First Ag Cherry Broken.

[Hogan]

First AG went down today. Got some good results and made some errors. Nothing like on the job training.

This is how it went. I would appreciate advice on how to calculate the efficiency.

NORTHERN DISTRICTS PALE ALE: JW grain 4.6 kg - 3:1 ratio

Batch target of 22 lts.

HLT required volume 31 lts.

Mashed in with 14 lts @ 76c.. underlet.

Strike Temp - 66c. - hit it on the button.

60 minute mash - 30 minutes in gave it a stir and temp went down to 64c. Reckon it would have stayed at 66c. if I had not touched it.

End of mash temp 64c. run off to kettle - 9 lts.

STUFF UP - sparge temp run into tun at 72c. Should have been 78c. Grist temp went down to 65c and stayed there until end of sparge. There is obviously a penalty for this and I think it became evident in the Brix readings.

Volume from sparge - 16 lts. Hit target boil volume of 25 lts. right on the head.

Brix reading 10 - OG. 1041 - Estimated pre-boil gravity should have been 1043.

60 minute boil - final volume 22.5 lts. Brix reading 10.13 O.G. 1041.


Pretty happy overall - hit all my targets and would have been in line for a boiled lolly if I had'nt stuffed up the sparge temp. But will know next - and isn't that what your first time is all about.

Thanks to Linz for his pre AG tutorials and the excellent advice and guideance from this forum.

Cheers, Hogan.

 

[bugwan]

Top work Hoges! What sort of hop additions did you do? Varieties of hops?

Cheers

 

[Hogan]

Top work Hoges! What sort of hop additions did you do? Varieties of hops?

Cheers

Bugwan

Northern Brewer 10% - Bittering
Goldings 5.7% - Aroma and Finish.


Cheers.

 

[Batz]

Sounds like it went very well for your first AG,no turning back now Hogan

You should have seen GMK's first AG,it does not help to have 25 people watching,being use a little under the weather (we were tasting brews all day)......and not to mention that was the "kids on the roof affair" day.

Batz

 

[berazafi]

I calculated your effecency in beersmith

4.6Kg of grain, 22.5l @ 1.041 = 63.5% (well it may not but beersmith tells me it does)

Sorry i dont have the calculation for effecincy

Dave

 

[Hogan]

[quote name='berazafi' date='

4.6Kg of grain, 22.5l @ 1.041 = 63.5% (well it may not but beersmith tells me it does)

Sorry i dont have the calculation for effecincy

Dave
[/quote]

Thanks Dave that will do. I expect that the reduced efficiency would be linked to the low sparge temp?



Batz. I was on my own so the only one who heard me bitching and swearing were the dogs.


Cheers, Hogan.

 

[Linz]

Dang,

Franko and I were planning to drop down to your neighbours and hang over the fence saying things like " Nooo, I wouldnt have done that!", "tsk,tsk,tsk", "it'll do this time" and "Eewww, Ohhhhh" Just to unnerve you!!

You said you were gunna do it tomorrow(Tuesday)!!

 

[Hogan]

Dang,

You said you were gunna do it tomorrow(Tuesday)!!

I could'nt wait Linz - just had to get into it.


Cheers.

 

[Tony]

a few deg down on your sparge temp wont drop your efficiency that much.

I mash at 66 to 67 deg usually and drops to 64. sparge is typically 72 to 73 deg and i get 75% for a single infusion mash and 80 to 83% efficienct for a double decoction mash.

MOstly the efficience is determines by the grist. this is how well the grain is cracked. If its not cracked fine enough you will get great sparging times but shit efficiency as the water passes through without picking up the sugars.
If its too fine you will get a stuck sparge. Thats alway fun....... not.

Its a fine line. i built my own grain mill and over 50 AG brews have taught me what the grain shoul look and feel like to work well in the brew.

It should have relativly whole husks but not too whole, there should be lots of little bits of smashed up endosperm or the senter of the grain, and there should be a reasionable amount od flour.

I have cracked courser where you dont get the flour and you get great sparging times and clear wort but 60% efficiency.

a bit of time spent recirculating with a finer crack and a few rice hulls will give you 75% efficiency.

where do you get the grain cracked mate?

cheers

 

[Screwtop]

Congrats Hoge's,

I have little experience at AG but don't think the sparge will alter efficiency any where near as much as probs with other mash steps or grist ratio. Reckon you did good! Enjoy the fruits of your labour soon. From my short amount of experience, it will taste great first up, so much better than commercial beer. As you drink it you will analyse the outcome and time will change it's characteristics, you will make mental suggestions for improvement, that's craft brewing. Welcome!

 

[Voosher]

Congrats. It's a great feeling. I'm still a virtual rookie so the "kid in a lolly shop feeling" is still fresh in the memory.
Just a question regarding your pre and post boil Brix and Gravity readings. With 10% evap during the boil (25l down to 22.5l) I would have expected 1041 preboil to give you about 1045 post boil. You've listed very similar Brix and identical SG's.
On the efficiency front I agree with Tony. Crush finer than you dare. If/when you have your own mill just keep pushing it finer and finer until you start to worry about the speed of the sparge. And of course make allowances for those troublesome grains.
Cheers and congrats again on your continuing obsession.



Edit: Typo

 

[tangent]

Fellas, here's a great chance while you're playing in new ground. You've got experience with yeasts already, sanitation, racking, hops. you could take care of all that without really thinking about it.

What i did next, was buy a few bags of malt. I think my 1st real malt buy was 25kg or Maris Otter and 25kg of BB light ale. I made straight beers with both and blends as well. Really just experimented and brewered every weekend for about 2 months solid. I had a massive backlog of worts and i didn't care, I was just learning so much. There were cubes of cooled wort or jerrys of fermented beer everywhere. I had 1x18L keg running and about 300 longnecks with bottling was the last thing i wanted to do. I still had a shed full of extract brews and partials that now tasted to me something like a rubber glove or part(ial) of a rubber glove. I still can't touch one of them. So i never emptied the bottles and bought another keg instead.

AG, in the words of one short sage on this site gives you "total control". :beer:
It opens up an infinte range of options and really sorts you out as to what you really do like in a beer. And let's face it, some people don't really seem to like the taste of hops and malt. They want really cold, fizzy, slightly bitter dishwater with some lemon washing up liquid.
It gives you the freedom to try 100% pilsner malt or 100% Maris Otter and see what it's like before you commit to complex recipes trusting someone elses tastes.
That's the journey that all new AGer should take, because it's damn fun and informative. All of a sudden you say "Ahhh, that's why I don't really like/love beers that taste like that!"
At one stage all i had was Maris Otter and Fuggles, bummer eh?
Doubled my hop range later with East Kent Goldings

 

[Ross]

Well done Hogan, welcome to the obsession

With your sparging problem (I assume you are batch sparging?) Here's how I do it:
The idea with batch sparging is to try & get 2 equal runoffs into your kettle. Say you are looking for 34L boil volume & you have mashed in with 4kg of grain with 10L of water.
With the grain holding onto approx 4l of water you have 6L of available wort in your mash, so you need to add a total 28L sparge water to achieve 34l in your kettle. To get 2 equal runoffs, you therefore need to add 11L to the mash for your first sparge (11L + 6L = 17L) - I add this at 98c to get a good sparge temp in the high 70's. While the first runoff is happening allow your 2nd sparge water to naturally cool. By the time you are ready for your 2nd sparge addition (17L), it will have cooled a little & will give you a 2nd sparge temp of approx 80c. Sparging with water at these temps gives very good extraction.

Hope this isn't too confusing...

cheers Ross

 

[bindi]

On the efficiency front I agree with Tony. Crush finer than you dare. If/when you have your own mill just keep pushing it finer and finer until you start to worry about the speed of the sparge. And of course make allowances for those troublesome grains.
Cheers and congrats again on your continuing obsession.



Edit: Typo
[/quote]

I was having this same conversation with Screwtop yesterday about the finer crush I do [only just finer then him] so he is out with the feeler-gauge <_< and checking the gaps on my three roller mill :blink: as we trying some experimental brews.

Well done Hogan, the lost souls on this site are growing every day.

 

[Hogan]

Voosher - you were right about that brix reading. It was the first time I had done one and the 1013 should have been 1300 = 1.053 I did another test a few minutes after the first when the wort had cooled a bit and that was 1100 = 1.045 So even at 1.045 I am satisfied. Brewhouse Efficiency remained the same at 63.7% but the Eff into boiler was 70.7% and Into Fermenter was 69.9%. The higher OG now achieved makes me feel much better.

Ross - I had actually aimed at doing a double batch sparge but decided on the single as my tun easily dealt with the 16 lts required.

Tangent, Tony, Bindi and Screwtop - Thanks for the input re the grain crush. I had read posts before on this topic but it does not seem to strike home until you have actually felt the grain, seen the runoff and noted the speed of the sparge. I have not yet got a mill and this grain came from Gerard at Northern Districts Brewing.

Thanks all for the words of wisdom and support.

Cheers, Hogan.

 

[Voosher]

So even at 1.045 I am satisfied... Brewhouse Efficiency remained the same at 63.7% but the Eff into boiler was 70.7% and Into Fermenter was 69.9%. The higher OG now achieved makes me feel much better.

Thanks all for the words of wisdom and support.

A happy brewer made even happier?
Now that's a good day's work.

 

[PistolPatch]

Good on you Hoges! Sounds like you went really well especially for a first run. Good stuff. Will send you something to read that you'll enjoy regarding starting out in AG.

:beer:
PP

 

[poppa joe]

Regarding Bindi's Three Roller......
I picked up an old Two Roller washing machine mangle (Remember grandma's one).
Set it up with hopper...(Alas no grains to try).Hard to get things in Nowra..
Anyone done something like this...And will it work,,?????
Getting things together to give the AG a whirl....
Cheers
PJ