All Grain Spoiling? [no Chiller Method]

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If there's contamination in the air then it will be drawn into the fermenter as it cools - Fit a sterile filter into your airlock hole & this will no longer be an issue. I cool worts down in the fermenter often & never lost a brew.

cheers Ross
 
If there's contamination in the air then it will be drawn into the fermenter as it cools - Fit a sterile filter into your airlock hole & this will no longer be an issue. I cool worts down in the fermenter often & never lost a brew.

cheers Ross

slightly off-topic ross, but you have 23 beers listed as on tap in your signature....have you added a new font? any pics :)
 
slightly off-topic ross, but you have 23 beers listed as on tap in your signature....have you added a new font? any pics :)

i wish - a 2nd tier would be good :) ... they are all on tap, just not all at once B)

Cheers ross
 
If there's contamination in the air then it will be drawn into the fermenter as it cools - Fit a sterile filter into your airlock hole & this will no longer be an issue. I cool worts down in the fermenter often & never lost a brew.

cheers Ross

A piece of cotton wool soaked in Iodophor would also work fine using the same rationale.
 
So I guess the only thing I need to know now is how long can i leave a brew in a sealed cube before pitching ? obv pitching as soon as it cools would be ideal... but knowing my organisation that always wont be the case....

If you do it right, no chill wort will last for months and months and months, just like the wort packs at your LHBS.

1. Sanitise the f^$% out of the cube, its lid and the transfer hose.

2. All of the above should be food grade. The cube made of HDPE and the hose something that will stand the heat of 90C+ wort without deforming.

3. Rack into cube, eliminate air, seal immediately with a tight lid and turn the cube upside down (so the very hot wort enters the handle and the lid, sanitising them. The heat of filling will take care of the base, turn immediately while hot).

4. Wait until you're ready to pitch.

If something has gone wrong, the cube will swell. I've pitched no chill worts 3-4 months after brewing them. Take care of your cubes between brews. After [some arbitrary number] of brews, it's recommended to retire the cubes from no chill packing to prevent the chance of heat resistant spores building up in them. They can come in handy as cold conditioning containers.

Long live No Chill!
 
I know that it doesn't pay to assume anything, so I'm asking if you sanitised the fermentor before adding the hot wort. Always a great idea. Not being nasty here, just asking because it wasn't mentioned, and in case it's something you hadn't considered.

And, in the same vein, do you disassemble your tap and clean it thoroughly between brews?

Apart from that, it seems reasonable to suggest that you put some metho or cheap vodka in the airlock, and then plug with some dry or Iodophor-soaked cotton wool. Dry cotton wool should be OK if using alcohol in the airlock. Then screw the lid on tight, to keep the beasties out, and the only way they can get in is through the alcohol-filled airlock.

After all that, I'd recommend to pitch yeast within a couple of days of wort creation, to minimise the chance of contamination in a pseudo-sanitary set-up.

For a fair bit more confidence in your sanitation, use a cube/ jerry-can for a true no-chill.

To reiterate what others have said in many, many threads before: please search for more info on this site. I'd suggest reading more of the no-chill thread, or the no-chill spot in the wiki when/if someone puts it together, and the "no-chill in a fermenter" thread.

Best of luck with the next one. That's gotta put a huge dent in your enthusiasm for all-grain. A poor result with my first all-grain, due to a lack of proper equipment delayed my venture into the depths of brew-mania that comes from grain brewing.

Beerz
Seth :p
 
If you do it right, no chill wort will last for months and months and months, just like the wort packs at your LHBS.

1. Sanitise the f^$% out of the cube, its lid and the transfer hose.

2. All of the above should be food grade. The cube made of HDPE and the hose something that will stand the heat of 90C+ wort without deforming.

3. Rack into cube, eliminate air, seal immediately with a tight lid and turn the cube upside down (so the very hot wort enters the handle and the lid, sanitising them. The heat of filling will take care of the base, turn immediately while hot).

4. Wait until you're ready to pitch.

If something has gone wrong, the cube will swell. I've pitched no chill worts 3-4 months after brewing them. Take care of your cubes between brews. After [some arbitrary number] of brews, it's recommended to retire the cubes from no chill packing to prevent the chance of heat resistant spores building up in them. They can come in handy as cold conditioning containers.

Long live No Chill!


Further to that, my cubes spend their off season between brews in a spare bathroom filled with a solution of dishwasher powder and water.

Same rule applies for my fermenters between beers. I also store all of my hoses etc in the filled fermenter.

Fester.
 
I rack hot wort into fermenter immediately. then let cool for anywhere from 1 to 4 days. I have never stuffed around with my airlock just kept my bubbler on without any water. I have occasionly put plastic wrap over the bubbler as my bubbler lid is wonky. I have never had an infection doing no chill. I think the problm lies elswhere in your procedures. What is your cleaning regime for your fermenter? How do you drain the wort into your no chill container?


Cheers, JJ
 
I think I will have to invest in some cubes.

The cleaning supply place (across from the Kilsyth club) on the corner of Canterbury and Colchester road in Kilsyth sell them.
They have a few sizes to depending on your batch size.
Hope it helps.

- Luke
 
SicofVic - after you've cooled for 20-30 mins do you rack gently into the fermenter or let it splash?
Cheers
Steve
 
I know that it doesn't pay to assume anything, so I'm asking if you sanitised the fermentor before adding the hot wort. Always a great idea. Not being nasty here, just asking because it wasn't mentioned, and in case it's something you hadn't considered.

And, in the same vein, do you disassemble your tap and clean it thoroughly between brews?

Apart from that, it seems reasonable to suggest that you put some metho or cheap vodka in the airlock, and then plug with some dry or Iodophor-soaked cotton wool. Dry cotton wool should be OK if using alcohol in the airlock. Then screw the lid on tight, to keep the beasties out, and the only way they can get in is through the alcohol-filled airlock.

After all that, I'd recommend to pitch yeast within a couple of days of wort creation, to minimise the chance of contamination in a pseudo-sanitary set-up.

For a fair bit more confidence in your sanitation, use a cube/ jerry-can for a true no-chill.

To reiterate what others have said in many, many threads before: please search for more info on this site. I'd suggest reading more of the no-chill thread, or the no-chill spot in the wiki when/if someone puts it together, and the "no-chill in a fermenter" thread.

Best of luck with the next one. That's gotta put a huge dent in your enthusiasm for all-grain. A poor result with my first all-grain, due to a lack of proper equipment delayed my venture into the depths of brew-mania that comes from grain brewing.

Beerz
Seth :p

Hey Seth

Yep very careful with the santisation - fermenter / pipes all soaked for an hourish in iodophor prior to use. I must admit, i dont disassemble the taps each use - but i do ensure i run some iodophor thru them prior to use. I think i will invest in some cubes for my next brews.

As for the dent in enthusiasm - yes, but i'm too stubborn to let it go now! Besides, think of all the extra kilo's i won't have to shed due to me consuming those first couple of beers!
 
I rack hot wort into fermenter immediately. then let cool for anywhere from 1 to 4 days. I have never stuffed around with my airlock just kept my bubbler on without any water. I have occasionly put plastic wrap over the bubbler as my bubbler lid is wonky. I have never had an infection doing no chill. I think the problm lies elswhere in your procedures. What is your cleaning regime for your fermenter? How do you drain the wort into your no chill container?
Cheers, JJ

Hi JJ

Cleaning regime is the same it's always been - straight after use nappisan soak it for a day and use a soft towel to clean it... When I am about to use it, fill it with iodophor & also sterilise the lid/seal/bubbler etc. The wort is drained via a SS tap & food grade hose, which resides at the bottom of the boiler. Again, this is sterilised before use.

The only thing I can think of causing this issue - is the bubbler (filled with water). At the moment I have beer #3 in a sealed cube, so if this one doesnt spoil, i think i can safely attribute it to the bubbler.
 
Boy sounds like a strange one.

You do way way way more sterilising than me (I haven't sterilised my mash tun yet, in fact I don't sterilise anything pre-boil).

It is definitely what the earlier guys have said. If you put an airlock on a hot liquid as it cools the pressure will cause the liquid in the airlock to draw back into the wort (big drama).

Reverse thing happens with a cool wort in hot environment. In Canberra weather my brews will often let off a bubble or two around the afternoon as the temp climbs even though they have finished fermenting and are just waiting for transfer to cube/keg.

I use no chill method, but directly in my fermenter. My method is to get liquid into fermenter from boiler. I then put the lid on but I don't insert an airlock.

I have a clean cloth soaked in no-rinse (I use prox) which I then drape over the top of the fermenter.

I then leave the brew overnight and Canberra's winter night does the rest. 8AM the next morning and the wort is down to roughly 25 degrees.

I've done my only two all grains to date using this method and both have been fine (and incredibly tasty and drinkable :) ... god I love this all grain caper not going back to kits now )

Hopefully you can eradicate the infection in the fermenters!

Troy
 
Boy sounds like a strange one.

You do way way way more sterilising than me (I haven't sterilised my mash tun yet, in fact I don't sterilise anything pre-boil).

It is definitely what the earlier guys have said. If you put an airlock on a hot liquid as it cools the pressure will cause the liquid in the airlock to draw back into the wort (big drama).

Reverse thing happens with a cool wort in hot environment. In Canberra weather my brews will often let off a bubble or two around the afternoon as the temp climbs even though they have finished fermenting and are just waiting for transfer to cube/keg.

I use no chill method, but directly in my fermenter. My method is to get liquid into fermenter from boiler. I then put the lid on but I don't insert an airlock.

I have a clean cloth soaked in no-rinse (I use prox) which I then drape over the top of the fermenter.

I then leave the brew overnight and Canberra's winter night does the rest. 8AM the next morning and the wort is down to roughly 25 degrees.

I've done my only two all grains to date using this method and both have been fine (and incredibly tasty and drinkable :) ... god I love this all grain caper not going back to kits now )

Hopefully you can eradicate the infection in the fermenters!

Troy

Hey troy,
Thanks for feedback.
I am definately going to invest in a couple of cubes as suggested in this thread. Pouring beer down the sink is enough to bring a grown man to tears, so if the cubes can relieve these infections it's a small price to pay. I also want the option of pitching yeast at my leisure, and the cube option seems like the only way of doing this.

Doing another AG this weekend, so if this one goes nicely I will be a happy camper.

Cheers
 
Sorry to hijack Sic
Troy....after its cooled overnight in your fermenter do you pour into another fermenter to airate the wort?
Cheers
Steve
 
Troy....after its cooled overnight in your fermenter do you pour into another fermenter to airate the wort?
Cheers
Steve

No, I just pitch straight into the fermenter it cooled in. On both occassions it has "started" within a few hours and fermented out as usual.
 
No, I just pitch straight into the fermenter it cooled in. On both occassions it has "started" within a few hours and fermented out as usual.

same here :) - If using dried yeast the wort doesn't need aerating. Even with liquids it would appear that just aerating the starter properly is sufficient, though personally in this case, I'd want to aerate the wort as well.

cheers Ross
 
same here :) - If using dried yeast the wort doesn't need aerating. Even with liquids it would appear that just aerating the starter properly is sufficient, though personally in this case, I'd want to aerate the wort as well.

cheers Ross


There you go....learn something new every day. I think a no chill is on the cards for my next AG :ph34r: . Thanks Troy and Ross.
Steve
 
Great to hear you are stubborn SicOfVic. As Seth said, it's really dissapointing when a first AG goes wrong.

I always hear good reports of no-chill but only know the principles from a distance so my following comments could well be wrong...

I'm guessing here but I think no-chill could be spilt into two categories and often people are talking about the two different situations in the same thread....

1. You Want to Pitch ASAP or the Next Day: This would be desired by those who do not have a chilling device but can brew on a regular basis.

2. You Want to Pitch A Considerable Time Later: This would be desired by those who want to brew a lot of wort in a short amount of time that can be fermented later at their leisure.

Obviously, the best ways that need to be applied in the above situations are totally different. I would imagine that in the first instance, any use of a cube could be avoided.

But, I don't really know so what hope does a new guy have - lol?

In this thread, I can see at least three well-written and informative posts. I'd love to see you guys write an article on all this stuff. Maybe two - 'No-Chill Immediate' and 'No-Chill Long-Term.'

Yep, it'd be really good to see that.

Spot ya,
Pat
 

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