Ipa Or Ipa?

[Snow]

I just read this article on the emergence of modern IPA. The author lumps English IPA in the same style as American IPA and seems to indicate their development in modern beer markets as inherently linked. Now, I always thought English IPA was India Pale Ale and American IPA was Imperial Pale Ale, both two strong, hoppy beers but not in the same style.

I always thought American IPA originated as just part of the hop beer wars where a lot of craft brewers tried to out-do each other by just making bigger, hoppier beers, until it was no longer considered pale ale, but "imperial" pale ale, as taken from the descriptor for "imperial" stout. This is in contrast to English IPA of which we all know the story (legend/mythology) of it's origins in the Indian colonies, and the re-creation of the style as a salute to a bygone era of "better" beer, much like the re-emergence of porter as a distinct style.

Have I got this wrong? Are they the same style, or has the author just got his wires crossed, or is it just a grey area?

Cheers - Snow.

 

[jbowers]

They are both called India Pale Ales. They are widely regarded as different styles though, the English and American versions.

 

[argon]

I was under the impression that an AIPA was an;

American version of the historical English style, brewed using American ingredients and attitude.
BJCP 2008

 

[Nick JD]

I was under the impression that an AIPA was an;

And:

History: A recent American innovation reflecting the trend of American craft brewers pushing the envelope to satisfy the need of hop aficionados for increasingly intense products. The adjective Imperial is arbitrary and simply implies a stronger version of an IPA; double, extra, extreme, or any other variety of adjectives would be equally valid.

aka American Battery Acid Beer. :wacko:

 

[bconnery]

I just read this article on the emergence of modern IPA. The author lumps English IPA in the same style as American IPA and seems to indicate their development in modern beer markets as inherently linked. Now, I always thought English IPA was India Pale Ale and American IPA was Imperial Pale Ale, both two strong, hoppy beers but not in the same style.

I always thought American IPA originated as just part of the hop beer wars where a lot of craft brewers tried to out-do each other by just making bigger, hoppier beers, until it was no longer considered pale ale, but "imperial" pale ale, as taken from the descriptor for "imperial" stout. This is in contrast to English IPA of which we all know the story (legend/mythology) of it's origins in the Indian colonies, and the re-creation of the style as a salute to a bygone era of "better" beer, much like the re-emergence of porter as a distinct style.

Have I got this wrong? Are they the same style, or has the author just got his wires crossed, or is it just a grey area?

Cheers - Snow.

There's the IPA, that's the English one.

There's the AIPA, which is an American IPA.

Then there's the IIPA or 2IPA, or 'Imperial' IPA or 'Double' IPA which is the things you are thinking of in terms of intensely hoppy beers perhaps.
This last one doesn't have an A or American in front of it, probably because no one else has bothered/thought to do one

 

[mje1980]

Don't forget, the style guidelines are just that, guidelines. I doubt whether most breweries, micro or 500,000 litre commercial ones give 2 figs if their beer "fits" into the categories.

 

[Snow]

Don't forget, the style guidelines are just that, guidelines. I doubt whether most breweries, micro or 500,000 litre commercial ones give 2 figs if their beer "fits" into the categories.

Yeah I know - I just thought it was a case of a journalist not doing their homework. However the above posts have convinced me that IPA and AIPA are two varieties of the same (loose) style. I think Bconnery is correct in thinking I may have gotten the "imperial" moniker from the IIPA style.

Cheers - Snow.

 

[mje1980]

What? a journalist who doesn't do his homework?? Never! hahaha

 

[enuun]

I have just finished reading - Beer : the story of the pint : the history of Britain's most popular drink by Martyn Cornell. let me see if I can provide some insights.

The original IPA was brewed by Hodgeson's Brewery (Sadly they went out of business) for the officers of the East India Trading Company to sell to the Colonies in the East Indies. It was actually an "October" beer, a strong hopped beer brewed in autumn. and Long story condensed, Hodgeson pissed them off by trying to ship his beer on his own and they turned to the Burton on Trent brewers like Allsop to brew the IPA. Turned up Burton's water was well-suited for Pale ale brewing (Up to that point, they have been mainly brewing Porters and milds.) and the Colonies loved Burton IPA so much Hodgeson business suffered. And thus the English IPA was born.

Then along came the fellows who went to America and landed because their beer supply was out. Now at this point, there is blurred line between Ales and Beer. The former traditionally used to be only flavoured with herbs other than hops and the latter are of a Dutch/German origin and used only hops as flavouring. So we presume that the boys and girls who went to America were carrying IPA because of the need to preserve their drink for the long journey. Thus the first beer consumed on the soil of the Americas was actually an English IPA.

Fast forward to the 1980s. US hop varieties being bolder and stronger because of hybridisation and because of the economical need of using less for more. Micro's being sick of weak lagers began producing hoppy beers to showcase the differences, Real ale at that time had the reputation of being flat and weak. (How wrong they were!) So hops became important because improving malt profile can be expensive but hops are relatively cheaper. And micros were not making alot those days.

Fast forward to present. With more and more focus on craft beers, bolder and newer styles with more hops became the standard as the "arms race" continues. And thus the AIPA was born. It is a relatively new style actually. No one knows the original gravity of the English IPA or the hopping rates or the AA of the hops then but we can be sure it was nowhere as hoppy as the AIPAs of today.

heres a bit off his book. http://breweryhistory.com/journal/archive/...bh-111-063.html

*Edit with link

 

[super_simian]

No one knows the original gravity of the English IPA or the hopping rates or the AA of the hops then but we can be sure it was nowhere as hoppy as the AIPAs of today.

Umm, yes, yes they do. Go to Shutup About Barclay Perkins and you will find a metric tonne of analysis on historic beers, including multiple IPAs (from a bunch of eras, including the export heyday). The great thing about breweries is they write this stuff down!

Anyway, one thing that is often overlooked here is that original UK export IPA was not strong for its' day, about mid gravity for the times, but it was highly attenuated, probably by helped by a combination of time, heat and agitation (from rolling around on the seas.) So very dry and, yes, highly hopped and dry hopped. I can't find any figures, although they are no doubt around, but becoming so attenuated in the cask may have meant it was more highly carbonated too? That's just my fevered brain though.

 

[MarkBastard]

Firstly I read that article the other day, and I actually think it's a really good article. Better than most 'main stream' articles you read.

Yeah I know - I just thought it was a case of a journalist not doing their homework. However the above posts have convinced me that IPA and AIPA are two varieties of the same (loose) style. I think Bconnery is correct in thinking I may have gotten the "imperial" moniker from the IIPA style.

Cheers - Snow.

How I gather your original post is that you thought the following:

IPA in America stands for Imperial Pale Ale
IPA in America is a style directly descended from American Pale Ale.

I know it's already been answered and you understood the answer, but yeah American IPA stands for American India Pale Ale, and it's descended from English IPA. Though a lot of American IPA's seem to really just be Imperial Pale Ales so I can definitely see why you would think that.

I personally prefer American IPA's that are dryer with low or no crystal malts. If I was making a beer that was basically an American Pale Ale but higher IBU, higher alcohol content and a bit more malt back bone I'd be more comfortable calling it an Imperial Pale Ale!

Not that it matters, but interesting discussion.

 

[enuun]

That is an interesting link Super_Simian. Thank you for sharing. I cannot vouch for the accuracy of the OGs but they do look good. My comments are from reading from historians who have investigated the accounts. They do not give OG then as the hydrometer was not widely used until the 1850s. They go by quarts per barrel. And there was no way of calculating efficiency as the thermometer was used only in the mid 1800s. So alot of the present accounts are by guesswork only.