Have I Cooked My Brew?

[dairymaid]

I put a kit brew down on Saturday, the weather was warm and humid. By Monday there is snow on the mountains and the temperature in my fermenters dropped to 16C. to try and improve the temperature, I pulled out the old water bed heater, wrapped it round my two fermenters as I have a yeast fermenter going for my still - well the story ends with the temperature rising to 36C
Now what do I do? feed it to the pigs?

 

[jayse]

It depends really on how it tastes, i wouldn't go tipping it out without even having a sample, if the fermentation was near completion than theres a chance it my be fine.
Anyway taste it and see if its drinkable or not.

Jayse

 

[PistolPatch]

It's all good fun Dairymaid!

As Jayse says, don't throw it out. I'm not too sure at what level of brewing you are at so I'm going to assume you're pretty new.

What I would do, is buy a 25 litre pastic container (cube) and syphon the brew into that. Leave it for as long as you can possibly wait (like say 6 weeks) at hopefully around 18 degrees but don't get too worried if temps go a little berserk - you've got nothing to lose eh?

Take the time to install a tap on the cube and that way you can have a little taste of the beer as time progresses. As Jayse says, the taste of this will let you know if things have gone really wrong! (Chill it before you taste it if you are new to brewing.)

Having the tap will allow you to do a single bottle or 2 rather than spending all the time and effort in one hit to find the brew is no good. You probably wouldn't want to do more than one or two single bottles though as you'll be inviting oxygen problems here. So do a bottle at say 3 weeks, another at 5 and if OK then bottle the lot at 7 weeks if you can wait that long.

(I'm hoping the above is good advice but I think a second opinion would be a good idea as I don't bottle etc.)

To give you some hope Dairy, I did a Coopers Lager brew (1.5 tins. 250g booster and 25g Hersbrucker hops) a little while back as I'd never tried doing one. I then became extremely busy and left the brew in the fermenter for a month! I didn't even bother with temperature control after 5 days as I just didn't have the time. We had a taste at Ross's maybe a month ago and decided that the brew could actually work out OK. Just carbonated it this arvo (6.5 weeks after it's brew day) and it has the least sour taste of any beer I have done (negligible) but is quite high in bananas and boysenberries! My kiwi mates loved it and said it was better than some beer that they have back home! (Two was enough for me in one sitting - each to his own!)

Love to hear how it turns out. Fingers crossed for you!

PP

 

[mika]

I Third Jayse's suggestion.
Taste may be a little weird, don't hold much hope that it will turn out like what you wanted.
The biggest drama that you will face is that the 36 killed the yeast and it didn't have time to fully ferment. If that's the case, it won't carbonate and it won't improve with age... once that's established, then throw it to the Pigs.
But patience is the key, 6 weeks is not a long time to wait and Yeast is pretty hardy, more than likely it will be fine and it will just taste a little different.. no biggy, part of the game when brewing at home

 

[Uncle Fester]

Is it valid to rack it to a secondary to get it off the yeast cake, and dry pitch another yeast to complete any fermentation?

 

[razz]

Use your hydrometer first Mandrakar, then rack to secondary.

B)

 

[mika]

You'd have to check with a Hydrometer and see what the Sg is at the mo.
If it's still high, you can do as Mandrakar says... doesn't cost much to pitch another yeast.
Chances are the yeast went mad in it's final death throes, so you're never going to get the taste back, the fusuel(?) alcohols will already have formed. But if the Sg is still really high, it will at least ferment the beer out and allow you to carbonate it. (Remembering that it's the Yeast producing CO2 that carbonates the beer)
Guess it depends on how far you're prepared to go to try and save it.
But Beer is a bad thing to waste

edit: Pipped by Razz at the Post.

 

[dairymaid]

Thanks guys,

I am surprised that the beer tastes OK a bit on the green side still, It seems a bit flat as bubbles didn't last long when poured into a glass, the hydrometer reading is at 1005 ( I forgot to write down the reading at the start of the brew)

My main thought was that I had killed the yeast, and that the brew had not had time to finish fermenting

It seem that you have given me several options
One is not to give it to my pigs, (have you ever seen a drunk pig!!)
Two is to transfer the brew to another fermenter barrel and leave it to mature, and sample it along the way to see what's happening
Three is to rack it into another fermenter and throw some more yeast in!

Shall sleep on this info, and decide tomorrow what to do!

cheers Dairymaid

 

[Uncle Fester]

Thanks guys,

I am surprised that the beer tastes OK a bit on the green side still, It seems a bit flat as bubbles didn't last long when poured into a glass, the hydrometer reading is at 1005 ( I forgot to write down the reading at the start of the brew)

My main thought was that I had killed the yeast, and that the brew had not had time to finish fermenting

It seem that you have given me several options
One is not to give it to my pigs, (have you ever seen a drunk pig!!)
Two is to transfer the brew to another fermenter barrel and leave it to mature, and sample it along the way to see what's happening
Three is to rack it into another fermenter and throw some more yeast in!

Shall sleep on this info, and decide tomorrow what to do!

cheers Dairymaid

[post="120184"][/post]​

Options 2 and 3 are pretty much the same. If you have cooked the yeast, then it managed to pretty well ferment out before it died - God bless it!

I would assume that the yeast in the wort is now unviable. I would rack to secondary (to get it off the old yeast cake), and maybe add a little malt with some more yeast to allow some fermentation to re-commence. Then you will have active yeast in suspension when you either CC or bottle the beastie.

Even if the beer has some estery/fusel taste to it, then it will make a great beer batter for fish, or a great marinade for a roast lamb (Screw Tom Cruise!)

Cheers and (viable) beers,

M

 

[MVZOOM]

Wouldn't an SG of 1005 mean that it has pretty much run it's course? There can't be much more in it at all?

Cheers - Mike

 

[mika]

Persactly, but as Mandrakar's was kinda getting at, the yeast that was there might be dead (pretty good odds), so if you put it in the bottle with the priming sugar, it won't carbonate.
Rather than take that chance I'd follow Mandrakar's suggestion of some more yeast and a bit of Malt extract.

 

[dairymaid]

thank you all for your help
I will rack it off tomorrow add some more malt and some more yeast
and hopefully get something to drink!

I'll let you know in a few weeks time what happened

I shall also invest in a warmer set up to keep my beer going thru the winter, as our temperatures drops to freezing here over the winter, usually I just have to stop brewing
been to busy over the summer to get a winter supply down!!
cheers to you all Dairymaid

 

[PistolPatch]

Good plan Dairy! Just two things...

1. You mentioned above that the bubbles didn't last long and the beer tsted flat. I may have misunderstood but if you were tasting the beer straight from the fermenter, those are just little CO2 bubbles which will quickly escape as they have not been, 'forced,' into the beer under pressure. (This will be done through bottling.) So flat is normal and don't worry about it!

2. Have a look at Post #11 of Frequently Asked Questions for The New Brewer This may give you some ideas on keeping things warm. Even a light bulb with a $4 timer from Bunnings in a small cupboard works well. I should add that into that post actually...

Cheers
PP

 

[dairymaid]

thanks PP,

yep the beer came straight out of the fermenter, ok so I now know not to worry about that one

What I am not sure of is the racking, is this siphoned, or can I just open the tap!

you also suggested using the cubes is this in preference to the round cylindar shape

would like to know more about why you suggested the cube!

shall read more on the post you suggested thanks

 

[Weizguy]

<abbrev>
have you ever seen a drunk pig!!
</abbrev>

[post="120184"][/post]​

ROTFLMFAO I may see a few on the Sydney Pub Crawl next Saturday,...and they may see me.

Back to the topic. Either rack to cube or fermentor, or or rack to bottling bucket with priming sugar and new pkt of yeast. If it was me, I'd be bottling, and get another beer into that fermentor. Coz time's short, so brew quick and shorten the learning curve.

my 2 cents
Seth out

 

[Uncle Fester]

thank you all for your help
I will rack it off tomorrow add some more malt and some more yeast
and hopefully get something to drink!

I'll let you know in a few weeks time what happened

I shall also invest in a warmer set up to keep my beer going thru the winter, as our temperatures drops to freezing here over the winter, usually I just have to stop brewing
been to busy over the summer to get a winter supply down!!
cheers to you all Dairymaid

[post="120351"][/post]​

There may be no need for a heater my friend..... Unless you are brewing in an outdoor dunny in Jindabyne, the winter temperature drop shouldn't hurt you.


If your brewery maintains a temperature of 10 degrees or more during winter, then you can brew without a heater. Just adjust the yeast to suit the temperature that you have.

Lagers/Pilsners and the like will turn out spendidly if you brew at 10 degrees (with the correct yeast). There are many forum members who have spent deals of money to create brewing environments of this very nature.

If 16 degrees is the norm for your brewery in winter, then lagers are still quite viable, as are ales, if the right yeast is used.

I would suggest only getting a heat pad if your brewery goes sub 10 degrees, or if you were brewing wheat beers, and wanted the banana/clove characteristics of these. (Maybe Batz can comment here? h34r: )

We are blessed with ingredients for brewing that allow for almost every temperature variation.

The key is to keep the temp constant.


Brew on! :beer:

M

 

[PistolPatch]

LOL Seth!

What I am not sure of is the racking, is this siphoned, or can I just open the tap!

You can do both but if you use the tap, you should attach a piece of plastic tubing to it that is long enough so that it will reach the bottom of the container you are syphoning into. This prevents oxidation of the beer.

Personally I only use the tap to take hydrometer readings as I'm a little wary of infections starting in the tap. Heaps of people don't worry about this and never have probs. But make sure you spray up inside the tap with steriliser after each use.

I use an autosyphon ($18) as this solves a heap of problems. (I think Grain and Grape would sell auto-syphons.) I also tilt the fermenter the day before I'm going to syphon it so there's very little wastage.

you also suggested using the cubes is this in preference to the round cylindar shape.... would like to know more about why you suggested the cube!

The only requirements of the racking container are that it will hold your brew without leaving too much airspace once filled (oxidisayion again), that it is food-grade and air-tight. The cube satisfies both these and is only about $16 compared to the $30 or so for a fermenter. The square shape is also pretty easy to store. You don't need an air-lock either. Just leave the cap on the cube a tiny bit loose for a few days to allow any excess CO2 to escape. Afte that you can tighten the lid. Not sure if you know what cubes look like so I'll throw in 2 blurry pics for you!

The first is one of me syphoning a bleach solution from a fermenter into a cube. You can do this as well with your beer but as I said, add some hose to the tap so it reaches the bottom of the cube. (Oh and if you're doing it this way for beer, make sure the fermenter won't fall off!!!)



Finally, here's a pic showing how much beer you can get in 1 fridge using cubes. You can store them in these for about 3 months with no problems so this could save you some bottle space as well.



Finally, you're probably wondering how much more malt to add into the cube or whatever you decide to rack to. I reckon just use the same amount as if you were bottling it. As to how much this is, I don't know 'cos I don't bottle but the answer will be in that thread I gave you above for sure.

When I think back to my bottling days, I wish I'd known about cubes then. Storing a billion bottles is not fun!

Cheers Dairy,

PP

 

[dairymaid]

Thanks to you all for you help and good advice.

Weizguy, you are quite right of course, I should have just bottled the brew and got on with the next one!

PP> I love the cubes, what a great idea, we use them here mainly for carting water, but shall nowput them to better use.

Is that fabulous fridge in your kitchen?

Do your pour your beer straight from the cubes in the fridge?

My dairyfarmer would love to be able to pour his beer straight from the fridge.

Well I have just finished putting down a coopers stout, this ones for me and I am looking seriously of trying a partial mash next time, toughtrolly has posted a recipe, so I think i will give that a go.
Along with lights, and cuboards, and heating pads and Brunnings (which we don't have here) I have plenty to think about over the next few days before I hit the shopping centre

Thanks again just love this site, cheers/beers dairymaid

 

[PistolPatch]

That's great you have cubes on hand Dairy! Unfortunately the final process of your beer making is the forcing of CO2 into the beer which has to be done with a pressure vessel, these being either a keg or bottles. So, in my case, after say 6 weeks I syphon from the cubes into my kegs (at the bottom of the fridge which, yes, is pretty much in my kitchen!!!) You can do exactly the same, except syphon into bottles and add your priming sugar.

A great buy for you would be a Homebrewing Book as sometimes its hard to get an overview of the whole process from AHB. There is an online book, (search the net for, 'John Palmer How to Brew.') Some of this has too much detail but the first section would be excellent for the stage you're at now. It will give you a great overview.

And don't forget the FAQ For New Brewers thread I gave you above. That will answer a lot of questions for you as well.

I think that reading a book would definitely be the best thing to do at this stage so see if you can order one and while you're waiting have a read of John!

All the best,
PP