Recipe help- Peroni Leggera

[skelly22]

Hey All,

I would like to make some light beers for say when you have to drive, or don't want to write yourself off. After the hangover I inflicted on myself last friday week, I need some lighter options. I nearly died. It was a very ugly time to be around me last Saturday and it was 6pm before I was able to keep any solids or liquids down!!

Anyway, for these reasons I want to make a couple of lighter sessions beers. I'm thinking maybe Dr Smurtos Light amber or Docs Yardglass session light.

I would also like to do a recipe similar to Peroni Leggera, which is a 3.5%abv lager. Not sure if any of you have tasted it, but I reckon its quite a tasty easy drinking drop!! It would be an excellent session beer and okay for if driving after one or two also.

I found a recipe online for full strength peroni:
http://www.jimsbeerkit.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=23286#p259384
Peroni Birra
23 litres
Original gravity 1044

3250g Crushed lager malt
125g Crushed crystal malt
750g Flaked rice
15ltrs water for 'lager' brewing
5ml Irish moss
60+30g Saaz hops
15g Gelatine
60g lager yeast


Looking at the Peroni website (see image attached), they tell me that the Leggera is made from "2 row spring barley, 25% premium maize, triple hopped, made with soft water, and mashed with a "unique Special Decoction System" which must be just amazing.



My recipe so far is this:

Peroni Leggera
Lite American Lager

Recipe Specs
----------------
Batch Size (L): 20.0
Total Grain (kg): 3.300
Total Hops (g): 85.00
Original Gravity (OG): 1.036 (°P): 9.0
Final Gravity (FG): 1.009 (°P): 2.3
Alcohol by Volume (ABV): 3.54 %
Colour (SRM): 3.4 (EBC): 6.7
Bitterness (IBU): 31.6 (Average)
Brewhouse Efficiency (%): 70
Boil Time (Minutes): 60

Grain Bill
----------------
2.300 kg Pilsner (69.7%)
0.800 kg Flaked Corn (24.24%)
0.100 kg Carapils (Dextrine) (3.03%)
0.100 kg Melanoidin (3.03%)

Hop Bill
----------------
45.0 g Saaz Pellet (3.6% Alpha) @ 60 Minutes (Boil) (2.2 g/L)
20.0 g Saaz Pellet (3.6% Alpha) @ 20 Minutes (Boil) (1 g/L)
20.0 g Saaz Pellet (3.6% Alpha) @ 5 Minutes (Boil) (1 g/L)

Misc Bill
----------------

Single step Infusion at 69°C for 60 Minutes.
Fermented at 12°C with S189???
Recipe Generated with BrewMate



My thinking is as follows-
- Pilsner malt (no idea how this compares to a 2 row barley)
- 25% flaked corn/maize as per peroni website
- I've added 100g of carapils for head and body, and 100g melanoidin to simulate a bit of that super special unique decoction thing they got going on.
- Sazz hops added at 3 stages. I am unsure of my bitterness target. I find the beer more malty to my taste than bitter. How does 31IBU sound? I think the 5 min addition might add too much aroma. I think I will back it off to 10g at 10 min.
- Yeast- that is a big one. I am thinking S189 might be a suitable clean fermenting yeast. However, I notice in Dr Smurtos Light Amber there is some discussion around using a low attenuating yeast to retain body. This would also reduce the alcohol content. I think for a crisp lager S189 should still be suitable.

Overall I'm not sure how to take account in my recipe, and the affects it will have on OG, FG and desirable body, of:
1- mashing at higher temp producing less fermentable's, and
2- using a low attenuating yeast (if anyone can suggest a suitable lager one).

Any other thoughts on the recipe?

By the way, I brew in a bag in a 19L pot, stovetop.


Thanks in advance,
Shane

 

[Bizier]

Pilsner malt is two row barley, most normal malt is just two row barley. The other kind is six row, which basically can convert more adjuncts like rice or corn, which is why big light lager brewers might use it. Pilsner malt is what you want.

I would get rid of the carapils if you are mashing at 69, but whatever. It actually looks pretty sound.

One idea is to brew high-gravity and dilute to strength after fermentation, which I would put money on Peroni doing.

Just make sure your mash temp is well calculated, perhaps on the thick side, in case you have to add boiling water to hit quickly, and have that water ready.

 

[flano]

I added saaz at 0 mins once.
stuffed it..tasted like grass.

 

[yum beer]

That recipe will make beer far superior to Peroni Leggara, then again adding a late addition of saaz to a bucket of piss makes better beer than Peroni Leggara.

 

[Rurik]

When I have attempted a beer inspired by Peroni Leggera this in the past I went for an OG around the same as yours. I used 80% MEA pilsiner malt & 20% flaked maize. I bittered using Hallertu because I had some that was very good. I bittered to 20 IBU's and finished with .5g p/l of finishing hops split in half for taste & dry hop(not that I get this in the original). I could not get the attenuation I was after and was left with a huge yeast taste. I have since found out that the beer is brewed over gravity and then hydrolyzed. So I have brought a filter to strip the yeast out and I will brewer it about 20% over.

 

[RelaxedBrewer]

I added saaz at 0 mins once.
stuffed it..tasted like grass.

I have done this as well in a Pilzner. It got better with time but was never good. Lesson learnt!!

 

[Pickaxe]

I thought the Peroni recipe was:

drink any generic tasting euro-lager BUT
pay twice as much
drink it wearing a pastel ralph lauren polo shirt, a yellow jumper wrapped round your shoulders, boat shoes and a smug look of self satisfaction and superiority.
(Preferably at a golf or yacht club.)
take it back to the bar and suggest it's not right and doesnt taste like it does at home : "I drink it all the time".
Demand your money back.
Switch to XXX Gold or Carlton Mid Strength.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

That recipe will make beer far superior to Peroni Leggara, then again adding a late addition of saaz to a bucket of piss makes better beer than Peroni Leggara.

Almost verbatim what I was going to say.

 

[stakka82]

I had Leggera for the first time a few weeks ago when I had to drive. I hate Peroni and was not expecting much to say the least.


Have to say I was pleasantly surprised... yeah it didn't taste like much but what little taste there was was pleasant, a bare whiff of malt and hops. Would be a great driving beer on a hot summer arvo, served cold.

 

[skelly22]

Pilsner malt is two row barley, most normal malt is just two row barley. The other kind is six row, which basically can convert more adjuncts like rice or corn, which is why big light lager brewers might use it. Pilsner malt is what you want.

I would get rid of the carapils if you are mashing at 69, but whatever. It actually looks pretty sound.

One idea is to brew high-gravity and dilute to strength after fermentation, which I would put money on Peroni doing.

Just make sure your mash temp is well calculated, perhaps on the thick side, in case you have to add boiling water to hit quickly, and have that water ready.

When I have attempted a beer inspired by Peroni Leggera this in the past I went for an OG around the same as yours. I used 80% MEA pilsiner malt & 20% flaked maize. I bittered using Hallertu because I had some that was very good. I bittered to 20 IBU's and finished with .5g p/l of finishing hops split in half for taste & dry hop(not that I get this in the original). I could not get the attenuation I was after and was left with a huge yeast taste. I have since found out that the beer is brewed over gravity and then hydrolyzed. So I have brought a filter to strip the yeast out and I will brewer it about 20% over.

All thanks for your replies,

Bizier and Rurik, you both mention how brewing this over gravity might be the way to go. How does this help with the attenuation and taste? As is, what are the workings of it? That might even help me make a bigger batch size with my 19L pot.
So for example, I would ferment with less water than required say 20%, and then do the bulk prime with the additional water I need and use boiled and cooled water to prevent oxidisation. Does this sound about right?

Any thoughts on what bitterness I should aim for?

Cheers
Shane

 

[skelly22]

I thought the Peroni recipe was:

drink any generic tasting euro-lager BUT
pay twice as much
drink it wearing a pastel ralph lauren polo shirt, a yellow jumper wrapped round your shoulders, boat shoes and a smug look of self satisfaction and superiority.
(Preferably at a golf or yacht club.)
take it back to the bar and suggest it's not right and doesnt taste like it does at home : "I drink it all the time".
Demand your money back.
Switch to XXX Gold or Carlton Mid Strength.

Pickaxe... I was waiting for someone to get in with this! Have a look at peronis website...it almost describes exactly what you say! I will add a screen shot of what I mean tomorrow! http://www.peroniitaly.com/au/leggera/

 

[paulmclaren11]

Smurto's Light Amber is the one I would go with for a lighter drop - I have done it twice, the second version is carbing up as we speak and tastes awesome already and it's only 2.8%.

My version of Doc's light wasn't to my taste and probably wouldn't brew it again.

Be interested to hear how your Peroni Leggera attempt comes out - I normally drink it when I have to behave (or Rogers - but lately it isn't tasting as good as it once was....)

 

[dougsbrew]

I thought the Peroni recipe was:

drink any generic tasting euro-lager BUT
pay twice as much
drink it wearing a pastel ralph lauren polo shirt, a yellow jumper wrapped round your shoulders, boat shoes and a smug look of self satisfaction and superiority.
(Preferably at a golf or yacht club.)
take it back to the bar and suggest it's not right and doesnt taste like it does at home : "I drink it all the time".
Demand your money back.
Switch to XXX Gold or Carlton Mid Strength.

i would prefer to drink peroni over xxxx or carl mid anytime.
they do not serve peroni at my yacht club, i wish they did.
skelly your recipe looks good, id consider dropping the ibus down a bit though.

 

[skelly22]

Smurto's Light Amber is the one I would go with for a lighter drop - I have done it twice, the second version is carbing up as we speak and tastes awesome already and it's only 2.8%.

My version of Doc's light wasn't to my taste and probably wouldn't brew it again.

Be interested to hear how your Peroni Leggera attempt comes out - I normally drink it when I have to behave (or Rogers - but lately it isn't tasting as good as it once was....)

i would prefer to drink peroni over xxxx or carl mid anytime.
they do not serve peroni at my yacht club, i wish they did.
skelly your recipe looks good, id consider dropping the ibus down a bit though.

Paul, I will take your advice on the Dr S Light Amber and do that as my second option. I tend to put together 4 to 6 recipes and then buy everything in one hit online to save on postage. Then I cook 'em up over a couple of months.

Doug I definitely agree. I don't mind a bit of xxxx now and again but prefer the leggera.

See attachment below- I am guaranteed to be cool and sophisticated if i drink this. What more can I ask for.


I am going to drop the IBU's to 25 by reducing the 60 min addition and the carapils might go too, and take the 5 min back to 10 at 10. Ferment at 20% high gravity as suggested above. Then I'll give it a crack.

Also brewing:
Dr Smurtos GA (3rd time-great ale)
Dr Smurtos LA
Pilsner Recipe by Nick JD- best pils I've made- http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/38674-move-to-all-grain-for-thirty-bucks/page-32?p=828258#entry828258
And finally going to try a mid strength Irish Red Ale. I had the Redbelly in Byron Brewery recently and though it was great. I didn't actually know it was a mid till after. Anyway, the missus who doesn't drink beer though it was good too so I'll give it a go. Got any good red recipes I could start with?
I am also going to make some cider and try to keep it sweet with pasteurization and good luck/timing!