New 4wd - Decisions.....

[drew9242]

As a libertarian, these are my issues with urban 4wd and suv:

They are subsidized more than any other class of vehicle.
They rip up and destroy suburban roads more than anything else.

Therefore, I believe they should be available only at true cost, unsubsidized, and only allowed on sealed roads with a small truck license required. Purchasers should bear full cost.

I know this is going to attract some flames, but I do hope it may change some people's minds about them. There are far superior alternatives for 99% of what will actually be encountered.

For the rest, here's something you can get really upset about:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/National/4WD-dr...7586794495.html

Firstly how do 4WD get subsidized? In WA your license is calculated by the weight of your car. So if you own a heavy 4WD drive you pay more. Maybe its different everywhere else but we pay extra over here.

City roads are brilliant, try take a drive out in the country one day where roads never get looked at. They could be bad because of all the 4WD's. Or every one has a 4wd because its the only comfortable way do drive. So stop complaining about your poor roads when you can take Public transport everywhere.

I live in the country on the coast where everyone owns a 4wd or has owned one. If i lived in the city I would still have a 4wd to go out camping and do the things i love in this huge country we live in. However i would take public transport into the city, because it is a nightmare to take a 4wd into the city.

I used to get annoyed by all the mums with these big 4wd just to take their kids to school. But you try fitting 2 kids under 7 all in child seats (here in WA it is law to have all children under 7 in a child seat) plus 1 over 7 with all their gear in a small car. Impossible.

Any way i like to stick up for my 4wd's because a lot of people are car racist. Just because you see a few bad drivers in the city in 4wd's doesnt mean we are all like your stereo typical 4wd driver. Come out to the country and enjoy some amazing places in this country.

 

[Dave70]

As a libertarian, these are my issues with urban 4wd and suv:

They are subsidized more than any other class of vehicle.
They rip up and destroy suburban roads more than anything else.

Read your mission statement my omnipotent state hating friend, your thinly veiled prejudice toward 4wd vehicles comes dangerously close to infringing on my rights to freedom of expression.

Also, please provide data to support your claim that 4wd vehicles 'rip up and destroy suburban roads more than anything else'.
Real data, mind you, not some cherry picked environmentalist meta analysis.
If you've ever taken a stroll along some of the cobblestone streets of Europe that have withstood all forms of vehicular traffic - including metal shod wagon wheels - for literally hundreds of years you'd understand the fault lies in the roads construction, not the forms of transport upon it.

To the OP.
Buy a Toyota.
Ultra reliable, best re-sale.

 

[petesbrew]

4wd track
Hyundai excel
challenge accepted

 

[Dave70]

Wet lawn on a gentle incline
Hyundai excel
challenge accepted

..fixed..

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

I drove Landcruiser troopies for near 18yrs on the railways. They are like mountain goats in the tough stuff. If a troopie wont make it, nothing will. the trick was to stick with the skinny tyres and avoid putting wider rims and tyres.

The only flaw that toyota's had was their gearboxes would do output shafts in the gearbox. Stupid design as it was a gear on a splined shaft that would wear, you would be sitting at the lights , then all of sudden it would strip the spline and you went no where...other than that they are bullet proof.

Patrols are equally as good. Talking with many mechanics, Patrols and Cruisers are the only way to go. Both are bullit proof and easy to get parts for.

Patrols have better gearboxes and diffs, but Cruisers have a better engine... mind you, both their diesel dont need any work till they have about 1,000,000 kms on them.

 

[Rowy]

By the way Wodonga isn't the country just in case you think your entitled to an opinion :icon_cheers:

 

[white.grant]

..fixed..

Fair point, :icon_cheers:

 

[petesbrew]

..fixed..

Yeah true, the latest tyres I've got are ***** on a damp road.

 

[GuyQLD]

For the rest, here's something you can get really upset about:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/National/4WD-dr...7586794495.html

:icon_offtopic:

Ok I'll bite. I hope the "study" is a lot better than that article.

My god, that entire article is backwards. It's not "this percentage of 4wd owners are x..y..z". But more, people who fit this general stereo type have the means to buy what is generally a more expensive vehicle, don't need a study for that. It's about expendable income.

And last obesity figures I saw, 2/3rds of men in that age bracket are considered "overweight" regardless of if they own a 4wd or not. The stuff we take on face value. Holy ****.

And as to the other social commentary in that article, you name one tax payer in the 30+ cents bracket whole thinks social inclusion is a positive step and is happy to foot the bill, I think the list would be small outside of those directly involved.

 

[Dave70]

:icon_offtopic:

Ok I'll bite. I hope the "study" is a lot better than that article.

My god, that entire article is backwards. It's not "this percentage of 4wd owners are x..y..z". But more, people who fit this general stereo type have the means to buy what is generally a more expensive vehicle, don't need a study for that. It's about expendable income.

And last obesity figures I saw, 2/3rds of men in that age bracket are considered "overweight" regardless of if they own a 4wd or not. The stuff we take on face value. Holy ****.

And as to the other social commentary in that article, you name one tax payer in the 30+ cents bracket whole thinks social inclusion is a positive step and is happy to foot the bill, I think the list would be small outside of those directly involved.

The key to playing the game with 'studies' such as this is, to paraphrase Bruce Lee 'Absorb what is useful, Discard what is not'.

To that end:

For the chaps-
a male in his forties or fifties in full-time work with a higher than average income.


For the ladies-

They also watch their weight, and are less likely to be obese than the general population


Yep, I can live with that.

 

[Rob S]

Sold. Talked it down to $24,000. Stoked at the Patrol. Drove like a dream and immaculate condition inside. Loads of power but drove like a sedan. Imho a better ride than the 100 series I drove on Monday.

 

[Jay Cee]

Nice buy, and a sweet looking ride. I have been looking at older 4WD's, but under $10k, sadly there's slim pickings for a 4WD that's high off the ground - looking at a lot of soccer mum models on the suburban roads and the clearance doesn't cut it for our purposes. I want it for when we go offroad and on rough, often muddy dirt tracks, where conventional vehicles have a hard time. Plus I got bogged the other week in a track heading down to Oberon Dam in the poor little Corolla, so that got me a lot more interested Am i dreaming to think that a reliable older 4WD can be had for under $10k?

As a side note, that article is a bit of a joke when it says that 2/3rd of 4WD owners are overweight, considering that the World Health Organisation stated in 2007 that 67.4% of Aussies are overweight anyway. I'm sure the same could be said for Commodore or Falcon drivers.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

You can get a good buy for 10k.

Think Holden Rodeo wagon ( just an Isuzu ). They are a very capable 4wd and tuff as.....Just cause they are cheap, doesnt mean they arnt any good.

 

[Jay Cee]

I was looking at the Rodeo, low mileage on some of them too. But there's something about "4WD on-demand", where the vehicle detects when it's required, and the system switches to AWD by itself. Seems to get mixed reviews.

It should be clarified that I'm not going to get into hardcore off-roading but there are instances where I would want to be taking it down some very ****** potholed unsealed roads - the type in which both our corolla and previous VX wagon had to be driven at a snails pace, and plenty of undercarriage impact.

Loving the idea of a Cruiser, as it seems to be the weapon of choice for farmers, seeing them all around towns that service the rural communities of NSW, so local mechanic's knowlege & spares would no doubt be a dime a dozen, But they hold their price remarkably well, and its hard to get much under $10k unless unless its 25+ years old.

Sorry to Hijack the thread, Rob S, was waiting until you got your wheels to ask some timely questions.

 

[Dave70]

spares would no doubt be a dime a dozen,

If you shop at the wreckers, or somewhere like Don Kyatt spares, not to bad.

If on the other hand you'd like to 'keep the feeling' and go genuine Toyota, you may need a some quiet time alone and a Bex when the man tells you the price.

 

[Rob S]

I was looking at the Rodeo, low mileage on some of them too. But there's something about "4WD on-demand", where the vehicle detects when it's required, and the system switches to AWD by itself. Seems to get mixed reviews.

It should be clarified that I'm not going to get into hardcore off-roading but there are instances where I would want to be taking it down some very ****** potholed unsealed roads - the type in which both our corolla and previous VX wagon had to be driven at a snails pace, and plenty of undercarriage impact.

Loving the idea of a Cruiser, as it seems to be the weapon of choice for farmers, seeing them all around towns that service the rural communities of NSW, so local mechanic's knowlege & spares would no doubt be a dime a dozen, But they hold their price remarkably well, and its hard to get much under $10k unless unless its 25+ years old.

Sorry to Hijack the thread, Rob S, was waiting until you got your wheels to ask some timely questions.

Hijack away. You can get a Pajero, early 90's for well under ten grand. I had a 1989 turbo diesel lwb and it was good. A couple of trips to Fraser island and plenty of camping trips towing a trailer. It couldn't do the harder stuff, but it got us nearly everywhere we wanted to go.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Pajero is another good option.

80 series cruisers are also getting cheap, and they where a decent vehicle in the srcub

 

[Jay Cee]

If you shop at the wreckers, or somewhere like Don Kyatt spares, not to bad.

If on the other hand you'd like to 'keep the feeling' and go genuine Toyota, you may need a some quiet time alone and a Bex when the man tells you the price.

Load & clear. I'll focus on the Rodeo series. Especially after a conversation I had today about a spare 2005 Corolla key costing up to $450 if you wanted remote also! It was decided that I can unlock the door manually for less than half the price.

Hijack away. You can get a Pajero, early 90's for well under ten grand.

By the looks of it, you can get an early 2000's Rodeo for under $10k also. Without Spanish people laughing at me for driving a vehicle named Pajero.

See also the Yamaha Virago

 

[komodo]

I've both a Series 3 Discover HSE and a Series II GU Patrol 4.2T
I've also got an 08 Mazda3

Disco is larger, more comfortable. And mine being a HSE its kitted out with every thing you could ask for. It gets better ecconomy than the Mazda admittedly its diesel but its doing around 8.9L/100km

Patrol is indistructable. It'd been airborn, thrown side ways, pulled 3T, got 250,000km going strong.
Dropped a wheel a little while ago smashed up a disc - knocked out a few studs from the opposing side and drove it back about 30km to the factory to repair it. My fault - i didnt re torque the wheels after getting it off the hoist.
They still loose wheels there isnt a fix - alloys are most prone especially the earlier alloys and it's 99.9% of the time the passenger side. Usually after wheels/tyres have recently been changed/rotated.
I drive the patrol as my daily driver its got 285/75R16 MT MTZs on it, 4" suspension left with a super flex radius arm and a heap of superior gear including amarda remote reservior monotube shocks, over sized sway bars, saw bar pin disconnects, 3" Scotts Rod Exhaust
Its hauled me and the missus to explore the southern coast of WA, SA and west coast of Tassie as well as countless trips to vic high country and black top touring around Vic. Though I think future black top touring will be in the D3.
I'm shipping it to brisbane next week to start a 3 week trip to cape york with a hanibal safari 1.8m roof top tent and awning.
Get draws if your touring - ORS is the ones to get nothign cmpares and you can get them folded to suit you. Difta carback combo is also a good option to look at.
You've done well to get a TD42T for under 30k
The 3L is known for being a grenade - but its not as bad as many would like you to believe. Then again I personally wouldnt own one.
I own my GU outright and the plan is to keep it as a weekender. I'm selling the Mazda3 now that SWMBO has the disco and in 12 months time I'll get something as a daily for me and park up the GU at work (with 4" lift its a bit of a task to drive everyday. Hind sight I'd do a 2" and keep everything legal but id definately go the monos again they're amazing)

Get a 3" exhaust (around $1000) a snorkle ($600ish) and a tune (couple of hundred) if theres room in the budget get a boost and pyro gauge as well. It'll drive like a different car - especially when loaded. And you should return better ecconomy around town as its breating better - diesels love a shed load of air.
Second battery and an engel (ive a waeco CF-80 and I love it but I've highly modified mine - next time i'd spend the extra $ and get the engel and I'd stick with a 40L and get a second 40L to use as a fridge or freezer in the trailer for longer trips)


Smashed disc - the top is flattened after being ground off on the bitumen. Wheel came off at 60km/h and overtook the car draging its arse. Not the most plesant experiance. A few mate have done it - one mate has done it 3 times!


Getting it dirty - mates bucks weekend @ Mt Sunday

Get out there and enjoy it - heaps to see around Oz and you've got a capable car to do it in!

Edit: I kid you not seeing that photo of a stock TD42T for under $25k has me excited - might buy another one as a daily and park mine up sooner

 

[komodo]

under $10k rangie classic with a ford V8 (less common than a GM conversion but you'll have less issues because of the front mounted dizzy)

It'll go any where - its cheap. Coils all round. heaps of spares and you can change pretty much any body panel with a phillips head #2 screw driver. Also being alloy body you've no rust to worry about.

Other wise you'd going to be looking at a cab chassis of some form most likely and they all have leaf rear ends which aren't real great for articulation (though better for load carrying)