A Guide To All-grain Brewing In A Bag

[jordzan]

Sorry i didnt mean for that post to be so massive, im newbstastic allround. Forgot to ask, any recomendations for a place to buy the swiss voile at and which type they preffer.
cheers, soz again.

 

[Kingy]

swisse voile is available at spotlight for around 10 bux. Get the ivory colour or plain. If you get a coloured fabric the colours will leech into the beer.

As for the urn i think it would be ok . Im not experienced with urns but i think it would make your brew day fairly long as they take a while to heat up.

Im not even sure how they work ? :huh: do they have an element inside the pot (like a kettle)? If they do im sure it would burn the bag.

hope this helps,cheers

edit: You could get a aluminium pot from ALLQUIP for 100bux, a grunty burner for 150 (including regulater) from BEERBELLY and still have money left over. I get about 5 brews i think out of a 9 kilo gas bottle.

Definately better to do it this way IMHO

 

[PistolPatch]

Welcome to the forum jordzan :icon_cheers:

Your post wasn't too long (check out this one ) - much better explaining yourself straight up rather than playing 20 questions I reckon.

Yours is a hard question to answer. Kingy brought up two good points for a start. If you look inside, can you see an element? If so, that creates some issues though you can get around that. Also, as Kingy said, it will be a lot slower to heat up than using gas.

Three other things that spring to mind are, "What is the cost of that urn?" Secondly but of less importance is the tap. You may have to use a hose clamp to clamp a hose to that tap when emptying your kettle. Thirdly, how will you chill your beer?

At 40lts, you would need to watch this urn well to avoid boilovers as it is only just enough to do a single batch.

The alternative and more well-know equipment is a stainless steel pot (as Kingy mentioned,) a gas bottle, a burner and a regulator. Allquip is a great supplier of the pot. Beerbelly brewing (that kingy mentioned) also sells these pots and may well be able to match or better Allquip's price. He has done so in the past from memory.

If you do decide to go this route then I think a great size pot is a 70lt as it does single batches without any worry of boilovers but also allows you to do double-batches down the track with not too much extra work. Other people would advise to get the biggest pot you can get but the size and weight and evaporation rate of these can sometimes be a bit over the top.

So mate, check out the prices on beerbelly and have a think on what you already have (eg gas bottle and regulator) before you go and buy the urn.

Look forward to seeing how you go,
Pat

 

[Thirsty Boy]

I know at least one BIABer who uses a just such an urn, he swapped from a gas fired set-up and loves it.

Fill her up set the temp and go and have breakfast and a shower, you know its not going to overheat; and your water will be at just the right temperature when you get around to getting back to it.

Better yet, fill it with nice filtered water the night before, put it on a timer and by the time you scratch your arse and stagger out of bed in the morning, your strike water is at temp and you can mash in before breakfast.

I'd be tempted to turn it off during the mash and only turn it back on if you are there and stirring, otherwise you will get nasty hot spots in the mash. But... if you strike at the right temperature and wrap a bit of camping mat or a blanket or whatever around that thing, then you probably wont even have to add heat during a standard SI mash.

Kingy is right though... check if the element is exposed, if it is, you will have to rig up some sort of false bottom out of a mesh or stainless cake rack, I wouldn't want the bag to be sitting right on top of an exposed element that was running. Element not exposed... it'll be fine without the rack/mesh.

I'm exactly the opposite of Kingy on this one, if you are willing and able to go with the electric Urn, thats the way I would go. One major piece of gear and the bag.... done.

As a bonus, like everything else in BIAB... if at a later date you decide to move on and make yourself a more traditional 3 vessel brewing system, this will be the ideal HLT and still give you the ability to heat your mash water on a timer and knock an hour off your brewday.

Thirsty

 

[65bellett]

Jordzan, I currently BIAB using a 20 litre plastic pale with two 1700 watt elements taken from house hold kettles. I really like using an electric urn style system for BIAB because for me it makes it that little bit easier, all I need is a couple of power points and a couple of feet of bench space. The other advantage to this type of device is as Thirsty has already pointed out you can incorporate into a 3 vessel system when you choose to. When I am not using my pale/urn in BIAB I use it as a sparge vessel.

I do think that PP makes a good point about the tap though. You will need to put a hose on the tap so you can fill your fermenter.

65 b

 

[ikern]

Hey Jordzan,

A number of good pointers in the previous replies there. However, I can speak from first hand experience on what you are proposing. I also am botu-BIABing with a 40lt with 3000w element (but only paid $10.00 at a garage sale). If you want to preserve your heating element (unlike myself who is on his third), avoid heating during the mash.

I used an old stainless deep fryer basket with the handle cut of to keep my bag separate from the element which works fine. I also use the single camping mat to maintain a reasonable even temp. I was doing a brew late last year and had finished the mash and had cranked up the heat for mash-out when I noticed bubbles coming up through the mash that expelled smoke when they popped on the surface (rauch-pils anyone???? :icon_vomit: ). Thinking that it may have been a dodgy element due to being second hand I purchased another. 2 brews later the same again, that not-so-delicate smoky flavour.

I managed to rescue this brew (I hope) but what I found when I took the bag out and drained the wort was that there was a lot of starchy proteiny gunk in the bottom of the urn. This, combined with the dense grain bed sitting not far from the element, conspired to create very undesirable hot spots.

I have now invested in an over-the-side element which I use to make mash corrections and heat up for mash-out. I use both elements combined when heating to reach strike temp and also for my boil (I'm trying to find my haze cause and I get a nice strong roller with both elements).

With regard to draining, I actually found that one of the smaller dia food grade hoses from bunnings actually fits up the tap with the help of a little teflon tape round the top of the hose. As I just drain into a botu-cube, I'm not too worried about getting a high flow rate. I'll get around to putting a proper ball valve and tail in one day .

Cheers & Beers,

Soz.

 

[jordzan]

Thanks heaps for your replies fellas this forum is top notch, my biggest worry atm is the size, i can only see myself planning to do single batches atm but 40L isnt going to cut it is it ? would i be wrong to say that i could need upto 38 litres to make a single 22litre batch ? if so that doesnt leave alot of room to play or make mistakes, probably more so of the later but like having a good laugh at my own espense so its ok heh

Got a reply from Tobins, the unit has a concealed element which is great.The tobin unit is $340.0. which isnt much more than a 70 litre stainless steel robinox pot, i guess
youd need to get some sort of immersion coil cooler for the urn as the electronics are in the base of this unit so ice baths etc wouldnt work.

What would be the advantage/disadvantages between the aluminum pots and stainless steel ? figuring not as long a life and non even heat distribution maybe? wondering if the extra dollars spent is wearth it.

65bellet you only brew in a 20 litre container ??? how much beer are you making in your batches? great idea with the kettle elements do you keep running them until reached desired temp? then one here and there to keep the desired temp i gather?

Has anyone tried seperate immersion heaters for brew day with large pots? Found a decent looking one on esbbrewing for $145. Cheaper than gas bottle, regulator and burner. Im just really sketchy about using gas bottles inside for some sensible reason.
Immersion Electric Element Price: ;$148.50 [URL="http://www.esbeer.com.au/prod220.htm"]http://www.esbeer.com.au/prod220.htm[/URL]
This element will get your wort up and boiling quickly. It will keep the wort on a constant rolling boil. Great for the Craftbrewer making 22 liter batches.
http://www.esbeer.com.au/category38_1.htm

Thanks again fellas, would still be sitting here with a blank look on my face without you all.

 

[jordzan]

gday soznewb. How do you find 40L size for you ?? what size batches of beer are you brewing with it ? The element for this Tobin is covered up. Im not sure how a kettle type immersion heater works if the water cant get to it though :/ but that should make things a little smoother no? what sort of time does ure unit take to boil without the over the side element? do you think the over side element would be powerfull enough to work by itself ?

ide just tell everyone i was going for that smokey effect and there pallet just isnt experienced enough to enjoy it

 

[SpillsMostOfIt]

jordzan,

I use two of those immersion elements in a 75litre aluminium pot. The elements can be bought from Tobins for much less than at a Home Brew shop. I also use a nickel-pated brass ball valve from Bunnings to make life easier (life is too short to syphon).

I would recommend a 40-50litre aluminium pot and one 2400Watt immersion element. You'd get out of it for less than two hundred dollars. With the savings over what you're proposing, you would buy a Residual Current Device to plug the heater into and a few kilograms of grain. The former may save your life and the latter you can soak for 90 minutes or so before feeding to the chooks.

 

[ikern]

Jordzan,

The 40lt urn does me fine, I just fill up to around 36cm from the bottom and I get around the 23lt mark into the fermenter. But as others have said, if you're going to be paying full(ish) price for something and you want the flex of being able to up the batch sizes later on then you may as well go for the bigger pot to start with.

Cheers,

Soz

 

[arogers]

Just a word of advice to those thinking of buying direct from Tobins. You are likely to be able to get a discount if you buy their gear through one of their wholesalers instead of straight from them.

 

[Prawned]

Im thinking about going the BIAB way after reading though a bit of these 41 pages! Im just a bit unsure on how to make a bag.. Can i just buy a few meters of the mesh stuff and just fold it in half then get it sewn up each side, and a lip sewn around the top? also what kind of thread is used to sew it up?

 

[Thirsty Boy]

prawned,

Its not all that complex, its basically just a sack - you can more or less just sew it up like a pillow case. I'd make it a pillow case with the corners rounded off at the bottom, this makes the wort drain off in the middle rather than at the corners and over the edge of your kettle.

At the same place you buy the voile, you will be able to buy 100% polyester thread (just like cotton but really strong) buy the white stuff, its probably the cheapest thread they have there.

There are many fancy ways of stitching material for strength etc, I don't know which is the best... sorry. I just went with a straight seam that I could do myself. Use at least a double row of stitching, mine has three rows. You want it too be strong.

If you aren't up for the sewing... your local dry cleaner probably does "alterations" and could almost certainly be talked into sewing the bag up for you. If you are going to get a more expert person to sew the bag, you might consider a bag sewn up in the style of a sleeping bag cover. They turn into a lovely teardrop shape when they are pulled out of the kettle and things drain nice and neatly.

That probably didn't help all that much... maybe someone has a few pictures??

Thirsty

 

[3GumsBrewing]

Anyone been doing double batches using BIAB?

I love BIAB but am concerned that ramping up to a double batch would mean that it might be too hard to lift the bag out of the kettle (a cut down keg).
I am also considering using a waste paper bin I saw the other day in IKEA its big enough to do a double batch, it's holes are small enough that grain would not spill out of it, it would just require a few small holes drilled in the bottom and a handle of some sort.

Anyone else done it using something like that?

Cheers
DK

 

[captaincleanoff]

hi everyone

I'm about to attempt my first BIAB. Just got a 50l pot and 3 ring burner.. Got everything else I need too, except ingredients..

I am a bit confused with the suggested recipe (Ross's Schwartzbier). Is this the "Doc's Schwarzbier" as listed in the RecipeDB? If so, it all seems fine.. except that it says to use 100g of yeast!!!! Is this meant to say 10g?

And if anyone has any suggestions for a first time BIABer, please let me know!

 

[SpillsMostOfIt]

DK:

I've done a couple of double BIAB batches - the most recent being a big batch of Denny Conn's Bourbon Vanilla Imperial Porter. A huge grain bill, but the bag handled it without any worries. The lift wasn't an issue, because I used my Rope Ratchet SkyHook(tm)...


capt:

I expect the amount of yeast should be 10grams. If in doubt, check out:

http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

 

[SJW]

I like that pitching rate calculator, I have never seen that before.

Steve

 

[mikelinz]

Anyone been doing double batches using BIAB?

I love BIAB but am concerned that ramping up to a double batch would mean that it might be too hard to lift the bag out of the kettle (



Just did a double - 7kg grain, no problem lifting it out, hung it suspended over a bucket, to catch the residue.

 

[captaincleanoff]

so can anyone confirm that "Docs Schwatzbier" uses 10gs of yeast? In the recipe it says 100g! Is it meant to say 10?

 

[ikern]

so can anyone confirm that "Docs Schwatzbier" uses 10gs of yeast? In the recipe it says 100g! Is it meant to say 10?

Hey Captn,

Check Spillsmostofit's reply above, he did answer the query there. :icon_cheers:

Cheers,

Soz