Wort Chiller Just Ain't Chillin

[Burt de Ernie]

going through Chemo at the moment so the little grey cells aren't working quite so good

Oh man....sorry to hear this and I hope get and feel well soon!

 

[dago001]

Maybe some of the google experts should go and buy an immersion chiller and give it a try instead of howling down those that own one and give their honest opinions to what is actually occurring for them.
A bloke asked for help - a few offered help - a lot argued about it - some did their research - op did his test and reported back his results - a few still argue the semantics of the result.
Give it a rest fellows - buy a chiller and turn the tap on - do your own tests and stop arguing theory.
Cheers
LB

 

[Black n Tan]

Are you serious LB? I have found this a good and robust discussion. Do you recall calling people that had a different view to you "Foundation member of the Flat Earth Society"? No-one here has treated you with the same disrespect. A lot of strong theory and practical data has been presented and I don't think it can be any clearer: increasing flow rate increases performance (time to cool wort), but is less efficient (amount of water required to cool wort). The engineers and scientists agree (I am a scientist BTW and own and use an immersion chiller). OllieB said his findings were to the contrary, but upon further clarification it became apparent that he was measuring the coolant temperature (efficiency) and therefore once again his observation was consistent with the theory. If you can produce some data that contradicts the aforementioned theory and practical data, I and the scientific community would love to see as it would turn a number of theories on their head. In the meantime I will continue to turn my tank water on full.

 

[dago001]

Nope - The OP stated early on that he tried to cool his boiling wort with his immersion chiller, at full flow from the tap and it took 30 minutes to get to 50 degrees. His subsequent test showed that a reduced flow rate gave him a result of cooling his wort to 25 degrees in 30 minutes. I never argued that the science isnt correct, because it is. But flow rate is important. And many people confuse flow rate with pressure. The test that was originally posted from the Zymurgy article was stating 2.5 - 3 US gpm (approx 11lpm ) flow rate. Im not too sure what your flow rate from your tank water is, but my flow rate is over 30 lpm from my mains. The whole exercise is to reduce the temperature of the wort as quickly as possible, and all the texts that I have read all state that the flow rate for an immersion type chiller has to be managed to get the best result. Counter flow chillers are a different beast. I use a plate chiller and get the best results from a higher flow rate, in fact a flow rate similar to what I used for my immersion chiller gives a very poor result.
The important issue that needs to be remembered is that while google is everybodies friend, we are all correct, have the relevant qualifications to discuss this (I'm a plumber by the way, drive a holden, prefer Fender guitars and tube amps) the OP wanted to cool his wort quicker.
Im not too sure how to measure "turn my tank water on full". But it doesnt seem very scientific to me. I thought scientists pushed the boundaries, experimented to determine results, questioned theories to find better ways, researched, but no they "turn their tank water on full" because google said so. How many lpm is that??? - but at around 10-11 lpm as per the zymurgy article, thats where my immersion chiller worked best. How did I work this out. I experimented with multiple brews to get the optimum results.
Turn your tap on until you get a full pipe of water coming out of the immersion chiller. That (IMHO) is the best flow rate for an immersion chiller.
Cheers
LB
OH, and sarcasm is lost on the internet.

 

[booargy]

(I am a scientist BTW and own and use an immersion chiller).

Being a scientist means **** all and what do you study immersion chillers. Bit like someone who studies medicine telling someone who studies climate that sea levels arent rising. Or because I am doing an electrical trade I know all about baking.

 

[StalkingWilbur]

Hahaha. This thread is hilarious.

 

[Burt de Ernie]

I feel like we are traveling in circles.

 

[Burt de Ernie]

LB
OH, and sarcasm is lost on the internet.

but you are right with this point....I am having a lot trouble pulling you're sarcasm out of you're trolling.

 

[Burt de Ernie]

Are you serious LB? I have found this a good and robust discussion. Do you recall calling people that had a different view to you "Foundation member of the Flat Earth Society"? No-one here has treated you with the same disrespect. A lot of strong theory and practical data has been presented and I don't think it can be any clearer: increasing flow rate increases performance (time to cool wort), but is less efficient (amount of water required to cool wort). The engineers and scientists agree (I am a scientist BTW and own and use an immersion chiller). OllieB said his findings were to the contrary, but upon further clarification it became apparent that he was measuring the coolant temperature (efficiency) and therefore once again his observation was consistent with the theory. If you can produce some data that contradicts the aforementioned theory and practical data, I and the scientific community would love to see as it would turn a number of theories on their head. In the meantime I will continue to turn my tank water on full.

relax...LB is just trolling you.

 

[wide eyed and legless]

Thanks for your consideration Burt de Ernie (21 days in another 147 days to go of feeling shit)
What I was wondering was the immersion chiller with the greatest surface area in the i.e. tightly wound coils would it be possible that this would work quite differently to one with loosely wound coils and less surface area, obviously the first would rapidly cool the wort
with a fast flow but would it also be right that the cooling liquid would come out a lot warmer than one with the less surface area due to the length of time travelling through the hot coil.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

I feel like we are traveling in circles.

No...its more of a spiral. We have completed the first loop in an immersion coil. And its going to spiral right to the bottom...

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Thanks for your consideration Burt de Ernie (21 days in another 147 days to go of feeling shit)
What I was wondering was the immersion chiller with the greatest surface area in the i.e. tightly wound coils would it be possible that this would work quite differently to one with loosely wound coils and less surface area, obviously the first would rapidly cool the wort
with a fast flow but would it also be right that the cooling liquid would come out a lot warmer than one with the less surface area due to the length of time travelling through the hot coil.

In theory, a larger surface area will chill quicker. Be it more coils or a bigger diameter tube.

 

[Black n Tan]

Being a scientist means **** all and what do you study immersion chillers. Bit like someone who studies medicine telling someone who studies climate that sea levels arent rising. Or because I am doing an electrical trade I know all about baking.

Agreed, my comment came off as arrogant and self-serving -_-, which wasn't my intention. It was meant to read in the context of LB accusing those that disagreed with him as being "google experts" who didn't even own an immersion chiller. I felt I was neither of those things. You don't need a PhD in immersion chilling to get involved and I am in no doubt that electricians and bakers can equally contribute to the debate. h34r:

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Indeed we can.

Here is my scientific conclusion.

You put immersion chiller into hot wort. You run cold water thru coil. Eventually the wort cools. Sometimes it takes 3 beers, sometimes 4.

Once wort is cool you put into fermenter.

 

[barneyhanway]

Lagers cool more quickly than ales though right? Surely we can all agree on that :blink:

 

[Dave70]

Lagers cool more quickly than ales though right? Surely we can all agree on that :blink:

Only if you paint your cube black - in accordance with Kirchhoff law of thermal radiation.


Doin a doppelbock this weekend.
Gonna no chill.

Just say'n..

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

That means stout chills quicker than pale.

Makes sense.

 

[pk.sax]

That means stout chills quicker than pale.

Makes sense.

Just to round it off, I take racial offence to that.

 

[Burt de Ernie]

Indeed we can.

Here is my scientific conclusion.

You put immersion chiller into hot wort. You run cold water thru coil. Eventually the wort cools. Sometimes it takes 3 beers, sometimes 4.

Once wort is cool you put into fermenter.

I only ever get 2 beers in. This must be because of the higher flow through my chiller!

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

I only ever get 2 beers in. This must be because of the higher flow through my chiller!

Some of us drink quicker than others.....