Small Beer From Second Runnings?

[PostModern]

I'm currently boiling a pale ale. Here is the grist:

4.5Kg Pilsner Malt
250g Dark Crystal
50g light choc

The kettle hit 25L at 1.044, which should boil down to a nice 1.048. Runnings were still coming out at 1.020, so i chucked some Munich (a bowlful?) and a handful of crystal and a pinch of choc into the tun along with a bucket of water at about 66C. There was still some hot sparge water in there, so along with the grain addition, it's now at about 67C.

The plan is to run the second wort out into the kettle and hit something along the lines of 1.030 or less, perhaps a half-batch.

Am I going to encounter astringency? Will the extra malt convert in that mash slop?

Basically, my question is, am I wasting time and gas to boil the second runnings?

 

[AndrewQLD]

PoMo, I can't see why you would have astringency problems, partigyle brewing is fairly common and that is just running a second sparge through the grain bed, so long as your gravity stays above 1.008 you should be fine. I would check the mash PH to in case it gets too high. I would keep sparging to 1.008 and stop there and that will be your final volume.

Can you update this thread with the results eg. gravity and volume ect. Oh and how it tastes too? I would be very interested.

Cheers
Andrew

Edit to ph level.

 

[PostModern]

Cheers Andrew. Definately will report back. The fermentation fridge is full, so this might have to be an ambient temp fermentation.

Just updating on the current status: it turns out this will be a decoction mash The tun is currently at 60C, so I'm going add some hot water when the HLT warms back up to about 70. I then plan to flood sparge it, as I've got my HLT transfer hose sanitising to run the first batch into a cube. I seem to have lost my normal racking hose...

Ah well, this experiment is some consolation for missing poker night.

EDIT1: The addition of hot water has brought the temp from 60 to about 65. I'll let it sit there for the rest of the mash. I also realise I can fly-sparge as the hose will be finished it's wort racking duty by the time I need to sparge this. L:G ratio looks to be about 3.5:1 (going by eye with a spent mash is difficult, but meh...)

 

[AndrewQLD]

PoMo,
I can see this would be nice and easy if you batch sparge, and even less chance of extracting tannins.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[PostModern]

Already started a fly sparge. Will see how she goes. Might even earn my TAB badge by dropping the hop bag back in

 

[PostModern]

Ended up with 1.020 in the kettle, about 20 litres pre-boil. I'm actually looking for a kid-friendly beer, ie 1-2% alc, so 1.022 should be good as an OG. I will add the old hop-bag, I think, plus a late addition of something...

EDIT: Strangely, the refractometer was still reading 5 Brix at the end of the boil, so it's 1.020 OG :\ Weird. Added the dregs of some NZ Hallertau Organic with 10mins to go. Wort was a bright copper colour after whirlpool. Nice. Will pitch tomorrow.

 

[Kai]

I am getting into the habit of partigyling whenever I brew a big beer. It saves wasting wort or boiling for hours, and with a couple small specialty grain additions in the second runnings you can make an entirely different beers.

I've only done two so far, and both of my 'small' beers have come out at around 1.045. Next brew will be another, biere de garde for the big beer and a mid-strength euro lager for the small.

 

[lonte]

I would check the mash PH to in case it drops too low.

at the risk of being pedantic, the risk of astringency and tannin extraction increases as pH increases, you want to keep it below 6.

 

[PostModern]

I am getting into the habit of partigyling whenever I brew a big beer. It saves wasting wort or boiling for hours, and with a couple small specialty grain additions in the second runnings you can make an entirely different beers.

I've only done two so far, and both of my 'small' beers have come out at around 1.045. Next brew will be another, biere de garde for the big beer and a mid-strength euro lager for the small.

I plan to make stronger beers soon for the winter, so I'll be able to make normal session beers from second runnings when I get into that cycle. Yesterday's was an experiment, and starting with a mid-strength beer sort of limited my options. Will see how this turns out as a once a week kid tonic and/or designated driver beer. I reckon I'll bottle it in stubbies provided it tastes beer-like from primary.

 

[AndrewQLD]

at the risk of being pedantic, the risk of astringency and tannin extraction increases as pH increases, you want to keep it below 6.

My bad, that was what I meant to say
post edited

Cheers
Andrew

 

[PostModern]

at the risk of being pedantic, the risk of astringency and tannin extraction increases as pH increases, you want to keep it below 6.

I'll be even more pedandtic and suggest it should be kept between 5.2 and 5.8

 

[PostModern]

This beer has finished fermenting. The S-33 has dropped clean out and it's bright enough to not need a secondary. Will bottle it today.

It tastes very "beery", like an Ordinary Bitter. There is a good balance of bitterness, even with just the spent hops and late aroma addition. It's quite dry and tasty. Would be a great designated driver beer. Colour is copper, like it was in the kettle. I'm quite surprised that such a low gravity beer is so drinkable. I've had beers _finish_ at 1.020!

 

[AndrewQLD]

Sounds Great PoMo, it will probably be a good beer to have on tap as a regular drinker. I will definately give this a try.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Kai]

I'll be even more pedandtic

pedantic

 

[PostModern]

pedantic

 

[Kai]

Sorry, that wasn't what I meant to say

Still haven't done my latest partigyle, the grain is sitting there crushed, taunting me and threatening to slack. Since you mention gravities though, I have done a couple of brews from the absolute final runnings pinched from a microbrewery mash tun and every time I've had horrible attenuation to the point I've thought I had a stuck ferment. However, each time it has turned into a stunning beer despite the figures that weren't 'textbook'. The only theory i could come up with was that the heavier sugars were the last ones to be washed out of the tun, and the final dregs were the more heavily laden.

My point, if I have one, is that it's a brewing technique that warrants recognition but definitely suffers from lack of attention. I'm looking forward to pursuing it more than once or twice this year

 

[PostModern]

I'll be doing one or two more of these this year too. Provided this one turns out to be drinkable once carbonated, that is. My problem is lack of keg space. I only have 5 kegs, so I figure I'll make small second runnings batches and bottle them in stubbies.

 

[Kai]

Or get more kegs.

 

[PostModern]

Coke(?) Pinlock. Nobody wants them but anyone who has them only sells them for a fortune. LHBS had some in, $80 each!!! Pff.

 

[Kai]

Darren had some recently, though I think that was almost a year ago now. And a little out of your area.

Ummmm. store the beer cold in cubes and keg it when ready.