I want some real aroma.

I'm thinking of doing the "chill for a bit before cubing" method that Ross does soonish, once I can put together an immersion chiller that will hook up to my laundry tap.

 

[MeLoveBeer]

Whats the theory behind no chill and higher IBU's? Is it simply that with the acids from the hops in a hot wort are still increasing bitterness? I always assumed that onve the hops are removed from the boil no more isomersion(i think) takes place? I will often remove hop bags and continue to boil to reduce boil volume as desired? Is this also going to possibly increase IBU's?

The theory as I understand is as you said, that the temp stays high enough for the hops to keep increasing bitterness.

Was thinking about it further last night and think I might push on with brewing the weizen; between the irish red I've got in the fermenter (that has no dry hopping) and the weizen (that has a single 60 minute hop addition) I should be able to nail the issue down. This time while brewing I'm going to be making more detailed taste notes throughout the process so I can identify the change catalyst.

Think I'm still going to pick up a chill plate, but want to be sure its not something with my process as well.

 

[Nick JD]

I find removing the hops before no-chilling gives more control and simplifies targeting an IBU figure.

 

[raven19]

The level of carbonation in the bottled beer will also have an effect on percieved bitterness.

My understanding is that more carbonation leads to more CO2 being dissolved into the beer, leading to a higher carboxylic acid level, hence a perceived higher bitterness from the extra acid. This is not based on Year 12 Chemistry, but on lengthy discussions over pints with Butters a few years back. :icon_cheers:

 

[MarkBastard]

The level of carbonation in the bottled beer will also have an effect on percieved bitterness.

My understanding is that more carbonation leads to more CO2 being dissolved into the beer, leading to a higher carboxylic acid level, hence a perceived higher bitterness from the extra acid. This is not based on Year 12 Chemistry, but on lengthy discussions over pints with Butters a few years back. :icon_cheers:

Yep, I thought my first ever brew was too bitter but it ended up being overcarbed.

I can taste the difference now.

 

[MeLoveBeer]

The level of carbonation in the bottled beer will also have an effect on percieved bitterness.

My understanding is that more carbonation leads to more CO2 being dissolved into the beer, leading to a higher carboxylic acid level, hence a perceived higher bitterness from the extra acid. This is not based on Year 12 Chemistry, but on lengthy discussions over pints with Butters a few years back. :icon_cheers:

That brings up another point of difference... the worst of the two brews is the first I've ever bulk primed (have always used the carb drops previously). Thanks for the clue Raven, I'll keep an eye on that.

Reckon I need to get someone else to taste these brews... should know more on Wed night.

 

[brettprevans]

moving on from no-chill

im suprised no one has piinted the finger at the armillo as a culprit. ive always found it to be bloody bitter in perception when young. a bit of cold conditioning seems to sort it out.

how young is the beer?

 

[MeLoveBeer]

how young is the beer?

Two beers, one 3 weeks in bottles and the other 4 weeks in bottles. Neither beer is mature, but still far more bitter than I would have expected at this stage.

 

[brettprevans]

thats about how younf my lasst beer with amarillo was (Doc Yardglass Lite but with amarillo and cascade). The aarillo is damn grassy/bittercitrus and not nice until it settles down.

as you've already decided to do, take it for tasting by another brewer. time and cold conditioning can fix a lot of things.

 

[MarkBastard]

Yeah I felt that way about Amarillo too I must admit.

It could just be carbonation/Amarillo