1056 Nottingham and temperatures

[Lobsta]

Hey there,

I need a bit of advice on what to he here. I have a cheat's Dunkel fermenting at the moment using Nottingham at 13 degrees. Put down on Monday night 6/1. Main reason I went with that yeast was that I've never lagered before, it's a lot harder to stuff up with an ale yeast, and this beer needs to be drinkable as I am using it to pay our marriage celebrant (can you say awesomest celebrant ever?). I've read that Nottingham at a low temperature can act as on OK larger yeast substitute for simple lagers.

The other reason I went with this yeast is that I'm almost out of beer, and want to brew a easy, lawnmower, SWMBO-acceptable APA at the same time.

Thing is, I looked at the temp ranges for 1056 (for the APA), and it gives a bottom temp of 14-15 degrees. I want to get this second brew down as quick as possible before my free time dries up, so I want to put down the APA on Sunday 12/1. I only have 1 fermentation fridge that can take 2-3 fermenters.

So I have 3 options as I see it:

1. Pitch two sachets of 1056 to give it a better chance, keep at the lower temp to minimise the ale-y flavours from the Notty in the Dunkel, and hope that the 1056 lasts at the lower temp.

2. Up the temp to 15 and hope that most of the primary fermentation is out of the way for the Dunkel and that the increased temp won't play too much with the flavour.

3. Switch to Notty for the APA (so many things wrong with that sentence...)

I'm leaning towards 2. I haven't done a SG reading on the Dunkel yet, but just judging by the krausen, it's fermenting, but not at the quickest speed I've ever seen. I'll grab one when I get home and see where I'm sitting.

Assuming that primary is predominantly finished, how much will the extra temp play with flavours during secondary?

I want to avoid the mortal sin of using a European yeast in an APA, and also I've heard that Notty can strip a lot of the hop flavour at a lower temp, which is really the hero of my APA.

What are people's thoughts.

APA recipe below for reference:

Extrac APA:
250gm Caramel Crystal (steep)
250gm White Wheat Malt (steep)
3kg Light DME

40gm Cascade @ 60
15gm Williamette @ 15
15gm Cascade @ 0 (flame out)
15gm Williamette @ 0 (flame out)

American Ale Yeast (1056)

 

[dent]

I never got the point of fermenting ale yeast cold and trying to pass them off as lagers. It doesn't matter how cold you ferment an ale yeast, it isn't the same at all.

That being said, there is nothing wrong with a good clean ale ferment, but you don't need to ferment as cold as that to attain it - if you use a buttload of yeast and ferment at 15-16 degrees that will be as clean as it ever will be, and the yeast will not stall at an inconvenient time, plus it won't take as long. I would still recommend increasing the temperature to 18-20 once the ferment is done about 2/3rds the way through - don't let that notto play out at 13 degrees, there's no benefit to it, and the risk of off flavours remaining.

Nothing wrong with nottingham for APAs too. Really I'd base your decision on the amount of yeast you have available more than anything else.

 

[Lobsta]

Dunkel is down to 1.046 from 1.060. Tasting pretty good already too. So it's fermenting at an OK rate, but not trailblazing. I've got a double pack of 1056 in the fridge, so I guess I'll go with option 2 and bump up the temp to 15 until the Dunkel hits secondary then push it further to 18 to keep the 1056 happier.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

I used US05 (dried 1056 effectively) on a golden strong lager that got 2nd in QABC in 2012. The beer that beat it scored 1st in AABC IIRC.

Fermented it at 14 degrees.

I've had Notto to 11 degrees with no issue. Pretty clean.

It can be done. Not perfect, but a good substitute if time is the problem.

 

[dent]

Yeah, but cleanliness isn't everything - my belief, not that I have anything to back it up, is that a lager ferment is different chemically from an ale ferment - it isn't just a matter of esters and off flavours, but that actual beer itself is different. Not to take anything away from your competition success, but it is much easier to get a clean ale ferment than a clean lager ferment.

Personally I would consider it dishonorable to enter lager categories with ale ferments anyhow

 

[Northside Novice]

Really not taking the piss ...
I have brewed some great faux lagers from k+k using coopers standard lager tins and their yeast .(toocan) Extra long ferment (8 weeks at ambient [20*]bottled and fridged for another 4 weeks = nice clean crystal clear faux lager .
Sorry if I sounding rude but I feel over complicating things is , over complicating things .
Ok just read other replies. If for a comp (why ??) you should comply , but why ? Beer is beer . But if you feel the need , brew a true lager .
Tricked a good mate once with said brew ( bottled in 500ml German wheat bottles , labels intact and all around looking pretty shmick)
He would never enjoy one of my 'home brews' so I said try this beer then !
Oh what joy , this tastes really nice , I like a good German lager !
Hmm a wheat beer ain't a lager but I wiped his smug smile off his face when he realised a good beer when he drunk it !
Nice story bro

My story is , don't over complicate the necessity to brew great enjoyable beer . For fake lager I have found that time is your friend (your brewing/fermenting method
Needs to be / is a+) keep in fv for at least 8 weeks ! 12 is even better (yes 3 months) I have only bottled so can't comment re kegging , but after bottling , at least 2 weeks minimum at ambient / warmish/ not too warm ( damn you heat wave), then 4 weeks absolute minimum in the beer fridge to settle and crystal clear for pouring and enjoyment( trickery) about 3-4 month later

 

[stakka82]

Number 2.

Also props to willamette, totally underrated hop.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

The comp beer was a mistake and I ended up with no choice but to throw an ale yeast at it at low temps (and thought that if it's a mistake, I can experiment with US05's real life temp range).

I entered it in the closest category that my palate guessed it should be in.

Ended up being my best performed beer that year, though I didn't enter my pet category.