Peated Malt / Smoked For Scottish Ales?

[Back Yard Brewer]

First of all can someone tell me if peated malt is the same as smoked malt??

Moving along to my next question: I have just sat down and started to flick through/read a book called " Brewing Classic Styles" by none other than Jamil Zainasheff & John J Palmer. Of interest is the comment on page 131 that states peat-smoked malt should not be used in Scottish ales & Strong Scotch Ale. I have just brewed a beer from the book "Beer Captured" named "McEwan's No.1 Cham[ion Ale" which called for peated malt.Currently into its second week of fermenting and currently tatsing quite nice.(It has a touch of smoke which was not evident at the start) To top that off, after reading the style guidelines for SABSOSA 2008 one of the style guidelines for the Scottish Ale states that a mild smoky character may be detected.

What if any, do other brewers think about peated/smoked malt in beer. Obviously one would only use it in small amounts.

BYB

 

[jendres]

First of all can someone tell me if peated malt is the same as smoked malt??

Moving along to my next question: I have just sat down and started to flick through/read a book called " Brewing Classic Styles" by none other than Jamil Zainasheff & John J Palmer. Of interest is the comment on page 131 that states peat-smoked malt should not be used in Scottish ales & Strong Scotch Ale. I have just brewed a beer from the book "Beer Captured" named "McEwan's No.1 Cham[ion Ale" which called for peated malt.Currently into its second week of fermenting and currently tatsing quite nice.(It has a touch of smoke which was not evident at the start) To top that off, after reading the style guidelines for SABSOSA 2008 one of the style guidelines for the Scottish Ale states that a mild smoky character may be detected.

What if any, do other brewers think about peated/smoked malt in beer. Obviously one would only use it in small amounts.

BYB

I've tried three times now with peat smoked malt and I can say it didn't work. They came out with a chemical/medicinal flavour and at first I thought it must have been infected. Apparently this is a by-product of the peat smoked malt and I got it even with less than 30g in a 21L batch.

I'm thinking the smokiness comes more from the minerals in the water rather than the malt, because when I have detected the smoke flavour it is when I make some water additions.

 

[crells]

Last time I tasted Belhaven Scottish ale it had a slight background smoky flavour. I would add a touch if trying to replicate this beer.

 

[Weizguy]

I have read that the smokiness is developed from the yeast character, and that smoked malt should not be added to produce the flavour. I have also read that the character is not mandatory, and may only exist in the minds of some beer judges (who expect it, and hence taste it).

Peated malt is peat-smoked (whisky malt), whereas Weyermann smoked malt is smoked with German beech (I think) as Rauchmalz.

Les

 

[Back Yard Brewer]

I have read that the smokiness is developed from the yeast character, and that smoked malt should not be added to produce the flavour. I have also read that the character is not mandatory, and may only exist in the minds of some beer judges (who expect it, and hence taste it).

Les

The smokiness I can currently detect actually comes through only after swallowing the beer. It is detectable on the roof of my mouth and through my nose. Yes you are correct that the character is not mandatory for competition purposes. But in my mind it adds a little bit more complexity to the final product provided it is not over done. (small amounts) I used 60gms for a 38ltr post boil batch. I actually used Wyeast 1318/London Ale III. Recommended for Scotch Ales but not the forst choice for a Strong Scotch Ale but the results still are pretty good.

I have tried the Belhaven Scotch and quite honestly could not smell any smokiness. Will have to take more notice next time. I am not sure what other examples of Scotch Ale are in the market that exhibit that smoke character. Some other brewers may be able to shed some light.

BYB

BYB

 

[newguy]

For any Scottish style, peated malt isn't appropriate. The slight smoky character, as has been mentioned, is from the cool temperatures and the yeast variety.

FWIW, peated malt has been smoked over a peat fire while smoked malt uses wood - beechwood, apple, alder, etc.

 

[Back Yard Brewer]

For any Scottish style, peated malt isn't appropriate. The slight smoky character, as has been mentioned, is from the cool temperatures and the yeast variety.

FWIW, peated malt has been smoked over a peat fire while smoked malt uses wood - beechwood, apple, alder, etc.

Was wondering if you have made a smoked Scotch Ale? What temperature did you ferment at and what yeast was used. I would be interested in giving another method a go.

The malt I used is called peated-distilling made by Bairds.


BYB

 

[crells]

Last time I made one I used american ale. Obviously no smoky character, therefore next time I use this yeast for a scottish I will add some smoked malt to give it that character.

 

[Tony]

Peated Distilling malt if for making scotch whiskies............ i wouldnt use it in beer.

I use Rauchmalz in large quantities when making a smoked beer.

As for scottish ales.......... the somkey character should come from the use of roast barley that colours the beer, local waters (scotland) and yeast character (1728 and the like)

here are some BJCP quotes that speak for themselves

A low to moderate peaty character is optional, and may be perceived as earthy or smoky. Generally has a grainy, dry finish due to small amounts of unmalted roasted barley.

Although unusual, any smoked character is yeast- or water-derived and not from the use of peat-smoked malts. Use of peat-smoked malt to replicate the peaty character should be restrained; overly smoky beers should be entered in the Other Smoked Beer category (22B) rather than here.

The optional peaty, earthy and/or smoky character comes from the traditional yeast and from the local malt and water rather than using smoked malts.

And if that doesnt convince you, i brewed one a while back, ised about 1% smoked malt, sent it in to state comp and it got 3rd to qualify for the nationals............... the AABC judges gave me a bit of a roasting (excuse the pun) about the smokey character. I used lots of crystal and some smoked malt to replicate the maltiness and smoke i had read about but that was all wrong.

I have one on tap ATM made with pale malt, about 2% caraaroma and 1% roast barly. Its a nice beer, malty and sweet with a dry finish.

I just poured a cube of Scottish 70/- i had in a cube into a fermenter last night.......... i used closer to 2$ roast barley in this one and it will be up around the low to mid 30 ebc's. It dead set had a smokey roasty character to the unfermented wort.

In short.......... use Roast barley, not smoked malts to get a better replication of the style.

cheers

 

[Back Yard Brewer]

Peated Distilling malt if for making scotch whiskies............ i wouldnt use it in beer.

I use Rauchmalz in large quantities when making a smoked beer.

As for scottish ales.......... the somkey character should come from the use of roast barley that colours the beer, local waters (scotland) and yeast character (1728 and the like)

here are some BJCP quotes that speak for themselves

A low to moderate peaty character is optional, and may be perceived as earthy or smoky. Generally has a grainy, dry finish due to small amounts of unmalted roasted barley.

Although unusual, any smoked character is yeast- or water-derived and not from the use of peat-smoked malts. Use of peat-smoked malt to replicate the peaty character should be restrained; overly smoky beers should be entered in the Other Smoked Beer category (22B) rather than here.

The optional peaty, earthy and/or smoky character comes from the traditional yeast and from the local malt and water rather than using smoked malts.

And if that doesnt convince you, i brewed one a while back, ised about 1% smoked malt, sent it in to state comp and it got 3rd to qualify for the nationals............... the AABC judges gave me a bit of a roasting (excuse the pun) about the smokey character. I used lots of crystal and some smoked malt to replicate the maltiness and smoke i had read about but that was all wrong.

I have one on tap ATM made with pale malt, about 2% caraaroma and 1% roast barly. Its a nice beer, malty and sweet with a dry finish.

I just poured a cube of Scottish 70/- i had in a cube into a fermenter last night.......... i used closer to 2$ roast barley in this one and it will be up around the low to mid 30 ebc's. It dead set had a smokey roasty character to the unfermented wort.

In short.......... use Roast barley, not smoked malts to get a better replication of the style.

cheers

Thanks for the reply Tony,

A great in depth reply which answers all of my questions. It will be interetsing once this one is finished fermenting and bottled, since I used the peated distilling malt. As i said it has a nice smoky finish which is not over over powering. Again time will tell.

BYB

 

[Tony]

It will be a great beer, i love smoked beer.............. i have a rauchbier to go on tap next thast 40% rauchmalz.

But it probably wont be a true to style Scottish ale.

But if it tastes great and its not going to go to competition............. who cares

cheers

 

[Back Yard Brewer]

It will be a great beer, i love smoked beer.............. i have a rauchbier to go on tap next thast 40% rauchmalz.

But it probably wont be a true to style Scottish ale.

But if it tastes great and its not going to go to competition............. who cares

cheers

Well as a matter of fact I was considering going to comp with it. May have to review the category. Specialty class may be??

BYB

 

[MHB]

There are several beers that use Peated Whiskey Malt; traditionally they were continental Scotch Alesrather than Scottish Ales.
Adelscotts Biere Au Malt a Whisky with 80% peated malt and Eggenbergs MacQueenes Nessie with a massive 98% peated malt content to sight a couple of examples.
I suspect that McChouffe and several other Belgian beers contain peated malt to varying extents.

More recently several Scottish Ales have appeared that use peated malt; I think there is no doubt that St Andrews uses a fair dollop.

This is probably the wrong place to comment on BJCP Style Guidelines, but I suspect they are far from style defining in some cases they exclude classis examples of a style because that beer doesnt fit into some American preconceptions.

MHB

PS before anyone starts screaming.
I think the BJCP is doing good work and that its the best judging standard around, doesnt mean it cant be improved.
M