Building an HLT/sparge vessel - stainless steel pot or cooler?

[welly2]

Just to confirm this recirculation lark - you have a ball valve that comes out of the bottom of your HLT with a pipe that sucks out the water through a pump and back into the top? Seems like an easy mod to do. I couldn't quite tell exactly what was going on from S.E.'s photo but it looked a bit like that.

 

[Camo6]

My HLT draws from the tap through the pump and then back into the HLT about halfway up the vessel (because that's where there was a hole from my old probe). I use an elbow on the inside to direct the return to the bottom of the vessel on a 45 degree angle to displace the cooler liquid (and any salts that have settled). This means I needed an extra tap but it's all in the name of beer. Originally I just plonked the hose from the HLT back into the top of the vessel.
Hmmm. Maybe I need to post a pic of my setup... as much as I hate posting pics...

 

[Yob]

Just to confirm this recirculation lark - you have a ball valve that comes out of the bottom of your HLT with a pipe that sucks out the water through a pump and back into the top? Seems like an easy mod to do. I couldn't quite tell exactly what was going on from S.E.'s photo but it looked a bit like that.

You talking about the photo I linked?

Initially, I had a pickup on it but I've since removed it, the inlet of the pump (well, the hole in the pot) is about the same level as the ball valve, my recirc line is hard plummet, no tap, it never gets removed so no biggie.

I stopped adding salts to the HLT after a bit if a cleaning malfunction, pickup hasn't (yet) gone back in after that, though when I can be arsed I will re install..

 

[lael]

So where are the cold spots in people's hlt's? Is it if you are using a stick heater set like 10cm up in The pot and the cold spots are under the heater?

 

[S.E]

So where are the cold spots in people's hlt's? Is it if you are using a stick heater set like 10cm up in The pot and the cold spots are under the heater?

[SIZE=12pt]If you have a heat stick or electric element the water/liquor below it will not heat up properly as heat rises so you will get a cold spot below. Re circulating from the very bottom of the HLT should sort that out.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]I had assumed yobs HLT was gas fired so the heat would be coming from the very bottom to the top. If this is the case I can’t see that a recirculating will make any difference when the burner is on and very little when it is off unless the pump is churning the liquor vigorously.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=12pt]I would have thought the liquor would just channel down the side of the pot between the pump inlet and outlet. If a pickup is used the liquor would be drawn from below the level of the pump inlet so the coldest spot. [/SIZE]

 

[MastersBrewery]

For me a container that can be heated eg. urn or keggle type thing with some temp control is a plus, recirc just takes it that extra step for ease of use I alway stir my hlt before taking a temp reading and it has varied from brew to brew, so has efficiency from 75 -90%. hence for Christmas we have a 7% hefe

 

[lael]

Hey SE, mine is set up as 1v recirc, so I don't have the issue, just curious what it looks like

 

[S.E]

Thinking about it the liquor would only flow between the pump inlet and outlet when the HLT is full. Once the sparge has started and the level dropped below the outlet the liquor would be pumped over the surface and stir it up, is that right?

 

[Camo6]

I don't know about others but once I start the sparge I don't bother maintaining the HLT or HEX. I'm confident that the temp is uniform from recircing and my vessel and hoses are insulated. I probably spend 20-40 mins fly-sparging and my HEX probe shows minimal temp loss over this time.
I return about halfway up because that's where I originally located my old probe (another reason I needed to recirc as it was reading straight above the element). I angled the return down and to the side so that it a) creates a whirlpool effect and b ) displaces cooler liquor from below the element. Don't ask me the thermodynamics at play but I figure as long as there's turbulence created by the pump then it's a lot harder for a temp variation to occur.



Sorry to the OP for straying off topic and (reluctantly) posting pics.

 

[lael]

So cool spots are happening below the element? Would placing the heating element as low as possible in the pot reduce the problem without the need for recirculation?

 

[Camo6]

From my understanding it would definitely be better to have your element as low as practicably possible ( this has the benefit of utilising more volume too). But your temperature sensor is still only going to read the temperature of its surroundings. If you have it below the element it will read cooler, if it is directly above the element it will be affected by the temperature of the element itself, if it is too high in the vessel it will read hotter than the bottom and be exposed sooner blah blah blah.

If you don't recirc, like stated above, it's just a matter of stirring the HLT to stabilise temp before you take a measurement. But... if you have a spare pump and fittings... you'd be doing a disservice to the Beer Gods not to use them.

At the end of the day, it's not super critical but there's no harm in trying to eliminate variables if you're that way inclined.

My 2c anyway.

 

[S.E]

Can’t see any reason in fitting a dedicated recirc to my HLT as its gas fired so I don’t get any cold spot and I’m not really fussy about precise sparge temps anyway.

I do like the idea of recirculating to help dissolve salts though. Next time I brew Ill try recirculating from the existing ball valve back over the top of the HLT. If it works out ok it would be easy enough to fit a disconnect inlet at the top so i can recirc with the lid on then disconnect and pump to the mash tun.

Cheers

 

[S.E]

So cool spots are happening below the element? Would placing the heating element as low as possible in the pot reduce the problem without the need for recirculation?

I guess if using a keg with a domed bottom it would be difficult to mount the element low enough so recirculating would be helpful.