Sanitization

[Damien13]

View attachment 59458

HAHHA awesome....

Yeah, Chuck Norris doesn't need to sanitise... Bacteria are way too scared of his fists....

 

[Damien13]

Of note RobbieP, most of us on here are a lot more relaxed and way less argumentitive...

Good luck with whatever cleaning/ sanitising solution you find.

Personally, I PBW then starsan. Just follow the instructions on the bottle and you can't go wrong... well, I guess you could... but it would be pretty difficult...

I frigging love home brew and home brewers... whooop whoop! Let's share the love a bit more...
C'mon guys... hug it out.... hehe

 

[jammer]

Wow. Awesome.
A concise reply by nath.

"Only producing homebrew here" comment amazed me.
I think maybe someone should take a touch more pride in their craft.
I know the majority of people on this site do.

I stick my airlock in my arse. Bubbles just fine.

 

[carniebrew]

View attachment 59458

GOLD. Chuck Norris' home brew doesn't get bacterial infections. Bacteria gets Chuck Norris infections.

Oh and RobbieP, whatever you do, DON'T turn the lights on or off during the cleaning of your equipment, or answer your mobile. You could die months down the track when drinking the beer you made that day, and nobody will ever know why: http://mythbustersresults.com/hidden-nasties

 

[bignath]

Hi guys,

Besides temperature control, sanitization is also a very important fundamental to get right in home brewing.

I still have all my kit in the Coopers Box, but i plan to sanitize it all before i starts (even though its not really necessary).

I plan to get into AG brewing as soon as possible, but i guess it doesnt make a difference what brewing method you use, sanitization plays an important role.

I have the following questions on the topic:

1: Can regular non-scented bleach be used to sanitize equipment?
2: How you do sanitize your equipment i.e. throw everything into your fermenter then let soak for a while, then rinse?
3: Whats the best agent to use for sanitization?
4: How do you sanitize PET bottles?

Look forward to hearing your feedback.

Regards,
Robbie

Hi Robbie,

apologies mate, seeing as how i helped derail your thread, thought i'd better add my answers to your questions. Sorry again...

Righto..

1. You CAN use bleach to sanitise your gear, but unless you dilute to an appropriate rate it's certainly not no-rinse, and in this scenario it can linger around for a fair while. This will require extended rinsing which kind of defeats the point of having a sanitiser.
I forget what the dilution rate is (it's here on AHB somewhere, others know what it is, but i've forgotten as i don't use bleach). When mixed accordingly, it is an acceptable non rinse method.

2. My method, and keep in mind i'm AG brewer so this is MORE applicable to cold side (post boil) of beer production:
At the end of the current fermentation and beer has been transferred to kegs or bottles, i immediately take fermenter inside and use hot tap water and a hot water pressure sprayer to blast away the scum ring, and yeast crub in the bottom of fermenter.
Once it is visibly clean, i give it a couple of maybe 5lt hot water rinses, swirling it around the fermenter and draining.
Then i refill with hot water and a lid's worth of unscented Napisan (or alternative). Fill it until it foams and as soon as the liquid under the foam overflows the fermenter, i turn off the tap. If i have any other items that need it, they get thrown in the fermenter too.
Leave this usually overnight (not because i need to, just 'cause there's no rush at this point).
Drain, and another quick hot rinse to get rid of Napisan residue. The water will "bead" down the walls of the fermenter by now and it looks all squeaky clean.
If i'm gonna refill it straight away, i do so in a clean, draft free environment in the house. Otherwise, i add a solution of my sanitiser (in my case a non rinse product called BacBan which is used in the hospitality industry) and glad wrap and store until ready. In which case i would then remove glad wrap, tip out as much sanitiser as i can, and then refill.

I use the above method for cubes as well as fermenters.

In case of my kegs (i don't bottle anymore), i do the same just without the hot water pressure spray as there's no scum to get rid of.

No cloths, no scrubbing just a simple process that works well - Provided i'm organised. Nothing worse than forgetting to clean a cube or fermenter for a week and then discovering it.

3. The best sanitising agent?
Well, i can tell you the most common around here is Starsan. A lot of people use it. I would too if i didn't have 5lt's of my stuff to get through. I have a mate who works in hospitality and catering distribution and therefore got me a good deal on the 5lt's. I've given away a litre or two to other brewing mates, and still will have many years of it left.....when it runs out though...

4. I keg.

 

[gunbrew]

Nath to avoid further misunderstandings you should put a warning with your avitar.
Perhaps something like:

"Hey F'wit, I'm berating you to help brewers"

Then next time your hacking into someone they will understand your a top bloke who is only acting this way to help brewers.

Cheers.

 

[squirt in the turns]

Otherwise, i add a solution of my sanitiser (in my case a non rinse product called BacBan which is used in the hospitality industry) and glad wrap and store until ready.

Something to add to this, speaking from personal experience: I don't know what BacBan is composed of, but Starsan is mostly phosphoric acid. Don't do the above with Starsan. It's brilliant and there are a lot of good reasons why it's pretty much the go-to sanitiser. However, phosphoric acid eventually decomposes into some flavour(s) of phosphate(s), which are essential nutrients for many types of plant and animal life. Hence Truman's earlier comment that residual foam can actually help yeast. Starsan solution keeps well in sealed containers, but exposed to the atmosphere it becomes ineffective pretty quickly (cloudiness is a good indication that your solution's farked).

I've left a fermenter sealed with a few hundred mils of Starsan solution, and come back to it a couple of months later to find something black and green growing in the liquid. I'm pretty fastidious about cleaning and didn't store the fermenter with any discernible soil remaining in it. Obviously there was a lot more atmosphere than Starsan in this fermenter. Unless I'd wanted to be wasteful and fill the whole thing with solution, I'd have been better off storing it dry, or with a bit of Napisan solution (what I now do) or a dishwasher tablet and water (what a lot of others do) in it.

Disclaimer: this happened when I was mixing Starsan with Gold Coast tap water. Even in a sealed container it would go cloudy after a couple of days. I now use demineralised water which keeps for months once mixed.

 

[NewtownClown]

I stick my airlock in my arse. Bubbles just fine.

Sanitised first, I hope. Your arse, that is.

 

[Truman42]

robbieP,

Have a listen to this Brewstrong podcast on sanitation. They talk to the owner of five Star chemicals, the manafacturer of Starsan. There is lots of good information on cleaning and sanitising.

Sanitation podcast

 

[drsmurto]

Something to add to this, speaking from personal experience: I don't know what BacBan is composed of, but Starsan is mostly phosphoric acid. Don't do the above with Starsan. It's brilliant and there are a lot of good reasons why it's pretty much the go-to sanitiser. However, phosphoric acid eventually decomposes into some flavour(s) of phosphate(s), which are essential nutrients for many types of plant and animal life. Hence Truman's earlier comment that residual foam can actually help yeast. Starsan solution keeps well in sealed containers, but exposed to the atmosphere it becomes ineffective pretty quickly (cloudiness is a good indication that your solution's farked).

I've left a fermenter sealed with a few hundred mils of Starsan solution, and come back to it a couple of months later to find something black and green growing in the liquid. I'm pretty fastidious about cleaning and didn't store the fermenter with any discernible soil remaining in it. Obviously there was a lot more atmosphere than Starsan in this fermenter. Unless I'd wanted to be wasteful and fill the whole thing with solution, I'd have been better off storing it dry, or with a bit of Napisan solution (what I now do) or a dishwasher tablet and water (what a lot of others do) in it.

Disclaimer: this happened when I was mixing Starsan with Gold Coast tap water. Even in a sealed container it would go cloudy after a couple of days. I now use demineralised water which keeps for months once mixed.

What is a flavour of phosphate?

Phosphoric acid breaks down spontaneously? How?

 

[bignath]

Something to add to this, speaking from personal experience: I don't know what BacBan is composed of, but Starsan is mostly phosphoric acid. Don't do the above with Starsan.

ok, to clarify, when i say store until needed... i mean maybe a week (two at the most) as my turn over means a "stored" fermenter doesn't stay stored for too long!

 

[mikec]

I believe Starsan solution becomes ineffective if left for long periods in tap water?
I think this is actually written on the bottle.
To make a solution that will keep longer, use distilled water.

 

[QldKev]

I believe Starsan solution becomes ineffective if left for long periods in tap water?
I think this is actually written on the bottle.
To make a solution that will keep longer, use distilled water.

I store some mixed in a spray bottle and use it for up to a month or so. I was always told if it doesn't go cloudy it's still active. Never had an issue this way. Don't know if it makes a difference mine is stored in the fermenting fridge.

I have given some mix to mate in a coke bottle he cleaned. It went cloudy within 24hours.

QldKev

 

[jyo]

If I use tap water it can cloud up in a day or two. Distilled water lasts for weeks.

 

[NewtownClown]

When I mix it with tap water it is instantly cloudy. however, pH tests show it to still be effective for weeks after...

 

[Nick JD]

What is a flavour of phosphate?

Tastes like when a seagull ***** in your mouth.

 

[NewtownClown]

Tastes like when a seagull ***** in your mouth.

:lol:

That's a benchmark I am glad not to have..

 

[Nick JD]

:lol:

That's a benchmark I am glad not to have..

Lorikeet is actually quite tasty. Especially if the Grevilleas are in flower.

 

[jyo]

Lorikeet is actually quite tasty. Especially if the Grevilleas are in flower.

:icon_offtopic:

That reminds me- last Summer we were down in Freo on the boardwalk with the kids when a seagull shat all over my head, face (getting behind my sunnies) and some went in my mouth. I tasted it.

It didn't taste taste like chips.

 

[squirt in the turns]

What is a flavour of phosphate?

Obviously (or possibly not) I was using the word "flavour" idiomatically. E.g., quarks come in different flavours, but I don't think anyone's ever tasted one. Perhaps I'd have avoided your wrath by using the word "type".

Phosphoric acid breaks down spontaneously? How?

Again, perhaps I should have used a word like "dissociates". Also, I didn't mention any "spontaneous" decomposition. I imagine it has something to do with reactions with the various compounds found in wort/beer/tap water. I'd be happy to be corrected/enlightened by our resident chemist. In fact, my feeling is that that would be more beneficial for all, rather than posting snarky rhetorical questions.