What Makes "fruity" Pilsiner Fruity?

[maxymoo]

I'm pretty new to beer tasting (sorry if this question is dumb!) ... and until recently i'd never tasted a "fruity" lager before. The ones I've tried now are: Knappstein lager, Mountain Goat Steam ale, Matilda Bay Bohemian, and Arctic Fox Lager. I understand that a traditional bohemian pilsener is meant to not have much esters, and I understand that the interplay between esters and hops-aroma can be very intricate and complex... so I suppose my question would be: are the beers I've listed here considered traditional pilsiners, with the fruityness coming from hops? or do they have an estery profile?

 

[bignath]

I'm pretty new to beer tasting (sorry if this question is dumb!) ... and until recently i'd never tasted a "fruity" lager before. The ones I've tried now are: Knappstein lager, Mountain Goat Steam ale, Matilda Bay Bohemian, and Arctic Fox Lager. I understand that a traditional bohemian pilsener is meant to not have much esters, and I understand that the interplay between esters and hops-aroma can be very intricate and complex... so I suppose my question would be: are the beers I've listed here considered traditional pilsiners, with the fruityness coming from hops? or do they have an estery profile?

Traditional Pilsners??

Knappstein - Definitely Not
Mountain Goat Steam ALE - not tried it, but i doubt it...not sure why h34r:
Matilda Bay Bohemian - not sure, don't think i've tried it.
Arctic Fox Lager - not sure, definitely haven't tried it.

There are many variations of 'Pilsners' available. To be honest, i don't know the stylistic difference between a german pils, a bohemian pils etc....
But, if you want to get a feel for a few good ones, they would surely be:

Pilsner Urquell - Legendary Pilsner
Trumer Pils - also very famous, delicious pilsner

These two IMO would probably be considered two of the most famous and historic pilsner of all times. Try 'em, you won't be dissappointed.

If you want a nice variation on a theme, try the James Squire Pilsner - it's very good. Has even beaten Pilsner Urquell to some awards in recent times....

 

[krusty_oz]

I've had fruity aroma's come off W34-70 when I fermented at ~18 (before I had temp control)

 

[super_simian]

Mountain Goat Steam ale

Not a pilsner. Not even a lager.

 

[ChrisECarpenter]

I'm pretty new to beer tasting (sorry if this question is dumb!) ... and until recently i'd never tasted a "fruity" lager before. The ones I've tried now are: Knappstein lager, Mountain Goat Steam ale, Matilda Bay Bohemian, and Arctic Fox Lager. I understand that a traditional bohemian pilsener is meant to not have much esters, and I understand that the interplay between esters and hops-aroma can be very intricate and complex... so I suppose my question would be: are the beers I've listed here considered traditional pilsiners, with the fruityness coming from hops? or do they have an estery profile?

Some things need to be cleared up here;

-Pilsners are a type of lager,
-Not all lagers are pilsners
-ales are not pilsners or lagers
-Only one of the beers you've named is a pilsner (Matilda Bay Bohemian)

lagers like Knappstein reserve have fruity hops like Nelson Savagnin which give fruity aromas.

some ales (I've never tried the Mountain Goat steam ale) get fruity-ness from warm ferments and estery yeasts, others use fruity (citrussy) hops.

Pilsners should not be fruity - they should have a biscuitty aroma from lightly kilned malts and a fair amount of spicy noble hop character, and no grassy/fresh hop character from dry hopping (this is my opinion - I'm sure there are many who disagree).

hope that helps.
Chris

 

[Synthetase]

Isn't the Mountain Goat steam ale a Californian lager? I thought what distinguished this style was a warm ferment using a lager yeast that has been bred to produce something drinkable fermenting at high temperature in the warm climate of California.

Either way, it's not a pilsner. Although I didn't like it much anyway.

 

[Pennywise]

:icon_offtopic: I've not tried the real Anchor Steam Ale, but I've brewed quite a few Steam Ales (you know with US Northern Brewer hops & Cal Lager yeast), one which was 3rd in last years Vicbrew & described by one of the US judges as one of the best beers they've ever had, and I'd almost garentee that MG Steam Ale is not anything like the real deal going by his comments, I even doubt they use a Lager yeast. Still a great beer in it's own right though, IMO

 

[super_simian]

Isn't the Mountain Goat steam ale a Californian lager? I thought what distinguished this style was a warm ferment using a lager yeast that has been bred to produce something drinkable fermenting at high temperature in the warm climate of California.

Either way, it's not a pilsner. Although I didn't like it much anyway.

No, it's not. It's called Steam Ale because it's an ale. Cal Common = Steam Beer, but Steam Beer is copyright Anchor Brewing Co. Mountain Goat Steam Ale is a brewers' joke, because it's the opposite of Cal Common/Steam Beer - instead of lager brewed warm, it's ale brewed cool. Really, does no one read up before they go around making pronouncements? It's there on their very own website among other places.

 

[Synthetase]

It wasn't a pronouncement, it was a question. Note the question mark. Thank you for clearing that up.

Incidentally, just because a beer is labelled something doesn't make it so. Victoria bitter is almost as far from a bitter as you can get.

 

[super_simian]

Yeah OK. I scanned over the question mark? Anyway, VB is bitter(ish). It's not a bitter, but if you trace the development of the brand, the name makes sense. And context plus history is knowledge. Or something like that. I think the main point is people shouldn't believe the label, but look at each beer in context. Point in case, as far as I'm aware, Cascade Pale Ale is, in fact, not an ale at all but a lager. It was an ale, but no longer (much like VB.) However, brand recognition is such a huge part of beer marketing that you can't just change the name of an iconic brand, or rather you don't, till you have to by law and obviously in Australia you don't have to call an ale an ale...at least not yet. By law.

 

[Synthetase]

Yeah, hence my confusion over the steam ale.

 

[Bizier]

Pencil moustache, spraytan and purple shirt. That would make any beer fruity.

 

[Dave70]

A little rainbow somewhere on the label?


Actually, more likley a yeast that throws these flavors at a certain temp and hop choice.

..not much help, am I...

 

[maxymoo]

ah cheers for the responses everyone

Some things need to be cleared up here;

-Pilsners are a type of lager,
-Not all lagers are pilsners

yes i think this was my confusion. well i'm in europe for a couple of weeks, had a few german pilseners at the pubs and i just nipped down to the supermarket and picked up a 6pack of pilsner urquel for 4.50 anyway i think i'm more clear now!