Hop Spider utilisation

[smcc3573]

I just recently finished off a session IPA based on the ingredients in the Beavertown Neck Oil session IPA. it has about 8 hop varieties in it so not a cheap brew. the hop schedule was as follows

Columbus 9 grams 60 minutes
Magnum 4 grams 60 minutes
Galaxy 3 grams 20 minutes
Centennial 4 grams 10 minutes
Simcoe 5 grams 10 minutes
Amarillo 5 grams 5 minutes
Centennial 5 grams 0 minutes
Galaxy 20 grams 0 minutes
Mosaic 20 grams 0 minutes
Simcoe 20 grams 0 minutes

dry hop schedule

Amarillo 10 grams
Centennial 5 grams
Galaxy 10 grams
Simcoe 20 grams
Vic Secret 10 grams

its low IBU but I was fully expecting a really hoppy beer. First tasting after 10 days bottle conditioning was ok but not really what I was expecting there is hop flavour but its not pronounced.

I recently purchased a hop spider and its excellent at keeping hop debris out of the fermenter but I am wondering whether its limiting hop utilisation especially with a big hop bill. I generally swirl it around the brew kettle but wondering whether when they absorb water and expand that they really arent in full contact with the wort.

anyone else have similar issues using a spider??

 

[slcmorro]

Hi mate,

If I added it up right, you used 90gms in the 'boil' so to speak. That'd be why you're not getting an overly bitter beer. Your 60 min additions only total 13 grams.
Are you using software to help you dial it up at all? The AA% of each hop will also be a factor in determining your issue here.

Without knowing your full recipe, it's hard to say precisely why it's not bitter but it's a pretty good guess that you didn't use enough bittering hops for the right amount of time just by looking at that.

I use a hop spider myself, and have never had an issue. The oils become soluble and would transfer from behind the SS mesh into the wort just as easily as wort does I would imagine.

 

[Charst]

His concern appears to be hoppiness not bitterness slc,
OP what yeast did you use?
And when in the process did you dry hop? At what temp?

10 days is still a young beer. Give it a little time.

 

[slcmorro]

Did you do a hop stand, or did you dump the hops in the spider at 0 mins and then effectively pull them out?

 

[smcc3573]

His concern appears to be hoppiness not bitterness slc,
OP what yeast did you use?
And when in the process did you dry hop? At what temp?

10 days is still a young beer. Give it a little time.


US05 Yeast was quite an active fermentation. I used my new stainless fermenter which I had cleaned and santised as per the instructions

I would have thought hop flavour/aroma subsides over time

dry hop in secondary at 20 degrees in my cellar

 

[smcc3573]

Did you do a hop stand, or did you dump the hops in the spider at 0 mins and then effectively pull them out?

30 min hop stand whilst cooling

 

[Charst]

Hops will drop over time but I don't think 10 days conditioning is enough time to get a good indication of a beer. Certainly enough dry hops for a pronounced aroma, how long was it dry hopped? In bag or loose in fermentor?

We're all the hops fresh? Smelt good?

 

[smcc3573]

Hops will drop over time but I don't think 10 days conditioning is enough time to get a good indication of a beer. Certainly enough dry hops for a pronounced aroma, how long was it dry hopped? In bag or loose in fermentor?

We're all the hops fresh? Smelt good?

was dry hopped for 6 days they were in stainess steel hop balls dropped in I find I need 2 as they expand.

I think for my next brew I will just drop in hops in the boil and dry hop, no spider or hop balls will just try to syphon carefully to ensure I only get clear beer into the bottling bucket

 

[Killer Brew]

It is an interesting question he raises. I'm not convinced I get the same utilisation using the spider as free balling the hops. My latest IPA I just threw them all in and dealt with the sludge. I wonder if anyone has done a reliable series of side by side experiments.

 

[indica86]

I find hop flavour increases over time - to a certain point.
A bottled conditioned IPA after two weeks is certainly NOT at it's prime.

Also as stated by others that is not a lot of hops. I have in a pale 110 grams flameout and 50 grams dry. I once did a 100g Vic Secret dry hop - that beer had flavour.

 

[fdsaasdf]

I've never hopped 'free' in the boil but I wouldn't be surprised if in many setups the hop spider / chute inhibits the utilisation of the hops. I used socks and tea balls previously, but for $35 the KK stainless hop spider is so much more convenient to use and clean.

With our setup we actually recirculate through the hop spider during the 20min hop stand after boil. Haven't measured the difference in utilisation but at the very least it results in less sediment out of the kettle. Note that this is a double or triple batch setup so our hop bills can approach half a kilo depending on the recipe.

Also the hop additions for the recipe posted seem quite low. I'm not sure that sub-5g hop additions will make any noticeable difference to flavour...

My hoppy session ales are usually around 5g/L somewhere between 5 and 15 minutes, depending on the AA, with dry hop no less than 2g/L for ~5 days.

 

[smcc3573]

I've never hopped 'free' in the boil but I wouldn't be surprised if in many setups the hop spider / chute inhibits the utilisation of the hops. I used socks and tea balls previously, but for $35 the KK stainless hop spider is so much more convenient to use and clean.

With our setup we actually recirculate through the hop spider during the 20min hop stand after boil. Haven't measured the difference in utilisation but at the very least it results in less sediment out of the kettle. Note that this is a double or triple batch setup so our hop bills can approach half a kilo depending on the recipe.

Also the hop additions for the recipe posted seem quite low. I'm not sure that sub-5g hop additions will make any noticeable difference to flavour...

My hoppy session ales are usually around 5g/L somewhere between 5 and 15 minutes, depending on the AA, with dry hop no less than 2g/L for ~5 days.

I have found that with larger hop bills and the spider you end up with an almost solid mass of hops in the bottom half of the spider. I am not sure how well the wort penetrates this even with moving it around the kettle. Commerical breweries seem to let the hops roam free so I will try. it just might require more care during transfer

thanks to all for the feedback

 

[Bridges]

How big was the batch? Doesn't seem like a lot of hops to me. My last brew I tried throwing the hops straight in rather than the sock I used to use, or the KK spider. I was just trying to cut down on cleaning after the brewing was done, their is definitely an increase in bitterness but that could be due to a little bit of hop matter finding it's way into the cube.

 

[fdsaasdf]

I have found that with larger hop bills and the spider you end up with an almost solid mass of hops in the bottom half of the spider. I am not sure how well the wort penetrates this even with moving it around the kettle.

Yes, the hop pellets especially will swell - though they also do this in socks or balls - this is part of the reason I put the recirculating pump outlet back through the spider so that this mass is broken up.